Technical questions for the MPC2000xl and the MPC2000
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By hok-2 Sun Jul 23, 2017 6:29 am
Hello, just wondered what you lots views are on this matter becouse I have not found a D.A.W that I dont have to drag and realign everything to.

I'm presently using Reaper and I have a M-Audio Uno midi box that I synce the mpc and computer with via midi cables, but its awfull. It never starts twice at the same point so each audio wav is a diffrent length which makes transfering it to a D.A.W quite hard work, and generally it looses the time and feel that I had got from using the Mpc alone.

Is there somthing I am not understanding about this procces?
I usually try to track out kicks, hats, snares etc on individual channels and make several difrrent passes as I dont have the 8-output board.

Is there any D.A.W that has a tighter synce, or is this somthing that is allways going to be a bit crumby, and a 8-output board and a 8-16 input audio interface is the way?
And record it in one pass?

Anyway, any thoughts and advice on this subject would be aprieciated.
Peace Gods.
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By Harmoncj Sun Jul 23, 2017 6:39 am
almost all of these midi/usb cables things that look like this:
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are no good, there is just no regard for timing or anything. It's confusing to me because why would you even bother even making a MIDI cable that can't respond musically?
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By tapedeck Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:25 pm
Harmoncj wrote:almost all of these midi/usb cables things that look like this:
Image
are no good, there is just no regard for timing or anything. It's confusing to me because why would you even bother even making a MIDI cable that can't respond musically?

actually those cables are some of the better ones.

there are tons of crappy ones out tho, but the name-brand ones are usually ok.

if yer trying to sync from the daw to the mpc, forget it. it's not about the cable its called midi jitter and you can look it up - it doesn't matter the daw, its a hardware thing, and i dont mean soundcards either.

if yer just trying to sync up mpc tracks, first off, yes the 8-outs will change yer life. second, just start the sequence with a rimshot and then line those all up afterwards. dont bother with sync - just match the tempos and then line them up afterwards or get them in time by hitting play in time. just practice hitting the start button on time - musicians do this all the time.
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By Wal Martian Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:44 pm
I've never had any luck with USB interfaces as far as jitter and proper sync. With USB3 it may not be a problem, but older computers with older USB2 peripherals, I've never had success. USB sends data as packets, this seems like the opposite of what you would want for a streaming signal of audio or MTC. To avoid latency and dropped samples etc. I just stick to firewire.
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By Harmoncj Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:12 pm
tapedeck wrote:actually those cables are some of the better ones.

there are tons of crappy ones out tho, but the name-brand ones are usually ok.

if yer trying to sync from the daw to the mpc, forget it. it's not about the cable its called midi jitter and you can look it up - it doesn't matter the daw, its a hardware thing, and i dont mean soundcards either.

if yer just trying to sync up mpc tracks, first off, yes the 8-outs will change yer life. second, just start the sequence with a rimshot and then line those all up afterwards. dont bother with sync - just match the tempos and then line them up afterwards or get them in time by hitting play in time. just practice hitting the start button on time - musicians do this all the time.

:oops: there I go talking out of my ass again. I did not even know all this. All I did know is somehow all the sequencing and timing is basically perfect on the mpc itself, bring a USBcable into the mix it's totally messed up. I guess we're asking a whole lot out of a MIDI cable.
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By Wal Martian Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:17 pm
tapedeck wrote:
Harmoncj wrote:...just start the sequence with a rimshot and then line those all up afterwards.

or you can just highlight Count:ON and press Open Window then change it from in:REC to REC + PLAY. Now you have a 4 count before your beat starts. Set the DAW to the same BPM as your MPC and you only have to line it up once.
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By tapedeck Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:24 pm
Harmoncj wrote: :oops: there I go talking out of my ass again. I did not even know all this. All I did know is somehow all the sequencing and timing is basically perfect on the mpc itself, bring a USBcable into the mix it's totally messed up. I guess we're asking a whole lot out of a MIDI cable.

its ok - its a confusing subject.

for example, the clock itself is not asking a lot of out the midi cable...it is just sending pulses to keep time. the thing is, those pulses HAVE to be sent with perfect synchronization to be able to provide a stable clock. the host computer usually won't do this - its not about the cable, its about the computer.

where the cable matters is when you start asking a lot out of it - for example transmitting large amounts of sysex data. in this case, its not the timing of the data that matters, but the amount of data.

see the difference? clock is a tiny amount of data that is incredibly susceptible to timing, whereas sysex data can be a large amount of data that doesnt really depend on timing.
for clock, the computer itself will cause problems.
for sysex, the cable could be the one causing problems.

point being, a 'good' cable or a interface is still not necessarily going to be able to overcome the inherent design of how the computer sends clock data.

here's an academic paper on the subject: https://www.e-rm.de/data/ERM_Jitter_Report_02_14_EN.pdf
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By richie Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:36 pm
What about syncing to an SMPTE track?
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By tapedeck Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:22 pm
richie wrote:What about syncing to an SMPTE track?

that should be fine - i believe any smpte code would use an audio channel which is reliable enough.

thats how those innerclock devices work, they send sync over audio and use that to generate midi clock.
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By loose_t Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:35 am
i used to do the line up the rim shot trick but it still wasnt perfect. I now use a Profire 2626 for 8 analog mono + digital stereo inputs from the mpc. It is sweet.
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By tapedeck Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:21 pm
im curious how many of yall that do 'the rimshot trick' did it with sync on or off?

my guess is it would work a lot better with sync off.
By DiffHop Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:24 am
I know it’s slightly more drawn out. But have you tried using Marco Polo’s “PMTE” method for tracking out?
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By J.D. Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:42 am
I also would suggest the PMPTE-Method. It means you use basically a count-in for every track and sync those ticks at the beginning. Just ignore any sync-settings. Add 4 clicks to the beginning of every track, use a count on for playback, shoudl work.
Then record every track and sync up the recorded tracks.