Multis and Parts/INT A for NEWBIES

It helped me by reading very carefully over time the reference and User manual over time with experience. For other it will help to to turn off the machine and to read carefully page 48 in the User`s manual especially about Specify the part directly and Specify the part via the receive MIDI port/MIDI channel. Then read into page 50 concerning Setting the receive MIDI port/MIDI channel of a part. Now go to page 10 and read Sequencer section about tracks and sequencers slowly and carefully the last sentence about Midi events recorded in the 128 tracks can be sent to the sampler section..........You can freely select the output destination for each track. Now go to page 21 section 7 about the output destinations of part/Out A-D/INT-A-B. Ok remember page 48 in Users About parts (There are two ways in which you can play a part from the internal sequencer (1)Specify the part directly aka I don`t need to be aware of the MIDI port/Midi channel of the part and (2) Specify the part via the receive MIDI port/MIDI channel aka you set a receive MIDI port and MIDI channel for the part and specify the same MIDI channel as the output destination of the track.


I will leave it there put it helps to sit down somewhere quiet and peaceful and just read the reference hard copy and user`s over again until it sinks in with understanding your machine. Read it like a novel even if it means downtime. Your understanding will go up .




This wasn`t intended for vets cause I had to change my behavior and start over again cuz I had time on this week`s vacation. IF you get anything turn off the 4k and read somewhere quiet but you can`t change people bang on.

Woudlnt it be nice if this were all possible from one midi channel, or, within the internal sampler section?

I mean we have 128 parts to choose from in the internal sampler section but utilizing this method we are "limited" to the 32 virtual midi channels since you have to setup a part to respond to 1-16A or 1-16B.

Oh well guess it was a good tip for the newbies out there.....


MaZe

For all newbies the lesson learned is it is hard to change a vet once they have decided on something. For the newbies always check the information if it is true or not by reading very carefully then check your gear. Once you have understanding it becomes much clearer. Sometimes mistakes happened cause a word or sentence was missed. Something is right before us but we may miss the it. Usually by the the third time it comes clear to all to see. Multis have 128 parts. Program change 128 numbers. INT A-B can by set to any channel with as many programs as you wish. It wasn`t obvious until I reread again and the beauty of it came clear. By the way always test it out by trial and error to get understanding.


Knowledge and Understanding is different.


P.S. this vacation was very productive for me just to take the time out away from the job to get a deeper understanding of my tools, mixing, and goals. Golden week is nice. Now for another pint.

This is for the newbies to not be afraid to test out the gear and really learn your gear deeply. Read first, test second, correct your mistakes, then have a blast using your gear with more understanding.


P.S. some information on the board isn`t always right we are all still learning new things everyday. So before you accepted any news on the board remember that its opinion first until you worked it out in your lab as a fact or fiction. My biggest mistake was not taken enough time to really read and understand the whole structure of the 4k. Live and learn.

Good reading. Page 48 word fof word. This method lets you play multiple parts together from ONE MIDI CHANNEL. One channel. INT A is a port not a channel. 1A is a channel as many programs as you want p 50.


I wish the best to the next generation.

I'm an MPC 4000 newbie and i believe this thread was directed towards people like myself. Thanks for bigging up this section Blue Haze. My MIDI controller keyboard will be here in the morning and this weekend and i'll be giving this topic my best shot, at improving my production techniques. Strange that you should post this, at this time - you're right on schedule. Glad you've had a good vacation homie.

Blue Haze, I would like to thank you for your input on this subject as I am sure many just open the MPC4000 and get to banging without opening the manual at all. I would also like to say that after reading what you said in this post, going back to my previous post on this subject, and then re-reading the manual, and re-reading both of our posts again, we are talking about two different things.

I will clarify. Ultimately in order to record a sequence a program must be assigned to a part. A part houses all of the information pertaining to the parameters of a program including filter, voulme, panning, etc. (manual pg. 48 ). A part can only contain one program. Multiple parts may though, as you have pointed out, occupy the same midi channel and be accessed simultaneoulsly (played and recorded). But again only one program can be assingned to 1 part and the midi program change number is for the program within the part not the part, so, switching through program changes will change the program assinged to the part, not the part itself.

Using your methodology, assuming you were trying to answer or find a way to work out my original concern, would not work. I could set up 5 programs on 1 midi channel assigned to port Int A but they all must be assinged to a uniqe part, sure i could fiddle with the program change numbers and sure I could access them all at the same time because they are on the same midi channel. I did this all the time with my mpc 3000 and s5000 combo. Unfortunately this doesnt help with my original problem, you can not assign midi program numbers to entire parts only programs within a part, thus, scrolling through midi program numbers only changes the program assingned to a part, messing up your recording because all previously recorded material that was part specific is now undone to match the new program assigned to that part.

Assigning midi program numbers to an entire part would be nice!!!! For now I will have to try multiple multi's.

PS: I wish we had golden week here in the US. I wish I had the time to have exostential moments with my mpc 4000 manual on the quest to MPC self actualization. Until I get my own vacation, I'll have to settle for reading the manual on the train every morning.



MaZe

I`m happy you when back and look at it. I read the manual on the train too months back. Just a small talk with family about being prepare for an opportunity made me realize I really need to learn my gear. Looking at what you are trying to do. The 4k and S5000 aren`t that different you know. A part is the multi( program, volume, output, pan and etc). But a program isn`t a part (samples, note number/key group, zones, edit and filters.) Changing a part means changing the multi just how you are doing it now. A TRACK consist or two outputs for the internal sequencer PART which means you don`t need to set a receive MIDI PORT/MIDI CHANNEL of the part and INT A/B you set a receive MIDI PORT/MIDI CHANNEL for the part and specifiy the SAME MIDI PORT AND MIDI CHANNEL as the output destination of the track. This means that 5 programs DON`T NEED TO BE SET TO A UNIQUE PART just the same port and channel up to 128 if you wish on one channel try it first. The part on a track is a auto helper that helps us assign a program to a multi without need for setting up a midi channel that is all. But the Int A meants that you have virtual midi channels to as many programs in a sense as you want connect to a multi on a virtual midi port from these you can run as many programs on the same channels. Don`t be mistaken in the midi page 50 that part and midi channel has to be the same they don`t. Part is important only if you are using the part setting on the tracks. If you are using Int A port all the programs can be set for channel 1A if you want it to be with unqie program numbers and with control changes you can go the qlink and change the programs live or record the program changes in the track. Always remember to record the first program change number at the beginning of the track on step edit 1:01:00 now field. You can record any sequence you want using the programs to change the sounds and filters. If you want to change the volume outputs and effects thats were the multis come in you you can change the multi by program changes too. Multis are like a mixer volume, effect sends, pans, but programs are the sound sculptures like filters, envelopes, and such to change sounds shapes, andf forms i would change the programs. To change the volumes like a mixer and the effects I would change the multi. Going deeper if you change the outputs and pan in programs in edit or zone pages they take proirity over the multi settings so you could try to change the outputs when you change the programs. I could go on and on but I strongly recommend this weekend or another to get away somewhere get that reference manual printed up and some suppliment material and just read like a novel. Alot of possiblities opens up later. To all the newbies and the experienced players bang on.





P.S. All the time Sean W. from Akai was helping us with answers I realized was coming first from the reference manual. Everything I just posted came from both manuals with testing and trying on my part to see if it worked too. Just reading again really helps. But I understand more than I did 12 months ago too.

Yeah, i discovered the internal channels a few days ago trying to layer some bass programs. Thats what ive been using it for. Bassically i have 2 types of bass programs 1.my bottom end like a sub or sine, and 2. my top end like a plucky, audibal bass tone-not subby. Just yesterday i was using an acoustic bass and sine wav bass. The acoustic needed some bottom end so i was trying to layer it with my sine wav program. Anyways, what i was doing before, was just copying the bass tracks and swapping the parts then adjusting the levels in the mixer.

long story short, for those of you who dont want to read blue hazes paragraphs or take his advice and read the manual!(no offense blue, but you know how some people are lazy ) bassicaly this alows you to layer your programs by crossing midi channels, similar as on a synth. Im sure theres more to it, but thats bassically what i use this stuff for.

ON the KORG TRITON its called combi mode. Bassically you get 8 parts to layer, apply effects, adjust levels, pan etc. If you know how to really use the triton, you can just cross midi channels in seq mode. The mpc actual implements it better. ALthough i would like to see a "copy effects" option on the mpc.

The 4k is king.

Another example would be using your DAW in your computer and be able to assign 20 different soft sythns to the same midi channel. You don't actually see the midi channels they are virtual. If i'm not mistaken you can also use multis as a template. Example lets say you have a song your doing, and in your library you have like 10 different drum kits that all follow the same setup........kick, snare, hi-hats, etc. You can easily just keep rehersing the kits my changing the program assigned to the part on the multi. And see which one you like best. The multi's is actually pretty easy to understand.

sorry posted twice.

there can only be 16 MIDI channels be socket,
that a limitation of the MIDI standard,
not a limitation of the MPC4000!