ATTN: summer 2000, aww naww, and ableton live/MPC users...

I noticed some of you cats have Ableton with your MPC's. My money isn't

right so I had to sell some equipment. Which left me to use Ableton. I

think bein so used to MPC's I couldn't imagine makin music without it.

Now that I am learning it I don't see a reason to get another MPC. What

do you guys use the MPC for when it seems everthing on a computer is

much faster and has more features. Also what don't you like from

Ableton Live?

F.O.B wrote:I noticed some of you cats have Ableton with your MPC's. My money isn't

right so I had to sell some equipment. Which left me to use Ableton. I

think bein so used to MPC's I couldn't imagine makin music without it.

Now that I am learning it I don't see a reason to get another MPC. What

do you guys use the MPC for when it seems everthing on a computer is

much faster and has more features. Also what don't you like from

Ableton Live?

Well, I can answer from my perspective.

1st.)

1 of my biggest problems with LIve, is that you can only deal with 1 live set at a time.

You can't load up 2 live sets (songs) and segue between them.

2)
And also you can't copy and paste between 2 live sets, as only 1 live set can be opened at
one time.

So let's say that I make a 60 minute live set in Live. Then I have another concert and want
to do another live set with only 1 of the songs that was in the previous live set.

I have to reconstruct each song piece by piece, because one can't have 2 Live Windows opened at the same time, so can't copy and paste between them.

3)
Also, their are only so many Keyboard and Midi triggers available for your live set. With
the MPC i use the next sequence and all my pads are lined up for that song. I've got 96
options for muting and unmuting sequences and triggering samples. Then I get another
96 pads for the next song and so on.

4.)
I work on a computer at work 12-15 hours a day. Personally the last thing I want to
turn on is a computer when I start making music.

5.)Live 6.0, 7.0, 8.0 and so on will NOT work on Windows 98 or Windows 2000 when they get released, or probably my current computer.
OS 2.0 for MPC WILL work on my MPC, as will 3.0 if they release it.

6)
They charge for updates to the Software

7)
Where's the program modulation window on live to manipulate your samples.

7)
Q-Link Sequencer


Uses MPC 2000xl programs and sequences

9)
Slice and Dice a sample built right in.

10)
My computer has crashed MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more then my MPC. I am
a software support engineer that handles a variety of OS (most Unix flavours and Windows/Mac) and can troubleshoot most issues. Do I want to troubleshoot when I'm making
music. No. I want to make music. Plus, being on stage with a crashed PC is quite a
wonderful experience when you have 500-1000 dancers looking up at you trying to figure
out why thier groove isn't getting on!


That's what I can come up with on my 10 minute break from work.

Now does the above stop me from using Ableton. No. But it does stop me from using
it as my main sequencer. It's a great piece of software. A nice tool. I like using it. But
it just doesn't FEEL like an instrument. It feels more like a tool to me.


Either way, what ever you use, make good music. I've heard too much bad music , at large
volumes to want to hear any more



Cheers,

Dave

Before I ordered the 4k I seriously studied Live4. It's an impressive piece of software, with tons of features that should have boosted my creativity. But it didn't.

My biggest problem with Live4 is that it runs on a computer. Computers kill my creativity, they're complex machines that distract me, not intruments that inspire me.

Another serious problem was Live's MIDI behaviour. Live cannot trigger external MIDI gear in sync with the internal samples or internal softsynts. There's a huge gap of several tens of msecs, as large as the space between a snaredrum flam. Bad, bad, bad.

Then there's the issue of sound quality. To get a good sound out of Live I understand you can't use it's main outputs, but you have to rewire its outputs to Cubase or Logic, which adds to the complexity.

In the end I simply didn't bother to start the app.

But I'm in love with my 4k. It's all hardware. I can *touch* the knobs. I can almost touch the samples I tweak. The sound is great. I love the open structure of sequences and tracks, multi, programs and samples. I love the physical feel of the pads. User interface is smooth. Very inspiring!

Well mate,
to tell a short story
the other day I meet with some DJ's and a audio representive to look at how amazing software is,..
after a few hours in a complete VST environment (they had every softsynth PT and Live4 was their main music sculpting UI), I was feeling quite overwhelmed with all the power,
hell when you can be running 30.000 dollars of craks for free ..why spend real money on an MPC phaa...

the DJ finished a track in like 30 minutes, arrange beats and a ruff mix, while I was just working with the same samples on two patterns in the MPC, it was a good song but it was nowhere as tight as what my patterns where playing, (this of cores really has nothing to do with the machinery itself, I’m getting to the point

now for the way I work I like to get every chop right and the MPC is all about detail, once you know it- your beats shine!!!

I might spend an hour making my beat and programming my drumkit on my mpc, while you just dropping loops in life4 and finalizing a song, if its ace material then hats off to you, as that what it all comes down to

But my point is out of the 30gig of wav files we had access to, we ended up using a dirty Dona Summer sample snatched of vinyl from the MPC,

it’s not about quantity its about quality,

I’m sure I can archive same or similar with Battery, but I know MPC I’m comfortable with MPC I do not encounter any work flow glitches, besides like Rene&Rob pointed out: creating a grove with a mouse & monitor is just not as inspiring ambiance wize as flashing lights knobs and sliders which is actually quite important to me personally,

yhea you can likely do everything an MPC can do with software nowadays and Yes I am going to move to softwhere but only to easy the work labor on the MPC. the MPC stays with me, its what helps me get my grove right, its my preference ,its what separates my beats from the next refill loop..

good luck

i use a roland drum kit and instead of the td 10 brain i use my Mpc,
you just cant get 0 latency with a computer let alone the dynamic control over the samples that the Mod matrix of the MPC gives you
So with carefully placed combinations of samples I play our whole songs and live drums all from my mpc all with my hands, Computers are for the studio, mastering and editing.

I use the mpc To free up memory and cpu speed for other thing that the mpc cant offer like eq, compression,ect . The mpc I also a great sketch pad for generating quick ideas and creative flow, Umm note repeat in conjunction with Q-link for custom algorithms. It may seem a little redundent but it all about keepin a good creative flow.

I havent gotten in my ableton live yet im still learning Nuendo although I am intersested what it could do. I have only been using software since October And Dont have the handle on it as I'd like. Im not sayin I cant make good music with out the mpc but it is a helpful aid.

I use Logic and VST plugins for tracking, mixing and mastering. But during the creative part, I stay away from computers as much as possible. I also hate Windows (horror!), and don't have the $$$$ for an Apple system.

And now it's time for me to add my $0.02...

I used to fool around w/ Live long b4 I scooped up my first MPC being the 4K a few months back (July 04 to be exact). But I truly didn't understand nor appreciate the power of Live until version 4 was released. In a way Live and the 4K have a lot in common. They pack a lot of power and functionality but yet are very user friendly, straight forward and to the point.

Although I can whip up a track from start to finish solely with the 4K (which is the way I prefer to work nowadays) -I like to fire up Live every now and then to either make a live mix, compose a new track synced with or without the MPC, spice up an oldie from the MPC, or use Live's and other VST fx to master my MPC tracks.

Having used Cubase, Sonar, and Logic in the past, I must admit that Live truly frees me from all the extra bloat and cheese which I always depised in those other sequencers. Yes they are powerful in their own right -but they took away all the fun out of making music (at least for me) because I found them too cluttered and complicated even when trying to accomplish the simplest task.

With that said you can't lose with either Live or the 4K. Now if you're fortunate enough to own both like myself and many others here than you definetely have a winning combination at your disposal where you are only limited by your imagination or talent.

Peace,
Summer2K

I used to think like you guys about software. I really didn't like it too

much. I don't DJ with live so I don't really need more then one set open

at a time. I havent crashed yet so thats a plus. The only thing I miss is

the sequencer on the MP. I am going to give this a try for a while and see

what happens. I realized it really isnt what you got but how you use it. I

guess the MP got boring after about 8 years working with one. I started

on the 60 part 2 and lastly the 4000. Damn some of these Live features

make things music alot easier. I kinda see how some you cats see it

more as a tool then as a stand alone. I was skeptical until I made a beat

on it. I think im hooked now. I am going to setup a Powerbook G4 with a

Korg micro kontrol and one of those Vestax portable turntables. Damn

that shit is going to be tyte. Anyways thanx for the insight...