turntables and mixer questions

my roomate has 2 technics 1200 mk2's, and a crappy vestax mixer, ive got an mpc2000xl, our lease ends at the end of july. obviously its time to get my own tables and mixer. does anyone have any opinion on the stanaon tables that go in reverse, changes pitch without changing tempo (yes, i am aware the mpc does this too) versus the tried and true tech's??
i am more into production than DJing, but i do **** around with the tables too, so i want the durability of techs, but the stanton is cheaper, and the torque is supposedly better on the stantons and the stanton has a lot of kinda cool features. also any suggestions on mixers?? what is an optical crossfader?? is a Stanton SK-2F LTD good??? its on sale for 220.00, which seems cheap, and i wonder if its a good deal?? i'd rather spend less than 300 on the mixer, but i heard the Pioneer - DJM-300S is good , and its like $340 HELP....sorry for the length, and thanks in advance for any info.

I have the stanton STR8 100 and I think it's pretty good. The 1200 motor still feels a little stronger still, but the Numark ttx beats it. I am really happy with the stanton though, and a few of my more DJ wise friends prefer it to the 1200. They are really good for sampling since you can speed up and slow down without messing with pitch (extreem settings will introduce some artifacts, but it is still passable for most mxing).

thumbs up.

I got turntables for scratching and sampling, although there is a slight noise from the mixer. I want the sample noise as clean as possible(even though it aint much), so I later got a phono pre-amp, which is much cleaner in noise. just keep that in mind when you get a top of the range mixer, it might have a bit of noise. I have the entry level vestax. Turntables? I've only used 1200s, ive heard the vestax turntable is less skipable when scratchin but they are also more expensive. Peace

Vestax decks are not more expensive where I live...... And i'd choose them over 1200's anytime. More power. More acurate pitch control. Less skipping.
I know evrybody likes technics, and every club has them, they are sooooo durable and bla bla bla. But it's about time we move on. I think technics have made enough money by now. If you want the best value for money, technics is not it.

In your situation, since you're just using the turntable for sampling mostly. I would buy the cheapest decent turntable you can live with and spend more money on the mixer and at least one good quality cart.

thanks much, will consider carefully.

Check the Rane series of mixers if you have a bit of cash. Simple but ther'e really well made and have positive features not toys.

laters
Kid

http://www.visionfunk.com

ok.

1200's are the finest tables in the world. the only reason that there are so many simmilar ones is cuz Technic's (panasonic owns them, aka Matsushita Electric Industrial Corp.) patents expired, so everyone could then knock them off.
Nowdays, all tables have powerful high torque direct drive motors, so toque is no biggie, as a matte of fact, those decks who say "higher torque motor then a techinics" may not be that good. The torque on the 1200's is about as powerful as you need for the most complex scratching, a stronger motor only ensures that the motor (the most expensive part in a turntable) breaks first. Remember, the 1200's were built in the 70's, designed to last 4ever back then, The new ones are engineered to break after a certain period of use, (this ensures that the manufacturer can get you on the come back) and most of them have motors that cost almost as much as a new TT costs, thus forcing you to buy a new one. While the 1200's motor is replaceable for 75 dollars if you go to a mom and pop TT repair place.

#2 The features these decks add may be cool but not necessary. The extra pitch is cool for some types of scratchin,but not really necessary. as far as mixing, +/- 8 pitch or more the sound gets pretty funky and chipmunky ie you wont really wanna do a mix with a song with vocals (ie rap) cuz itl sound funny.

backwards mode is a mod to the 12's that can be done by ne1 who can read in 1 hour for a cost of 50 dollars.

the str8 arms provide more skip resiatance and sacrifice sound quality. the S shaped tonearm is the best for sound quality so if you want to scratch/mix and sample off it, dont get a str8 arm, the sound quality is noticably reduced.
if you use a s shaped arm and a set of carts designed for scratchin you can get the same level of skip resistance as a str8 arm, or mod the tech's for 100 dollars for a kit from DJ Focus.


the pitch control of the 1200's is actually FAR superior to Vestax no matter what anyone tells you. and no, I didnt read a review, I tested them side by side. I own 2 1200's MK3's a 1200 mk2, a Numark TT1 (for my living room) and a vestax deck.

the key here is "how accurate is the spinning of the platter" and the tech is by far the most consistent (ever heard an annoying minute speed up or slow down of a song mid mix? that is caused by wow & flutter and the speed of the platter not remaining 100% constatnt.)

add to this that the insulation of the other TT's against outside noise is very poor (remember the needle picks up sound off the grooves, then the tonearm amplpifies it and sends it out the output, so any vibrations can be felt in the sound unless well insulated. This is why techs feel so much haevier, that weight is the rubber base and the well designed chassis which elmimated basically all unwanted vibration. THIS is why clubs use them, cuz even in a 100db room, they will not pick up unessary sound.
this (in terms of sampling) is THE most important factor to getting a good sound. basically dont believe the hype. Look on the net and you will find all kinds of people angry that vestax says their decks are fine, but they get wierd noises, the motors are wonky, its just not worth it, DONT BELIEVE THE HYPE
If these other decks were so much better how come technics just rasied all their TT prices and sales are still going up while vestax and numarks, and stantons sales taper off? cuz they are selling a poorly assmebled, easy to damage product designed to hook you only on a list of features and no real solid performance.

As far as mixers go, I would get a ttm 56 (rane) good sound quality and a nice signal to noise ratio (key for sampling) after that, there are some new vestax mixers dropping to coincide with DJ W-BErt's return to SF from Hawaii and his new TV show going nationwide. these are supposed to be super high quality and compete with the Rane, and I would wait for these to drop since Q knows what a DJ and a samplin artist needs in a mixer. they will cost about the same.

oy vey I cannot stress this enoughm vestax may look better, but in the long run, you will end up buying 1200's again, and be angry you wasted $$ $ on an inferior product.

oh and my pedegree is: cutting since 95 or so, beatmaking since around the same time and I have taken my 12's apart and modded them so much I can prolly do it w/o a blowup diagram anymore.

the extreme pitch range is great if used in tandem with the key lock feature. no chipmunks here.

I still prefer Vestax decks. I'm not going to write two pages about it, i just like them better. It's my personal opinion, i've had 1200's for 6 years and switched to Vestax a few years back. I will never go back.

word. and thats all cool. personally I got for dependability and the features I use. that and if you try and record cutting (fyi scratching is the best way to find out if you deck is sturdy and built to resist vibration and has a good tonearm rig etc. since scratching forcers the whole tt to work, and puts MAD vibration onto the platter) you can hear little inconsistencies on the sound file, this is from the poor insulation of the deck and poor tonearm design.
Like I said, there is a reason why 1200's can raise the price and still sell even with all the comp, cuz a 1200 is like a lexus and other decks are like Hondas.


you can cop a honda and it wil do the job, but not like a lexus will. The price of other decks is like almost 100 less then then 12's, yet they dont sell, go to guitare center, the 1200 is out of stock but they'll sell you as many vestax decks as you can carry.
the lower price is made by sacrificing build quality, something that panasonic/technics has and never will do. I would rather have a well made reliable, powerful peice of kit then a cheaper, not well made designed to break in 1 years POS, and save 200 dollars on the pair. in the long run it will get you.

plus the big key is the 12;s are easy to user mod, try opening up the vestax deck and doing that.....

Dr. Foo,

Well said.

The Vestax Mixmaster Mike side arranged decks are incredibly stable. i prefer this unit for scratching over anything else.

having said that though the difference between decks these days is **** all.

things like Stanton only suffer slightly as think of it ike this, technics (owned by panasonic) have had the SL1200's out for 20 years. the Research and Development (R&D) behind these units way back then was by ratio exponentially lower then what Stanton would be paying today, plys technics have the benefit of lions share of the market and dont need to PR campaign that Stanton would need

all this adds up to one thing, the balance of economy is against Stanton and other such "new rivals" to the turntable market so they cant quite be as wicked as theyde like and still stay in business, hence the trade-offs in quality (ie the new numarks feeling like platic toys) or price (expensive vestax units)


in the end its all preference and i laugh at dj's who wank on too long about particular decks. in my job in the studio i have to use hundreds of bits of gear day in day out on strict time and quality demands and i swear if one of these wanker dj's had pressure like that theyde forget their whinging and learn to mix better!

not a dj diss but in my career ive heard some incredible dj bullshit (my band was kicked out of our green room in our home city venue by DJ Sasha's wanker entourage)... peace and respect to crew like Young Einstien from Ugly Duckling who are wicked djs AND producers...

real djs do real things... crate dig music lovers.. not wannabe rave kiddies

stanton t t's are o.k. they are good for beginners they'll do the job, but i've been spinning for twenty years on 1200's and i've had mine for 15 yrs the same tables and never had to oil them the run just as good as a new table, i've beat the sh!t out of my tables too, i use them scratching , djing ,sampling, my 2 yr old son plays with them now. if you want to the reverse motor you can buy that too where you just hook it to your stop start botton and the motor reverses.the way i see it is you can never go wrong with the technics it's well worth your money you can't gowrong but if you buy cheap you will pay double.technics are the best and all the rest are trying to be like them why you the industry has so many table like them now, because they are trying to be like technics....

as far as mixers go there are lots of mixers that are good vestax is one that is very good, rane is good too, pioneer is good but that is more for CD mixxing, i have the first stanton sk-2 the only thing with that is that my flash switch is loose, but this is a factory flaw. i think the new ones are better,vestax also has the 06 pro(the mix stick)this is a very good mixer also, these mixers are good for djing and scratching , the rane is a good mixer for mixxing it's mostly a club mixxer it's very high powered which will give you very clean sound,it's very expensive thou, i would stick with stanton, or vestax mixers , for inexpensive mixers, they have good sound , and the EQ's on them are good too.good luck on your purchase hope i could help answer some questions.......