Using a midi controller with software to learn piano

What's your opinion on this? I really want to learn piano but I'm a broke ****. I am trying to learn it with books and shit (so i get the proper technique) but I don't know if a midi controller keyboard with ableton is alright for that?
I thought about something like the M-audio keystation 88es, but it is only velocity sensitive? I'm really short on money and I want to start as soon as possible... Below $300 would be cool. I want to use the thing with a synthesizer too (once I get that lol).
What are your thoughts on this? Any suggestions?

On a budget level any midi keyboard with at least 61 keys, and a good piano sound from a Rompler/ VSTi is a good start. Books are helpful I suppose for theory, but some type of visual aid (watch and then copy) in the form of a real person, youtube lessons or a piano teaching software program is ideal. Wish I had the time (read: patience) to learn at least some chords and stuff, do it before you find an excuse (ie. a girlfriend) not to lol...

If you're on OS X there are some nice piano teaching apps in the Mac App Store for less than $10. They usually have lessons where the keys light up or your shown chords and scales and then learn them in a "Simon Says" type method.

A controller keyboard and Live is as good a setup as any for what you want to do, although some tutorial software, certainly the OS X apps I mentioned will run standalone outside of a DAW program.

For $300 or under you won't get any hammer action keys, more likely semi-weighted "synth action" keys. But it's totally doable and usually less of an adjustment for people who haven't learned on real hammer action pianos. And hammer action piano style keyboards don't work so well for VST synths and things. So it's a compromise either way but probably synth action keys give you more versatility, you just have to get used to them not reacting the same as a real acoustic or electric piano.

There's always freeware VST's around and most free sampler players (Kontakt, UVI Workstation etc.) will have at least on piano patch in the free versions.

clint246clint wrote:On a budget level any midi keyboard with at least 61 keys, and a good piano sound from a Rompler/ VSTi is a good start.

Definitely will look into those, thank you.
Thanks for the advice guys.
By the way, what do you think about the m-audio axiom 61, is that good for what I am looking?

Ironic you mention the Axiom, it actually has almost hybrid keys. They are shaped like piano keys but have generally a synth action to them.

My neighbor had one, the keys themselves are on par with others in that price range. Honestly until you start spending $600+ you really don't find any keys that are that high end. But these mid level ones are definitely usable.

Metatron72 wrote:Ironic you mention the Axiom, it actually has almost hybrid keys. They are shaped like piano keys but have generally a synth action to them.

My neighbor had one, the keys themselves are on par with others in that price range. Honestly until you start spending $600+ you really don't find any keys that are that high end. But these mid level ones are definitely usable.

Okay man. hybrid keys are actually good, because I only want to learn how to play and read music in general. The end goal of this purchase is me playing synth for my beats.
Thanks for the advice man

My pleasure . The drum pads on the Axiom actually are pretty decent too and it's always great to have the faders and knobs plus transport controls. (The version 2 61 key Axiom at $299). You'll love all the mapping possibilities when you have some VST synths.

If you do have a Mac, GarageBand '11 has a section that trains you how to play keyboards and guitar.

http://www.apple.com/ilife/garageband/#basic-lessons

you should really consider and try beforehand the type of keys

if you're mainly interested in playing synths, i'd stay away from piano/hammered/weighted, even the semi-~ things have a different feel than organ/synth keys

im used to those, and whenever i play on a piano, it feels much heavier and almost in slow motion i'm guessing the other way around, you'd feel the keys are way too light

im looking at a controller right now, the only thing i know is that it won't be piano keys (theyre probably better for nuances in dynamics, but to me their 'timing' sucks)

AntonPD wrote:you should really consider and try beforehand the type of keys

if you're mainly interested in playing synths, i'd stay away from piano/hammered/weighted, even the semi-~ things have a different feel than organ/synth keys

im used to those, and whenever i play on a piano, it feels much heavier and almost in slow motion i'm guessing the other way around, you'd feel the keys are way too light

im looking at a controller right now, the only thing i know is that it won't be piano keys (theyre probably better for nuances in dynamics, but to me their 'timing' sucks)

Well...I think it's different if you learn keys starting with a weighted keyboard. If you noticed, some of the best keyboard players play both weighted piano and semi weighted synths.

I grew up with an acoustic baby grand in the house and it helped me get a better feel for playing in general. Then having to learn and play gospel music on a upright grand in the church only elevated the feel, my ear, and theory too. So when I took these experiences to playing organ and synths in a band, it made it feel as if I was Chick Corea or somebody. The keys felt so good it made me think I could do anything...especially soloing.

So if you're just learning keys, I'd say grab that inexpensive 88 key weighted controller and learn the full octave range of a keyboard that you miss with the smaller synth actions. Then add the semi weights as you go along.

I think I've decided to go semiweight... I'll still try it at a shop sometime!

Btw:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/midi-interfa ... 05651.html
This midi interface is good enough for hooking it up to the computer, right?

doctah wizard wrote:I think I've decided to go semiweight... I'll still try it at a shop sometime!

Btw:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/midi-interfa ... 05651.html
This midi interface is good enough for hooking it up to the computer, right?

Most MIDI controllers are going to have a USB port that will handle MIDI over USB. Although a MIDI interface like you linked to is always handy for when USB ports aren't available or you want to control some outboard stuff with no computer involved (Most MIDI controllers will need a DC plug in that situation)

Metatron72 wrote:

doctah wizard wrote:I think I've decided to go semiweight... I'll still try it at a shop sometime!

Btw:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/midi-interfa ... 05651.html
This midi interface is good enough for hooking it up to the computer, right?

Most MIDI controllers are going to have a USB port that will handle MIDI over USB. Although a MIDI interface like you linked to is always handy for when USB ports aren't available or you want to control some outboard stuff with no computer involved (Most MIDI controllers will need a DC plug in that situation)

yeah, everything is handy compared to nothing but do you think interfaces like that neusonik are any good? especially concerning going from keyboard to the computer
does the brand matter in choosing between those interfaces? i'd reckon it's something quite simple, so maybe brands matter less here

AntonPD wrote:

Metatron72 wrote:

doctah wizard wrote:I think I've decided to go semiweight... I'll still try it at a shop sometime!

Btw:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/midi-interfa ... 05651.html
This midi interface is good enough for hooking it up to the computer, right?

Most MIDI controllers are going to have a USB port that will handle MIDI over USB. Although a MIDI interface like you linked to is always handy for when USB ports aren't available or you want to control some outboard stuff with no computer involved (Most MIDI controllers will need a DC plug in that situation)

yeah, everything is handy compared to nothing but do you think interfaces like that neusonik are any good? especially concerning going from keyboard to the computer
does the brand matter in choosing between those interfaces? i'd reckon it's something quite simple, so maybe brands matter less here

I have an E-MU 2x2 USB interface, an older one it's a small plastic box that you plug a USB cable into. Creative Labs replaced the model with one of those that just has the cable like that Neusonik. I figure the box/cables themselves are interchangeable because your audio interface/DAW will be handling all your MIDI clock operations.

I've seen charts that show better MIDI timing and less MIDI jitter on interfaces that are more expensive (RME for example). So on my setup I have the E-MU interface and also a set of ports on a M-Audio wireless keyboard receiver, but any MIDI data that is sent through them is clocked by my audio interface, so I figure these USB to MIDI cables are largely interchangeable.

thanks, thats good to know