weird MPC SYNC problem...

whats goin on yall... ive noticed that whenever i track out my beats to pro tools, the first note gets cut.. so when i record a 4 bar drum loop into pro tools the very first kick always has a click/pop in it or is softer than the rest of them..

I got the MPC 1000 wit JJ 1 and Pro Tools 8 LE (latest update) / Mbox2 runnin on Windows XP Home SP3.
The tempo is set correctly and the number of bars also.

does anyone know how to fix that? peace

What i usually do is never start it at bar one, i let it run for like 8 bars and then use the last 4 bars and go from there.

this is a common issue for MIDI SYNC... the tip above is the solution... but you can honestly do just 1 blank bar [instead of 4] at the beginning and it will also sync well. you only need to do this for the first sequence... and you can do it later by just adding 1 blank bar to the beginning of your existing sequence.

temetrepo wrote:What i usually do is never start it at bar one, i let it run for like 8 bars and then use the last 4 bars and go from there.

yeah ive done it. i set the start of the song on the 2nd bar n let it record 5bars of a 4 bar loop. that way it starts recording at bar 2 and everything is captured. but i still have to cut like 0.00.950 of silence in the beginning and 0.00.050 in the end of the recorded loop. then i have to drag it using grid mode to the beginning of bar 2. but thats to much hassle... pro tools should b able to record it properly...?!?!?

crossings wrote:this is a common issue for MIDI SYNC... the tip above is the solution... but you can honestly do just 1 blank bar [instead of 4] at the beginning and it will also sync well. you only need to do this for the first sequence... and you can do it later by just adding 1 blank bar to the beginning of your existing sequence.

i created a new 1bar sequence (same tempo as my main sequence) and put it before my main sequence in song mode. still doesnt help?? also set pre roll to 1bar

motifated wrote:

temetrepo wrote:What i usually do is never start it at bar one, i let it run for like 8 bars and then use the last 4 bars and go from there.

yeah ive done it. i set the start of the song on the 2nd bar n let it record 5bars of a 4 bar loop. that way it starts recording at bar 2 and everything is captured. but i still have to cut like 0.00.950 of silence in the beginning and 0.00.050 in the end of the recorded loop. then i have to drag it using grid mode to the beginning of bar 2. but thats to much hassle... pro tools should b able to record it properly...?!?!?

Its not a fault of protools nor the MPC. You can blame the people from the "Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers" for this. SMPTE timecode is the "mother" of the MTC (MIDI timecode) and therefore the resolution of the time is not in hours:minutes:seconds:milliseconds but in hours:minutes:seconds:frames:subframes while a second is divided in selectable frames (24 / 25 / 30 / 29.97) and one frame is devided in 4 subframes.

What does it mean?
A millisecond devide the second in 1000 parts so the resolution of a second is 1000
but the resolution of a second if its devided by subframes is 4*24 (or 4*25 or 4*29.97 or 4*30) so its 96 (or at 30fps = 120)
With this coarse resolution it's never possible to sync with a millisecond accuracy least of all sampleaccurate.

peace

I seemed to have been very lucky with this in that I have never had such issues with my Cubase/Nuendo setup at all ... I have heard that some have had this issue with Cubase, so don't think I am suggesting that you abandon Pro Tools.

Hope it all works out for you ... I am sure it will in the end.

peterpiper wrote:

motifated wrote:

temetrepo wrote:What i usually do is never start it at bar one, i let it run for like 8 bars and then use the last 4 bars and go from there.

yeah ive done it. i set the start of the song on the 2nd bar n let it record 5bars of a 4 bar loop. that way it starts recording at bar 2 and everything is captured. but i still have to cut like 0.00.950 of silence in the beginning and 0.00.050 in the end of the recorded loop. then i have to drag it using grid mode to the beginning of bar 2. but thats to much hassle... pro tools should b able to record it properly...?!?!?

Its not a fault of protools nor the MPC. You can blame the people from the "Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers" for this. SMPTE timecode is the "mother" of the MTC (MIDI timecode) and therefore the resolution of the time is not in hours:minutes:seconds:milliseconds but in hours:minutes:seconds:frames:subframes while a second is divided in selectable frames (24 / 25 / 30 / 29.97) and one frame is devided in 4 subframes.

What does it mean?
A millisecond devide the second in 1000 parts so the resolution of a second is 1000
but the resolution of a second if its devided by subframes is 4*24 (or 4*25 or 4*29.97 or 4*30) so its 96 (or at 30fps = 120)
With this coarse resolution it's never possible to sync with a millisecond accuracy least of all sampleaccurate.

peace

i hear ya. i just wanna b able to do what others are able to do. my boy has a similar setup to mine n he doesnt have to cut n paste pieces of the recorded sample to make it play the way its played on the mpc. he's got the mv8800 though. I dont wanna blame mpc's b/c lots of people use them n they dont complain. but maybe something's wrong with mine? or my mbox? is that a possibility?

inthemix wrote:Hope it all works out for you ... I am sure it will in the end.

thanks. i hope so too, lol..
i think something needs to be set up in pro tools maybe, i dont know what though. still, its interesting that im having a problem like that and cant solve it the way other people can?!?!?

I tried using Pro Tools as a sequencer for my sound module. Connected it to the mbox via MIDI, recorded something real quick and then recorded the sequence into an audio track. Now everything is on note... Is it possible that something is wrong with my mpc's midi ports???

no, its your midi offset.

if your mpc is your slave, then you should have no issues, because it will trigger playstart the minute it received the note on command.


try setting your midi offset in protools to compensate delay

if your running PT8 then you can set different offsets for each port... pretty cool



the only time i ever say the first note going missing was on mpc3000 and older, but with adding muted 2 bar loop at the beginning of your song, and adjusting the midi offset, it goes away..

you wanna see transients right on grid, if you are at zero swing.

The Grublet wrote:no, its your midi offset.

if your mpc is your slave, then you should have no issues, because it will trigger playstart the minute it received the note on command.


try setting your midi offset in protools to compensate delay

if your running PT8 then you can set different offsets for each port... pretty cool

yea, i got my mpc on slave. how do u set midi offset?

its in preferences i think.... in the same page as all your settings stuff...


track a slaved beat...

then zoom in and tab to transient chop the 1st wave..


switch the grid mode to samples, not bars and beats.


put into grid mode, and chop on the grid where the hit should have been.

highlight the gap (between grid and 1st wave hit)

see how many samples are there.


input that into midi offset in your settings.

Thanks. I've already done it. But it only worked for the Midi Beat Clock. I turned the clock off and slaved my mpc via MTC.

The Grublet wrote:put into grid mode, and chop on the grid where the hit should have been.

highlight the gap (between grid and 1st wave hit)

Actually there's no delay. My tracks are rushed. I placed the cursor on the beat grid prior to the transient and hit Shift + Tab. Then switched to samples. The problem was that I couldnt input the result number b/c it was to big (1902 or somethin.. while the max number should be 1600 or -1600). although when i set for Midi Clock it was around +500. maybe i put it in the wrong place?!? To set it for MTC i went into Setup > Session > SYNC Setup & Time Code Offsets (@sample offset). What now?

you do have to mess with it a little... try max value, and min value, then adjust til its right... im using clock.

The Grublet wrote:you do have to mess with it a little... try max value, and min value, then adjust til its right... im using clock.

not working. whatever value i put, it doesnt seem to make ANY difference at all... the lenght between the beat and the transient is ALWAYS the same. no matter if its the highest value or the lowest value or any value in between.

Edit: i would be using clock too but had a problem with it and was recommended to use MTC instead. the problem went away. please check out my other post to see what im talking about.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=129591

When the note is unquantized and is nowhere near the 16th note (or 32th, not sure), pro tools kinda quantizes it itself. not accurately too. if u know how to fix that, im gonna forget about MTC and go back to using clock. peace