[BUG] OS2XL (v3.xx) & OS2: Legacy SEQ file issue

EDIT: Since originally posting this, I've discovered it is not the 'ALL' file that is the problem, it appears to be any situation where OS2 or OS2XL v3 is loading multiple OS1 SEQ files at the same time - be it as part of a project (with the ALL file) or just a 'folder' load where the folder contains no ALL file but multiple SEQ files.

I had a project file originally created on Akai OS, which worked 100% fine with 2XL version 2.27, as before recording the sequences, I had re-ordered all the pads in programs to match the JJ pad order (36, 37, 38 etc). All sequences played as expected in all OS versions, i.e. JJ free, OS1, OS2 and OS 2XL.

Just loaded this same project into 2XL 3.16, and the sequences are all messed up.

For example, track 1 is a DRUM track that should only feature events A01 (36). However, the loaded sequence has substituted these all to A02(37)

Track 3 should be A03 (38), however all events have been substituted to A06 (41)

To be clear, I am aware the 2.xx messes up legacy PGM format and sequences, but I completely re-did all our projects to account for this, simply be re-ordering the pads and re-doing all the sequence files. The resulting files work in all MPC1000's and can be created in Akai OS or free JJ OS.

The other thing is that if I save the sequences as individual SEQ files, these load up fine in 2XL 3.xx. It appears to be a bug in the ALL_SEQS file, maybe for all versions of 3.xx (I don't have any other versions to test in). I suspect it only affects projects created in OS other than 2XL.

After loading up the individual SEQ files and re-saving the entire project in 3.xx, the problem is fixed and the project file loads fine in both 2.xx and 3.xx.

I can only assume that it's a bug in the algorithm that converts and loads a 'normal' ALL file to the JJ 2XL format.

I've looked into this a bit further and it affects OS 2 as well. Ill try to make it as clear as possible.

First off, create a project in either JJOS Free, or JJ OS1, say a beat sequence that uses a single DRUM program for its sounds. Just make sure you first re-order the program's MIDI note assignment, so A1=36, A2=37, A3=38 - from now on, we'll call the a 'chromatic 36' program. Now record your beat into sequence 1. Save the project file. Now save sequence 1 separately as a SEQ file.

EXPECTED

As this project uses a 'chromatic 36' program, it should load into JJ OS 2/XL without any need to be re-jigged and the sequences should load fine.

ACTUAL

In JJOS 2XL v2.xx, this project loads as expected.

In JJ OS 2XL v3.xx, the sequence is messed up. However, if I then load the individual SEQ file I created, this sequence works fine.

In JJ OS 2 (1.36), the sequence is messed up exactly like it is in 2XL v3. Again, loading the individual SEQ file fixes the problem.

CONCLUSION

The loading of 'All Sequences & songs' files (.ALL) from older versions of JJ or Akai OS are handled incorrectly in OS2 and OS 2XL v3. This is clear, as individual SEQ files load up fine. OS 2XL v2 is not affected by this bug.

WORKAROUND

This is no workaround that I can see that ensures Akai/JJ OS1/OS Free ALL files load into OS2 and OS 2XL v3 correctly, apart from loading up individual SEQs.

BTW, programs themselves are fine - OS 1 programs load into newer OS fine, it's just the ALL files that get messed up. The reverse is not true however - OS2 or XL programs loaded into OS1 have the correct sample-to-pad assignments, but each pad is either completely muted or 'clipped', which appears to be a pad parameter transfer issue. But this should be a separate bug report

I didn't checked so much lately, but that's true there is no any compatibility since a long time.

Basically most of the time I revert to some older folder.. not switching OS, hearing it sounds ****ed up in program (all is reseted to "new program" default settings, dry samples) and saving as sequence.. then rework in osxl or mix into other track.

After I read your post I loaded like 20 folders one by one, most of os2, some
from os1 and most notes were ok (osxl 3.15), at least I didn't hear any
transposed notes, yet or switched samples on drumtrack. I haven't checked extensively.
Programs are reseted to samples only.. do not load or mpc can't see them after loading and I ended up with "there is no sound" even everything was there.. no sound from pads, sequence is playing.. no sound. I had that before, once after loading older folder, but when loading the same folder just after turning on
I can hear samples and all. I stoped caring about compatibity when JJ rewrote q-links.

OS2 projects are fine in 2XL v2 and v3, it's just OS1/OS-free that seem to be struggling in 2XL v3. This is with 3.16, I don't have any other 3.xx to test.

I can see how most people wouldn't be too fussed about all this, but as I sell MPC sounds, I strive to make everything backwards compatible and where possible, try to create a single version of a pack that works in as many MPCs and OS versions as possible.

Until recently, I thought creating project files in 'JJOS free' using a 'chromatic 36' program was the solution to having projects that work in any MPC1000/2500, regardless of OS. Today, it seems this isn't the case - we need to create a separate version just for JJ OS2 and 2XL v3, which from what I can tell, means actually creating the projects in OS2, because OS2 is not loading OS 2XL v3 projects correctly either.

It's important to remember that this is just ALL files and therefore project files that are affected by this. If you are just loading individual SEQ and programs, it's not an issue.

I'm going to try all this in my 2500 to see if it's the same problem there as well.

Just tried deleting the ALL and PRJ and just loading the entire folder of PGM, WAVS and individual SEQ (created in OS FREE) into 2XL v3. Same problem, so it's not the ALL file itself, it's the way the OS is bulk loading the individual seq files into memory. This folder is loading fine into OS1.

Just tried it with 3.14. 3.15 and 3.00 and it's the same problem.

Just loaded the same files into XL 3.16 on my 2500, and getting the same problems, so I'm pretty sure it's a software issue.

Yeah, I know what you mean with packs for all OS's. I didn't notice it when loading sequences, beside all os1 folders sound totally different, I can recognize them only through names, bassline and drum tracks, all other tracks sound very experimental Well do you think we should send a notice to JJ about that? I think he doesn't support OS1 and OS2 anymore, so I doubt he will make xl2 or xl3 compatibile with them.
In the past, after updating, I used to load project from previous OS, hit Play, and listen to my tracks, and this was easy way to find basic bugs or incompatibility.

Bugfix wrote:I think he doesn't support OS1 and OS2 anymore, so I doubt he will make xl2 or xl3 compatibile with them.

I think if he realises the 2XL v2 is loading them fine, he may look into fixing it for v3 and OS2, it's hopefully a minor fix. I understand why he may be wanting to ignore previous OS versions, but for me, it seems more 'complete' to ensure legacy files at least load to the lowest common denominator, especially if they are legacy files from your own custom OS.

Also, he still sells OS1 and OS2, so to be fair they are not truly 'legacy' - it's quite reasonable to expect people who buy OS1 and then want to upgrade to 2XL to not have to re-do all their projects again because the SEQ files get messed up.

The fact that individual SEQ files load fine means that the compatibility is already there, it's just getting messed up when loading multiple SEQs at the same time.

At the very least, a note on his web site explaining the issue and the temporary 'fix', which is to load up the original PRJ in OS1, save all original SEQ files individually, load up the OS1 PRJ in OS2XL, then load up and replace each SEQ file individually, then re-save the PRJ.

Ah, sure it's worth to try. You already know what's going on so send him a report, maybe backed up with drawings for this note assign. Have you got his e-mail?

yeah thats a great read. I have encountered this but just assumed thats just how it is. Thanks for doing all that work and posting for us what you found.