MV-8000 Review: Part 1

Part 1: Controls and Documentation

Upon opening the MV-8000 box the first item I saw was an amber flyer informing me to call the Roland SuperStore for a free Quickstart video. I did this immediately. The accompanying materials are very complete and thorough. The MV-8000 comes with the following items:

Quick Start manual
Owner's Manual (434 pages)
LA Riot Sampler CD
MV-8000 Song Template CD
Errata sheets (2)
"About the pre-installed patches" (4 stapled pages)
"Functionality added in version 1.10" (10 stapled pages)
Q&A sheet (4 stapled pages)
File System Overview diagram sheet
Mixer Block diagram sheet
MV-8000 Structure Overview diagram sheet

The production studio arrived cold off the UPS truck. While I was waiting for it to warm up to room temperature I was astonished at what I saw in the documentation. The diagrams are helpful to learn the system and signal flow. It was instantly clear to me that the machine functionality has gone beyond what is available on the MPC4000. This was not a quick, overnight project by Roland but one that must have taken a couple years. The MV-8000 offers improved functionality over the MPC series.

For example, I glanced at a page of the manual that covered quantizing. By interacting with a window the user is able to set the following parameters:

1. Quantize Type (Grid, Shuffle, Template)
2. Strength (0 - 100)
3. Resolution (Grid, Shuffle)
4. Rate (0% - 100%)
5. Template (71 templates available)
6. Template Velocity (0 - 100)
7. Note Range (C1 - G9, upper and lower limits)

I powered on the MV-8000 while monitoring my chronograph watch. It took 1 minute and 14 seconds to boot the machine and autoload the factory demo project. I feel the display could be slightly brighter with more contrast, though this might be because I am used to the MPC4000. Roland probably conserved the brightness to prolong the display life. I plan to add the forthcoming VGA/mouse accessory port when it is available. The black & white high contrast display of the MPC4000 is easier to read than the amber & black (with shading) display of the MV-8000. However, the Roland display packs more information into it than the AKAI display. The GUI on the MPC4000 looks like Mac OS 9 or earlier. A year ago I asked AKAI technical support if the MPC4000 is running a derivative of Mac OS. The representative was evasive when he answered my question. The MV-8000 GUI has an Microsoft Windows style appearance.

As I worked through the Quick Start manual I played the factory demo song. It is a Hip Hop genre song very well done with 15 tracks. Afterward I played the pads. They have an excellent feel to them, requiring slightly less effort to trigger a sample than on the MPC4000. The pads can be configured for a Hard, Medium, or Light triggering. I was unable to produce any double triggering, a problem on the MPC4000. I found it easy to play a quick roll by alternating finger taps, something I often have difficulty with on the MPC4000.

Two useful controls on the left side of the machine are the Roll and Hold buttons. The Roll button is equivalent to the Note Repeat key on the MPCs. The Hold button has no equivalent on the MPC4000 but it is included on the Fantom-S. On the MPC a sample may be designated as Loop, No Loop, or One Shot. The pad responds according to the setting. The MV-8000 goes one step further. By pressing the Hold button the user can make the entire sample length play without having to edit the sample parameter to One Shot, a very convenient feature. The command buttons on the MV-8000 light up solid when active to assist the user in understanding which mode is active. They also flash during data entry. This serves as a helpful indicator to remind the user which button to press next when executing a series of operations.

One feature I always thought was lacking on the MPC4000 is the thin cursor keys. Roland separated the cursor keys and the dial. The sliced quarter circle cursor keys are nice and wide, easy to operate. All parts of the MV-8000 have a very solid feel to them. And the sound? Absolutely superb! The drums and hi hats sound clear and crisp. Instrument tones sound dynamic and vibrant. I have been occasionally using my MPC2000XL to get crisp drum and hi hat sounds. This will never have to be done again.

My initial sessions left me greatly impressed with the MV, which might as well stand for “More Value”. This magnificent instrument is better than I had hoped for when I read the brochure and website description. I predict that 6 -12 months from now, only after many other musicians and producers have acquired the machine, it will be recognized as a major hit. It has the attention to detail that MPC4000 users would enjoy and the next level features that MPC2000/XL owners would get excited over. At this stage I am wondering if Korg or Yamaha will release an equivalent product.

In the next week’s post I will cover other basic issues such as exterior connections, file formats, and possibly sampling. Until then I strongly encourage you to keep an open mind when evaluating this instrument. This will not be easy to do for some people because they will rely on specs or a quick store demo rather than an extended user experience. If you are impatiently curious, then order the MV-8000 and decide for yourself.

Thanx MPC_Producer!
Very well-written! *thumbs up*

the price is very good but i am interested in the functionality of the unit vs the mpc 4000....again i am torn...but my biggest issue is all my akai format cd's...

I'm assuming you bought this piece (versus received it for review)

Thanks for the review..but I'd like to read an unbiased one.

Get the 4000 don't waste your time. Your biggest issue should be do you need a all in blunder studio, or are you building a Decent Pre produciton set up. The MV is half baked mix of alot of things, instead on focusing on what Production center is suppose to be, Roland through a bunch of key aspects of a recording studio( mixing, tracking, mastering) and mix them into THE MV!! More vaule, NAA , Maybe More Valvetta. This Cheese product with have its 15 mins and slowly vanish. Hey the 4000 may not be the shit to eveyone, but this is a fourm for it right?

Nice review non the less - MPC PRODUCER

thanks for the review

I'd be interested to find out how the Acid compatibilty and real time timstretch work in practise - can I audition loops in the current tempo even if they are in a different tempo? If it was half as easy as using Acid I'd be most interested... the MPC4000 seems a bit neolothic in this regard....

both manufacturers should really be looking at how products like Acid and Fruity Loops have devloped in IMO - these are killer products

Also, how can you keep the contents of the harddrive backup upon the MV? There is no possible connection with a computer is there? Ak.sys and USB seems a MAJOR advantage...

As for Akai discs - until that is implemented, presumably Akai samples could be loaded by converting them on a PC to a Roland format and brought into the MV on CDR?

It looks interesting but As I just bought a 4000 I think I may wait for the mv16000 or whatever! I could easily belive Roland could eventually overtake Akai in this area - Akai are SO dull and slow... what is the last really original product they made?

Richard

Thanks for the review. You're brave for doing this on an Akai board. People tend to get really attached to their machines, but I'm glad nobody has flamed you yet.

I'll be eager to hear more reports on the sequencer once you have more time to test it out. I wonder if the timing is as tight as the MPC because it's half the PPQ from what I remember.

Anyhow, great job.

Responding to the above comments....

The only bias I have is a longstanding love of MPCs. It is impossible to write a fair review without knowledge of their functionality, especially the MPC4000. As a case in point, check the MPC1000 forum where a reviewer on a commercial website tried to compare a Korg ES-1 with an AKAI MPC1000. This is the kind of unfair comparison that would be written by an inexperienced reviewer and the MV-8000.

Good news. You might have heard recently that AKAI CD format compatibility is coming as expected. There are confusing issues that have left me uncertain of the previous status. However, I have a Roland PDF brochure file created in early August 2003. There is no mention of AKAI CD compatibility. As far as I know that brochure is identical to the one currently available for download, but it would take a while to check everything on it. The compatibility listed is "AKAI MPC format library". I believe that a few people confused this with "AKAI format CD" because I twice had this discussion a few months ago. Everyone read the specs quickly. We were all unsure exactly what was meant.

Acid format is important. I will have more to say about that in another review, maybe in January. This is another advantage the MV has over the MPC. Few MPC users seem to be aware of this enhanced format and the moderate cost ($50), high-quality sample CDs available to Acid users.

Have faith for now. It takes several months after a new product is released before the user base is large and the owners discover how the new product surpassed currently available technology. You won't be disappointed by what this new machine can do. There is more going on underneath than you have previously heard.

Thanks for the review MPC_prod.
I still got the MV I coped last week. I'm gonna keep it another week to do more comparisons with my MPC4k before the MV goes back to the store. Already I see there's no freakin' way it can replace my MPC and believe me, I know my 4k. The MV may look the same but it's very different in the way it works.

You might have heard recently that AKAI CD format compatibility is coming as expected.

D'ya know somethin' we don't? are ya privvy on roland?

However, I have a Roland PDF brochure file created in early August 2003. There is no mention of AKAI CD compatibility. As far as I know that brochure is identical to the one currently available for download, but it would take a while to check everything on it. The compatibility listed is "AKAI MPC format library". I believe that a few people confused this with "AKAI format CD" because I twice had this discussion a few months ago.

The brochure I got at AES is from Oct 2003 and it says: "from CD/RW Drive: AKAI MPC2000 Sound File", some info on Roland web site says "MPC2000/MPC4000 libraries" and I told ya before, the roland rep at AES told us all AKAI CD-Roms would read samples and programs. I wouldn't even have bothered if he had told us the truth "only samples".

"Functionality added in version 1.10" (10 stapled pages)

What does it do? Mine had only V1.01 and V1.10 is not on Roland's site. (no MV OS/documents online at all)

The black & white high contrast display of the MPC4000 is easier to read than the amber & black (with shading) display of the MV-8000. However, the Roland display packs more information into it than the AKAI display.

We agree on that! I can't see a damm thing on the MV screen, everythin's so small. And I got good eyes!

The pads can be configured for a Hard, Medium, or Light triggering.

Yeah, the pads feel nice, they're almost the same as the MPCs. I found I got a better velocity range on the MPC4k but I'm used to 'em. I don't have a problem with double-triggering on my MPC. I can get double-triggering like a flam when I want it by hitting the pad sideways, which I couldn't get with the MV. Practice I guess.

Two useful controls on the left side of the machine are the Roll and Hold buttons.

Yeah, Roll is just like Note Repeat of the MPC, well not quite! The volume don't respond to pressure as well as the MPC (again, practice?) and on the MPC, the TC value is always right there in Main and Edit. Also I couldn't get it to latch like I can do on the MPC. Maybe I missed a hidden menu. It's all in the details.
The Hold button is cool. I can't figure why Akai left it off, they had it on an old piece they made for DJs.
There's also a Fixed Level button, same as the Full Level button of the MPC, and a Multilevel button, same as the 16 Levels button on the MPC. Sadly, it only controls the velocity, like the current MPC OS! We've been beggin'/screamin' at Akai to get back the 16 chromatic tunings of the 2k, and they're putting it back in the new 1.5 OS this month (I saw a beta at AES in NY in october). Now Roland has to update it too.

One feature I always thought was lacking on the MPC4000 is the thin cursor keys. Roland separated the cursor keys and the dial. The sliced quarter circle cursor keys are nice and wide, easy to operate.

What kinda MPC4k d'ya have?
Mine and all the ones I know have the 4 cursor keys in circle around the dial, plus the 2 block cursor keys on the right (really useful).

And the sound? Absolutely superb!

What did ya compare it with? I loaded the same Wav samples in the MV and the MPC and to my ears, the MPC was more detailed and had better imaging on stereo samples. Even at 16bit, it's no contest. And the 4k can do 24bit samples, or resample down to 12bit or 8bit when I want that sound.
The filters on the MV remind me a lot of the S760. I bet it's the same sound engine. Sounds a bit thin to me. The 4k is more open.

The MV-8000 offers improved functionality over the MPC series.

So far, other than the Hold button, I don't see no improvement, only less.
And ya haven't covered the connections (the MPC4k wins hands down) and sequencer. And that's main deal. The linear sequencer of the MV just doesn't cut it. Sure, it has 7 quantize parameters, but what for? The MPC4k gives me everythin' I need with 3 (TC, Swing, Shift Timing) and the note range (or just hit the Pads I wanna quantize). The quantize of the MPCs is the reference that everyone is trying to copy. F*ck templates, I've got the original!

I'll look for yer next review. Maybe I missed some stuff.
The only thing that I like about the MV so far are the 8 "audio phrases" in the sequencer (I need to try more stuff with the Timestretch/BPM thing). It's more "integrated sampling" like the MotifES or Triton Studio than a recorder (it's in RAM, not to disk), but it's cool for gimmicks, vocals and guitar parts. That's one thing I'd wanna to have on the MPC4k for quick tracks.

But like aprim says, it's only a 16bit "recorder" and the mixer doesn't have half of what's needed compared to a DAW. I've got a DPS24 runing in sync with my MPC4k. It's a 24track 24bit DAW with a 46channel automated digital mixer, with EQ and Compressor/Expander+NoiseGate on every input and track. I'm gettin' 10 digital outputs from the MPC to the DPS (2 on the SPDIF and 8 on ADAT). It'got 4FX processors and a 4band compressor/expander for mastering and CD burner, so I really don't need those features in the MV/MPC.
Sure that's more $$$ ('bout 2700).

See ya.

Ok I'll like to put my ones and twos in this whole debate.

Basic comparisons

Sampler section:
First of all the 16 bit 44.1khz(Fixed) sampler section of the MV cannot be compared to the 16/24 bit 96 khz(Not Fixed) on the MPC. What makes it better on the MPC? You can switch it down to 8 bit 4khz or switch it up to 24 bit 96khz. Now some might say why would you want to switch it that low or vise a versa. Taking a high quality sample and lowering the sample rate, sometimes gives the sample a vintage sound. Also taking a low quality sample and raising the sample rate can create some interesting sounds. So right away my creativity is limited on the MV. Please don't even bring up sample time because both machines have ample amount of sample time for any producer. Also the graphical interface is way too tiny on the MV to really get deep and slice up samples. Besides I love the white background and black font setting on the MPC. I can see every thing cleary as if I was reading everything on a piece of paper. Lets not forget simple things like the Q-FX feature that let me add quik effects to samples before I even sample it. Sample edit funtions should be basically the same on both machines from time stretching to Normalize. Unfortunately no minupulation of the sample rate like on the MPC. Sound quality of samples coming out of the mpc is phenominal, but I heard some samples coming out of the MV, and I must say they also sounded phenominal. The MPC is known for its hard and aggressive sound especially when it comes to Drums, but Im sure drums sound great on the MV also.

Moving Along with effects. To be honest with you if your using a hard disk recorder, or a DAW, or have racks of processors and compressors, skrew the effects. To elaborate, the MV seams to have extra effects with the Roland COSM & Multi Effects engine. But from what I heard with my 1 hour time with the MV at the new Guitar Center on 14th streat in Manahattan, they sound flimsy. Not like the effects on the MPC that sound alot more warm. But like I said if your using the outboard gear mention skrew the effects, because your bipassing them anyway.

The sequencer section seams to be similar excepet for the 480ppq resolution on the MV compare to the 960ppq on the MPC, Pattern based sequencing (Dot matrix looking grid, which I personally love.) which can create some serious Drum Loops just listen to those crazy drum rolls that Just Blaze creates in the begining and breakdowns of his beats. Drum rolls like that can be easily created withing that dot matrix seq edit page. Something that the MV Doesn't have as per Akai rep in the Kontry Boy Post. Lets not talk about the Audio recording. Matter ah fact lets whisper about it, are you crazy to believe this is going to be your all in one audio workstation. I mean if your on a super tight buget than mabey ofther wise I wouldn't recomend it. Nothing beats out haveing a gear specifically for the task its intended for. But what do I know I didn't even test the thing out so I could be wrong in the long run.

Lets talk input outputs, in all naturality the MPC can have 10 Analog outs. The 8 output expassion plus your two main outs. The MV has only six, which wouldn't justify it being a bad machine, but having 10 outs comes in handy when recording your tracks to your hard disk or DAW. But the MV does has Rolands RBUS which make up for that if you have a compatible HD recorder or DAW. Same Digital I/O options on both. Now lets talk about MIDI outs. I have 4 sound modules(I think its a waste to buy the key boards when your doing all your sequencing on your MPC IMO), a Yamaha Motif Rack, Roland XV5050, Proteous 2000 and a Novation bass station. The 4 midi outs is very convinient for me no need for an extra MIDI interface to add clutter to my workstation. Also two midi In on the MPC which aquire my simple Roladnd ED PC70 Keyboard controller, compared to one on the MV. One USB Slave no master on the MV, both on the MPC. Everything else is pretty much similar on both machines except for no Wordclock option on the MV, and if anyone tell you that word clock isn't worth it their coocoo for coco puffs. Trust me wordclock is one of the best way to sync your seq to your HD or DAW, not the only way but on of the best way. By the way my MPC is fully blown.

What about features? you ask. If I were to write about features from MULTI/PROGRAM editing, Q-Link operations, Quik effects, to 4 Zone Pad assignment, extensive sample editing and Pattern base sequencing, I'll be here all night. Besides I'll wait til MPC_Producer writes about the features on the MV, then I'll compare.

Now for mastering, ok the MV wins here. Cleary many MPC 4000 users have been bickering and bickering about currently not having onboard mastering. Akai seams to be stump in with this one, I have no Idea why? I own a Sony CDRW33 CD Player/Recorder so I am not affected, but Akai did mention that the 4000 would have it implemented by the end of 2003 begining 2004.

Last but not least overall apearance and structure. First I would like to say to Roland what a @#$%ing Rip off, but a pretty damn good one at that. The MV is one sexy machine, from its sleek curves to its chrome/silver finish. Pads feel pretty much "Velocitized" what ever that means the faders beneath the screan looks and feels pretty cool. I like the way the I/O's are written on the top left corner indicating their repective location. Making it easy for sticking your hand back there and moving around cables without actually having to lift or tilt the maching. Everything else is pretty much standard shit, hence the HOLD button on the MV is a nice touch. On the other hand the MPC is georgous, from the day I layed my eyes on her I fell in Love, especially the way she tilts her head up and down when I need to change positions (get it.) The MV unfortunately doesn't tilt her head making her lay flat for a boring intercourse (get it.) Also the Graphical User Inter Face is way too tiny and Cluttered with shit. And the way they display the tracks is wiggitty wiggitty wack I mean come on with that protoolish VSish look that shit is wack. leave that look for HD recorders and DAWs where its makes more sense.

With this and that said Overall specs and Apearance wise the MV fall short with a few missing options. Feature wise, we'll just have to wait and see what MPC_Producer comes up with on the MV so we can compare.

Doctor Beat wrote: I've got a DPS24 runing in sync with my MPC4k. It's a 24track 24bit DAW with a 46channel automated digital mixer, with EQ and Compressor/Expander+NoiseGate on every input and track. I'm gettin' 10 digital outputs from the MPC to the DPS (2 on the SPDIF and 8 on ADAT). It'got 4FX processors and a 4band compressor/expander for mastering and CD burner, so I really don't need those features in the MV/MPC.

Thats what im talking about! Just a MPC4000 and a DPS24, damn! You lucky son of a gun.

By the way, everyones doing all this talking, isnt the MV still just a phrase sampler like the 2000XL, no setting loop points or key mapping? This would already put the 4000 way ahead of the game.

sorry..it just hit me offguard...

do ya see it better now?



Dov, ya got more???

who needs enemies!!!!!

I expect the MV8000 to have a very limited sample engine in comparison to the MPC4k, the Z8 sample engine is one of the most comprehensive sample engines of this time. From what i know the MV8 uses the same sample engine as (more phrase wise) as the mc909.

Remember that in the near future a simple phrase sampler will not be sufficient for all those complex hi tech, sample cd;s that are comming up. I mean,, the fender rhodes, the orchestral string stuff,, horns,, guitars etc etc.