Is the super producer dead?

a lot of people that have no business making beats are trying to sell stuff. i've got a friend that does this and he uses the demo of FL 7 and doesnt even know how to tweak the sounds. doesnt even know what sampling is either. he sent a mass email out over myspace the other day, said he was selling each beat for $20.

15-20 yrs ago, without software beat making, people like him wouldnt even spend a dollar on equipment. mpc's, keyboards, .... nothing.

but now, people just get FL's, and make a 'hot track' , tell a friend who raps about it, then it all goes downhiiillllll from there. (uh hum, Soulja boy , uh hum)

exactly... no offense but fl studio is the downfall of a craft..

IS THE SUPA PRODUCER DEAD...................................3

NO COZ I STILL BREATHE SO DONT BE SO FUKIN SILLY BLUB

All this blah blah blah about FL Studio is gettin' old....There was wack music before it and there will be wack music beyond it....Not to mention there was cheaper clicking in style music software before FL....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dP52BDZOmr0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDuRoPIOBjE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2f70uR_S0Jg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngmEHiktysc

All made in FL....The faster yall realize that FL is more then just click and done, the faster you'll hopefully stop b!tching about it....Just like Toba said, you still need talent....Just because you can click in notes with FL doesn't mean everyone does it that way....You can click in notes on pretty much any music software....

Hell you can punch in drums in Pro Tools!...Better not make that public or the masses will pull its Industry Standard card!!!!

^ we never said all music in fl was bad.. we just said it was harder to be a producer b4 fl was created.. and yes boi-!da uses fl but hes really the only dope person ive heard on it in my opinion

Beatmaking has become a video game, making beats is easy as F#$#$.. making beats that people will rap on is easy as F@#@#

PRODUCTION is not easy though, mixing, mastering.. that takes skill learned over time/repetition

I've never used fruity loops or fl studio so I don't/can't judge that program itself.

hell, like 4 years ago trying out some software I made a beat in like 15 minutes in the apple computer store at the mall in garageband program then converted to mp3 in itunes and e-mailed it to myself all while in the store. I sold that beat mp3 non exclusive for 25 bucks

as a dj first, it was very easy to mix the drum patters with the bass, with the keys just like mixing records. eq the pieces and adjust the levels then export it out of the program ( learning curve for a non dj would be a little more time, yet the sounds are already tweaked like puzzle pieces to fit)

multiply what I did in 15 minutes in garageband in the damn store by thousands of dudes in their bedroom/laptops add soundclick, rocbattle, myspace and you have the result of the easy as 123 beatmaking climate.


no talent is really needed, just computer knowledge, & sound library( already sound like "x" producer) ( many included with software free)


back in the day, you might run into 5 to 10 people in your area that you knew made some beats, now it's hard to just talk to 5 to 10 different people and not meet someone that makes beats on their computer...

sad thing is 90% of them would not be able to show you middle C on a keyboard.
this is good for people who want to dabble in playin with beatmaking to pass time but bad for those who have and do take this stuff more seriously.


back in say 95 you could sell a beat to a local artist/ group for 250 bucks, nowadays, 25 bucks for the same product.. and all due to the market saturation that the computer beat software has caused.

it is what it is and that's why I grind so hard for my clients & make sure I leave them 100% satisfied with my product & leave them with my BG brand in their mind

Thats all great but nothing you just said has anything to do with FL really....

I use to be one of those people who hated on FL too....Thought it was wack because of the click in feature and all the wack sounds it comes with until I sat down, messed with it and realized that FL is no different then ANY other music creation software besides the corny name....Thats my point....Over saturation is an excuse, plain and simple (I just found my new sig)....The Internet is as much to blame for more "beat makers" then anything....My point being, if you got the product, you'll make $$$ no matter HOW many people are doing it....Adjust with the times or get left behind!!!!

and lilcombs, I don't want you to think my post was directed at you cuz it wasn't....It was directed at the years of people bitchin' about basically nothing....You don't hear graph writers whining cuz Walmart sells spray paint for 89 cents....and yeah, Boi-1da did 3 of the 4 examples I gave, lol....The top one was Hit-Boy & Chase N. Cashe who also use FL....The Inkredibles use it as well....

I have said it once and I'll say it again, what can be done on an MPC can be done in FL, Cubase, Sonar, Ableton, Logic etc....

LaJProd wrote:
.Thats my point....Over saturation is an excuse, plain and simple (I just found my new sig)....The Internet is as much to blame for more "beat makers" then anything....My point being, if you got the product, you'll make $$$ no matter HOW many people are doing it....Adjust with the times or get left behind!!!!

excuse? naw man it's the reason plain & simple, it's why nowadays the market price for what use to pull 250 bucks now averages 25 bucks.... totally due to the oversaturation brought on by the video game treatment of beatmaking

LaJProd wrote:You don't hear graph writers whining cuz Walmart sells spray paint for 89 cents....and yeah, Boi-1da did 3 of the 4 examples I gave, lol........

the software equal to that would be "smart" paint cans that you point & shoot at a wall, press the button, waive your hand around and you get a mural or near perfect tag on the wall.. all while the user does not even know wtf they are doing

LaJProd wrote:I have said it once and I'll say it again, what can be done on an MPC can be done in FL, Cubase, Sonar, Ableton, Logic etc....

EXACTELY... reason that is a problem is because the software does so much of the tasks that ANYBODY without much thought can do it just like playing a video game

it's like how people get mad that pro baseball players use steroids.... because it cheapens the accomplishments.

well, the software shit is like steroids with built in skill

BGBEATS wrote:excuse? naw man it's the reason plain & simple, it's why nowadays the market price for what use to pull 250 bucks now averages 25 bucks....

What averages to 25 bucks is "leasing"....I know you know the difference because you already admitted to leasing beats for $25....No independent artist in their right mind was/is paying $250 to lease a beat....Not now, not in '94

BGBEATS wrote:the software equal to that would be "smart" paint cans that you point & shoot at a wall, press the button, waive your hand around and you get a mural or near perfect tag on the wall.. all while the user does not even know wtf they are doing

Besides the fact that you are looking at it all wrong, that is a BS analogy and you know it....

BGBEATS wrote: EXACTELY... reason that is a problem is because the software does so much of the tasks that ANYBODY without much thought can do it just like playing a video game

You are STILL looking at it wrong....You are thinking of the one sided "click 'n' done" type of doing things when that can only get you so far and its not really far at all....NO ONE is making anything worth listening to with this method and no knowledge of what they are doing so why would you care?...All these software DAWs are capable of so much more then sit a click and thats what you are over looking....Let me ask you a question, do you use any kind of software at ANY point during your music creation / mixing?!?!

BGBEATS wrote:excuse? naw man it's the reason plain & simple, it's why nowadays the market price for what use to pull 250 bucks now averages 25 bucks....

LaJProd wrote:[What averages to 25 bucks is "leasing"....I know you know the difference because you already admitted to leasing beats for $25........

LaJProd wrote: No independent artist in their right mind was/is paying $250 to lease a beat....Not now, not in '94....

man where do you get your info from?

people damn sure did pay 250 for beats then man , licensing beats had way more value before it became a video game with EVERYBODY with a laptop "makin" beats I know this from actual personal experience ... the beats would be sold on a DAT & cassette equal products that sell now for 25 was 250 back then.. people went to real studios and invested time & money to make "demo" tapes to mail into to send into the a&r people . dudes would drop 800 bucks on a studio block just to record a couple songs & get em right.. nowadays dudes drop 50 bucks for two hours in a studio and then rush through and record 5 songs.. and sacrifice getting their phrasing right, just to save $$

it was a way different industry back in the day if your too young to remember you wouldn't understand what I'm describing

LaJProd wrote: .Let me ask you a question, do you use any kind of software at ANY point during your music creation / mixing?!?!

[/quote]

yeah man that's why I know what is capable with and so easily done with the software from using it

garageband

pro tools

reason

ableton


I took the time to learn the recording engineering/ production theories from school then have applied them over the years by utilizing them.


people nowadays regeritate bs they watch in youtube videos or random google searches..

just the other day this dude was praising reason & record software talking about how he could "master" on Record because it has the "Bust" Compression.... ( fail)

Do you see how stupid that is? the dude watched a f!@#@@# youtube video heard them talking about the compressor on the master "Bus" in record and then turns around talkin about it has "Bust" compression ( wtf)



I don't try to tell/ teach anybody anything that I have not learned then tested in the real world and regardless of the fact I have an "honor student" grad certificate in recording engineering & production from 2001/2002 I still learned the most valuable info by doing.. that's why I have such strong opinions on these subjects

just like the digital deejayin cheapened that too, first with the cd's now even serato while using turntables/vinyl it has a mode where you can scratch all heavy handed, skipping your needle on the serato vinyl but the file does not skip.... newer dj's relying on this and the auto bpm are faking it too.. it's not dissing the technology, it's the people who skip learning the fundamentals.. think if a Heart surgeon skipped learning the basics because of some new machine, not the same as a doc who learns the basics then the technology.

I think dudes should learn the fundamentals then the software so thdey will know wtf is going on

I hope you banked serious buck back in the day because I have never heard of anyone leasing a beat for $250....I grew up in the studio in the '90s and met a lot of influential people in hip-hop and just music in generally (no name dropping necessary)....It could be due to the areas of which we have been or are from so I'll call this a tie, lol....

BGBEATS wrote:yeah man that's why I know what is capable with and so easily done with the software from using it

So you talk about how easy software is and how it has ruined the art yet, you still use it?...See where I am going with this?...

BGBEATS wrote:it's not dissing the technology, it's the people who skip learning the fundamentals

But thats the thing, you are typecasting all software users just because there are easy methods to certain aspects....That doesn't mean said user is working that way....

BGBEATS wrote:I think dudes should learn the fundamentals then the software so they will know wtf is going on

I agree....

Basically, has software created easier methods for non-music types?, sure!...But they damn sure aren't gonna take money out of my pocket....Like I said, with no music knowledge whether it be in theory or mixing, you are only gonna get so far and that sure as hell isn't far enough for my concern!!!!

LaJProd wrote:I hope you banked serious buck back in the day because I have never heard of anyone leasing a beat for $250....I grew up in the studio in the '90s and met a lot of influential people in hip-hop and just music in generally (no name dropping necessary)....It could be due to the areas of which we have been or are from so I'll call this a tie, lol....

LaJProd wrote:So you talk about how easy software is and how it has ruined the art yet, you still use it?...See where I am going with this?...

man they could have made the software without the lego style beatmaking shit

biggest advantage to me in software is total recall of all settings of a mix. not have to reference a fader position chart for every mix done on same board revisited on different days or times

BGBEATS wrote:I think dudes should learn the fundamentals then the software so they will know wtf is going on

I agree....

LaJProd wrote:Basically, has software created easier methods for non-music types?, sure!...But they damn sure aren't gonna take money out of my pocket.

man they are taking money out of all our pockets just by making the market price go so low

buy 1 for 20 bucks get 5 or 10 free


dudes buying beats like they are rolls of toilet paper at walmart



use to be able to spend more time making the music than marketing, now it's 90% marketing time 10 % making the tracks cause no point in trying to make the beats stand out, if they can't find you, they(potential clients) won't hear em anyway so way more time has to go into branding & shit oor else get lost in the crowd

BGBEATS wrote:biggest advantage to me in software is total recall of all settings of a mix. not have to reference a fader position chart for every mix done on same board revisited on different days or times

I can relate to this....I remember back in the day penciling in fader positions on positioning charts....Then we'd have the masking tape across the board (a lot of people still do this) to associate what track was which....If you looked under the table of the board it was like a wheres waldo of tape with all the mixes not being worked on at the time suck up under there....

BGBEATS wrote:buy 1 for 20 bucks get 5 or 10 free

Anybody running deals like that isn't really worthy of doing music anyway....The only people who buy into that are 13 year old kids who think they are the next Jay-Z simply because they know how to count bars....Take soundclick for example, the average lease price is $25 over there yet, there are still people leasing beats for $40+ and they are gettin' it....Thats $15 dollars over the average....That same $15 is more then HALF what the average is....Yet, people are still spending....Like I said before, you just gotta adjust to the times....

BGBEATS wrote:use to be able to spend more time making the music than marketing, now it's 90% marketing time 10 % making the tracks cause no point in trying to make the beats stand out, if they can't find you, they(potential clients) won't hear em anyway so way more time has to go into branding & shit oor else get lost in the crowd

I semi agree with this....On the flip side, I know plenty of people who don't know sh!t about marketing and are still making serious $$$ simply off leasing....If its good enough, your fan base will make sure the right people hear it!!!!

lilcombs3 wrote:Hey guys.. i was just looking at producers discography then and now... the neptunes, timbaland, and dr dre have all sold more beats, at a higher price, longer than most other producers.. However other new producers such as bangladesh, the bizness and danja all have the same things the forementioned group of producers had..
1. Countless radio hits. 2.Made good music 3. and are pretty phuckin talented (many ppl would arugue that bangladesh is talented lol) anyhow the last group of producers have less work, sale beats cheaper and you only hear from them every now and then.. in a nutshell i wanted to know what you guys thought about this.. in my opinion the super producer is dying out gettin killed by every kid who buys fl studio and calls himself a producer cuz he makes 1 hot beat. are we all screwed? can we not make as much money as timbo or the neptunes?

I'll put it like this....

Everbody eats at mcdonalds,certain people eat at red lobster,and only a few eat at benihana's...

My point is by averages everyone wont make it...They will level off somewhere...

Also to make as much money as the cats you mentioned you gotta have a resume where there's a list of top 5 to top 40 hits..How many cats have that??Im not a fan of timbo,the neps,or current dre,but they cater to the market that gets them paid quickly..And thats the radio market...

Not to mention,they are creating these hooks which enhances their value...

For my taste in hiphop,I wouldnt consider these cats superproducers....

Id rather have a cohesive album then an album with a track thats there for obvious radio play

yes... solar is dead regardless if hes still walking...