MPC 4k internal midi and logic environment

The 4k`s midi mode is similar to logic environment.




Most of us are used to working with external midi routing from a MIDI PRODUCTION CENTER aka mpc to a keyboard workstation, DAW, sound module, and software instruments. However we have to also remember the internal routing that occurs within our 4k also within the DAW of choice in this case logic studio.


The same basic principle works for the mpc 4k and logic environment where`s you have a virtual representation of the internal routing of midi within the units. Whereas on most mpc the internal routing is hardwired in a sort of record and forget format. The 4k like logic studio allows its users to customize the midi routing to the destination of choice. The main difference of the 4k and logic is most of the routing is limited and setup in the 4k as logic internal midi routing has to be roughly setup by the user. This was done to give the user more flexibility.



To break this down a flowchart like your 4ks midi mode will do.



This is a virtual representation of the 4k internal midi routing.


Input port I

Input Port II we can connect a keyboard controller, knob controller, another sequencer or DAW to bring midi data into the 4k and logics clicks and port is the same.



Midi I

Midi II

Pads

We have layers which determines the midi routing to destinations which are to the Internal sampler A, internal sampler B and or external midi outs A, B, C, or D just like we have in logic except we call them multi instruments/midi instruments to software instruments or external instruments it is no different just the terminology.


On the 4k we can change the routing by going to the destination and setting up the routing to the sequencer, or to the sampler directly, or out of our unit to an external keyboard/sound module you have you just like in logic environment.


All sequencers work the same. Midi data from keyboard, controller, or pads>Sequencer (aka tracks)>destination internal instrument 4k`s Sampler programs aka software instrument in logic or external instrument (motif, triton, Fantoms) and logic does the same. Once you understand the midi flow on the 4k you will understand what logic`s environment is just a virtual images of your real external hardware in your studio and some virtual gear you don`t own such as a appregiator, delay machine, multi instruments and so on.

I will return tomorrow to add more information as it is late. If you understand the 4k midi routing then logic environment become a breeze to work with.

See you tomorrow.

Hey Blue haze its back ok how bout the template I know im being a bit rediculous but how bout the template cristmas is coming I dont really celebrate it but I like gifts too thanks for the logic environment. by the way i like the new pics with the advice

Sorry no template to send. But Remember logic is virgin nothing is setup intiallly to give us users freedom to route the midi whichever way we wish.

Environment actually is the same meaning as internal and external studio midi routing that simple.


If you want to say set up your 4k to EXS24 you need to setup the midi routing with the cables and say it as a part of your template for next time.


All we have to remember is the midi signal flow on the 4k. We have our midi in I and II for controller and a virtual port for your pads>next the midi is routed to the tracks aka sequencer>then to the destinations (sampler) or midi out ports.


You have to do the same on logic for each track and device.


A 4k is a multi instrument which means it can record 16 channels of midi. All you do is made a virtual icon of the 4k aka multi instrument make sure in parameter set up the port as the same as on your midi interface your real 4k is set up on and turn on all the channels. Now route your virtual 4k to a midi channel splitter which aka splits the midi from your virtual multi instrument so you can individual run the midi cables to individual software instruments or external instruments. Once you have set up your studio like this logic gives us an added plus of inserting devices like a delay, chord memorizer, arppegiator, transformer and you name it between or before the virtual 4k and the destinations.

In Logic`s arrange just like in the 4k`s main page we just assign a destination to a track and record our sequence and it is good to go.

Signal flow Midi Port IN>Sequencer/Track(same thing really)>Destination. But we always set up the routing to the destinations aka instruments first then assign them to the track.

Most people don`t realize this at first in Logic we have to set up the routing to the Destination first then assign it to a track. The mpcs already have part of the routing to the destination set up so we just assign to the destination to a track and record. But the 4k is the only mpc so far that gives us options to route to several destinations first then assign it to a track which is why I stated the 4k and logic environment is so similar.



http://audio.tutsplus.com/tutorials/rec ... vironment/

So whats happening here? You using Reasons sounds via MPC4k?


Actually I`m using everything internal 4k samples, logic instruments, third party instruments, and my motif sound module sounds. You can use reason to you need to a basic rewire instrument and midi or multi-instrument. I haven`t used reason in years so you are on your own concerning routing on reason. This was intended strictly a 4k and Logic studio setup thread.

Just a reminder 4ks midi page is one of the 4k`s internal midi routing besides the program matrix and qlink pages. The samplers A and B are the internal instruments of the 4k and midi out ports are for the external instruments of the 4k. If you understand this basic setup on the 4k then you will have a better understanding of logic environment aka internal midi routing page.

all the best.

MPC4k wrote:So whats happening here? You using Reasons sounds via MPC4k?


Actually I`m using everything internal 4k samples, logic instruments, third party instruments, and my motif sound module sounds. You can use reason to you need to a basic rewire instrument and midi or multi-instrument. I haven`t used reason in years so you are on your own concerning routing on reason. This was intended strictly a 4k and Logic studio setup thread.

Just a reminder 4ks midi page is one of the 4k`s internal midi routing besides the program matrix and qlink pages. The samplers A and B are the internal instruments of the 4k and midi out ports are for the external instruments of the 4k. If you understand this basic setup on the 4k then you will have a better understanding of logic environment aka internal midi routing page.

all the best.

did you even bother to read the original post?
you are full of nonsense

MPC4k wrote:So whats happening here? You using Reasons sounds via MPC4k?


Actually I`m using everything internal 4k samples, logic instruments, third party instruments, and my motif sound module sounds. You can use reason to you need to a basic rewire instrument and midi or multi-instrument. I haven`t used reason in years so you are on your own concerning routing on reason. This was intended strictly a 4k and Logic studio setup thread.

Just a reminder 4ks midi page is one of the 4k`s internal midi routing besides the program matrix and qlink pages. The samplers A and B are the internal instruments of the 4k and midi out ports are for the external instruments of the 4k. If you understand this basic setup on the 4k then you will have a better understanding of logic environment aka internal midi routing page.

all the best.

ahh good stuff!

Ok blue thanks for the knowlegde I really appreciate this,but I have to ask this and please do not get offended. I'm in school right now so my time to record is a bit limited .My current setup is the Clint way or I guess the way I was taught on the logic forums by not going into the environment. What I really want to know is what will be some of the benefits of this please do not get upset. It is just that when Fridays come around, which is my day off from school and work I just want to go in and record as quickly as possible so how or what are some of the benefits of this setup.please keep in mind I enjoy sequencing on the mpc 4000 And using the logic and motif xs as sound modules. I did have some issues with the appregiator in logic so I just used vanguard and what I like about vanguard was that I was able to scroll through my instruments just like I was with my motif all from the screen of the mpc so I didn't have to look at my computer screen until I had to get levels right. I asked if this was possible with logic instruments but to no avail. I have witnessed someone do this with an axiom and channel stripp settings but couldn't quite grasp the concept. I spent a good eight hours trying to achieve this and then stopped and asked myself if it was possible. In concluding this question and to help with your answer does this setup allow logic to become a grand extension of the mpc 4000 where an individual such as myself who is comfortable with his workflow but is not afraid of trying new things is anything possible with logic?

Although useful in the right hands, Logics Environment is far from user friendly.

A wrong move can easily screw things up and ruin a complete recording session.

Don't mess with the Environment until you are fully comfortable with Logic and the concept of midi routing.

My two cents...

Actually messing up can be a good thing if you learn from it. The unknown can be scary for most people but for the few a grain of truth and understanding can open up new possibilites never thought of before...........learning something new!!!!




So thanks for your two cents but this is where we differ logic internal midi routing aka environment is similar or the same as most midi internal routing including the 4k so no fearmonging please. Simple to go back to a blank template just like turning off and on your 4k and starting over.

That is why I state for the openminded and newbies too (vets have their own flow) if you study your 4k's internal midi routing in the midi mode you can setup logic to work the same as the princples of midi routing is the same. Different paradigm use what you have.

Port Input>tracks(seq)>destination.

You can freely route as you wish and of course read the manual on which on how to cable, insert, and use the midi devices like stated before. Dive deep and no fear of mistakes be ahead of the class. 4k baby can teach one alot.

duanereed wrote:Ok blue thanks for the knowlegde I really appreciate this,but I have to ask this and please do not get offended. I'm in school right now so my time to record is a bit limited .My current setup is the Clint way or I guess the way I was taught on the logic forums by not going into the environment. What I really want to know is what will be some of the benefits of this please do not get upset. It is just that when Fridays come around, which is my day off from school and work I just want to go in and record as quickly as possible so how or what are some of the benefits of this setup.please keep in mind I enjoy sequencing on the mpc 4000 And using the logic and motif xs as sound modules. I did have some issues with the appregiator in logic so I just used vanguard and what I like about vanguard was that I was able to scroll through my instruments just like I was with my motif all from the screen of the mpc so I didn't have to look at my computer screen until I had to get levels right. I asked if this was possible with logic instruments but to no avail. I have witnessed someone do this with an axiom and channel stripp settings but couldn't quite grasp the concept. I spent a good eight hours trying to achieve this and then stopped and asked myself if it was possible. In concluding this question and to help with your answer does this setup allow logic to become a grand extension of the mpc 4000 where an individual such as myself who is comfortable with his
workflow but is not afraid of trying new things is anything possible with logic?

I will get back to you when I back home on my desktop. Good question by the way.

Start this video at 3:23 if you wish on the basic reasoning of setting up your mpc and logic internal routing. This was one of the original videos I posted on using logic.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSjTqQa3 ... re=related


This is the dude that actually broke it all down on what the environment aka internal midi routing is.

http://vimeo.com/4220063


Concerning your setup duanereed you have to do what is best for you. We all have a number of sequencers in our studio making everything redundant I myself have maybe 4 sequencers consisting of ableton, logic, 4k and 3k. The sequencer is the central of our studios so I mainly use my 4k for sequencing and programming midi tracks. I record the midi into logic studio cuz my studio is software centric I only have a motif xs rack also as hardware module most of my instruments are software so I use logic mostly as my sound module, mixer, and mastering unit.

From what you are talking about setting levels of instruments are you referring to your sampler in the 4k or software instruments in logic? It is important to record the midi data from the 4k into logic first in order to use the delay, arpeggiator and so on cuz logic`s sequencer has to be running in order to hear the effect of the devices.

Of course you could use your qlink controllers to control logic by setting up the midi control channels but that is a different tutorial that I wouldn`t speak on now.


If what you have vanguard is working by all means continue working with it as you can record the appregiated midi data into logic and using the internal midi routing route the track to your other instruments if you wish.

My only appregiators are the ones I have in my motif xs rack, Ominsphere, Kontakt 3, and logic`s appregiator so I have to set it up for myself.


It seems from your setup you have a motif workstation and a mpc 4k so I would just do like you are doing and record just audio into logic see cuz I also bounce my software tracks down into audio to save cpu power and to make mixing with effects easier on my system.

The 4k and pretty much any sequencer works on the same princples that sequencer tracks send the midi data to the destination aka sampler/synthesizer.

We all love the 4k sequencer cuz of ease of use and editing the midi data shifting, editing, quantizing, you name which to tell the truth logic can do all of this and more too and you wouldn`t need an mpc, but we all enjoy the feel and what we already understand comfortably.

For me I can`t speak for others, Logic is the main DAW in my studio for tracking, mixing, and arranging. My 4k is for composing, programming, and sequencing all of my midi tracks just logic allows me to add more to the midi data than any mpc could.

Check out the videos especially this one. http://vimeo.com/4220063


All this thread is about is using what you have. It isn`t about who`s way is the best, or what is safe or not!!!

But how to get the most out of what you have in your studio since this is a 4k forum then 4k users with a 4k sitting next to them.

Turn on your 4ks, adjust your screens, press the mid mode button on the front panel next to the misc button and understand that 4k midi internal midi routing that is before you and that logic environment is the same thing nothing to be afraid of.

Study it, fool around, zen on it, route it different ways and then check out the videos, read your manual and realize hey I can do alot of the same things in logic plus more.

Easy and hopefully clear to lose the intimidation of using logic or even a 4k




































All it is a graphic representation of midi routing within your mpc.

Logic allow us to, once again, logic allow us to once again, logic allow us to route our virtual midi cables however we like just like in our 4k which is deep enough to show us a screen for it.

No other mpc does this as the mpc 4k is the most like a desktop computer ablities you will find on a mpc. Because of this it isn`t so difficult to go from a 4k to a computer sequencer like logic.

But what counts is your music in the end. This is only a tips on understanding what gear we have in our studios.


Good luck.

Just something I wanted to share with fellow 4k users.

Thanks blue haze that answered alot of questions for me my question about vanguard is basically this you know on the main page of the 4k where you have the option to change it to instrument from drum. Ok when i change that to instrument it gives you two more features which are program change i think and transposing. well what i wanted to know is if you are able to change your programs on the logic instruments just like you would vanguard or any hardware synths i hope you understand me now. But im very happy that you did answer my other questions and all is good now i set up aggregate mode today using the motifxs and a tascam fw1884 giving me 38 ins and 24 outs combined I will delve deeper on friday and let yall know thanks Diegoeskryptic for walk through and advice on the forums.

Ok when i change that to instrument it gives you two more features which are program change i think and transposing. well what i wanted to know is if you are able to change your programs on the logic instruments just like you would vanguard or any hardware synths i hope you understand me now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hn-awgsQ-M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aep8weSL ... re=related