MPC1000 OS V3.0 beta ?

Vincepro wrote:

Im curious as to why it seems counterintuitive to you. Explain the intuition you have that this long running (longer running that step edit) and popular method or programing/editing runs counter to and maybe we can help you out? [/code]

Well if I'm programming a drum track, I'll just listen to the metronome click and play it out like a drummer while the metronome runs. I dont understand why anyone would rather input the notes in the grids. I can see how it would be useful for editing what you have already recorded...say, I want to be able to "see" where my badly played kick is and it is faster to find the dot on the grid than listen to it...but other than that, please tell me..Do a lot of you guys input the drum hits dot by dot on the grid as opposed to just letting the metronome run and bang it out? Why? Thanks!

personally i haven't got the best rhythm.. so i'll be able to make drum patterns with grid edit that i wouldn't be able to play on pads in a million years..

Antonym wrote:or at least cut the 96 in half
that'd be enough for me
man that'd be sweet
even though i get by with 192 as it is. i'd rather have 284.

everything more then 96 is fine offcourse.

Paddles,

Thanks for the response...so are you saying how people program drums in grid edit would be to first fill in the high hats on the grid, then look at the lines to know where the snare goes, and then randomly try different slots to see what the kick does? I would think that if you do that enough, you would naturally be able to play it with quantize on, on the main screen. There are only so many places the drums can go. Anyone else?

Vincepro wrote:

Im curious as to why it seems counterintuitive to you. Explain the intuition you have that this long running (longer running that step edit) and popular method or programing/editing runs counter to and maybe we can help you out? [/code]

Well if I'm programming a drum track, I'll just listen to the metronome click and play it out like a drummer while the metronome runs. I dont understand why anyone would rather input the notes in the grids. I can see how it would be useful for editing what you have already recorded...say, I want to be able to "see" where my badly played kick is and it is faster to find the dot on the grid than listen to it...but other than that, please tell me..Do a lot of you guys input the drum hits dot by dot on the grid as opposed to just letting the metronome run and bang it out? Why? Thanks!

if you'd ever used a tr808, even for 5 seconds, you would know exactly why this is desirable

Vincepro wrote:There are only so many places the drums can go. Anyone else?

A drum can go anywhere, depending on what you´re after. Any sound can go anywhere basically, it´s all about taking the time finding out which sound fits where. Don´t limit yourself.

vince - i was skeptical about whether i'd like grid edit for drums too
i thought i'd just liike it for midi control of reason (which i do, a lot)
but honestly i like it for drums better, and i do play em all. by hand.
i think it gives me a much better grasp of where everything is going. rather than have many tracks now (kicksnare, hat, cym, fill, etcetc) it all goes on one track. grid edit helps me see everything better. it's awesome for that reason, plus i can edit everything faster that way.

recently my drums have been damn near monophonic, too - only one pad playing at a time. however, i may have recorded a steadfy 8th note hi hat pattern. if this is the case, i'll want to delete all hats where the kicks and the snares are. rather than going through step edit and looking for double ups, i look at grid edit. it's all the visual pluses of drum programming in Acid Pro (which is no joke, believe me) with the intuitive step editing/shift timing of an mpc. i love it.

mad helpful.

Vincepro wrote:Paddles,

Thanks for the response...so are you saying how people program drums in grid edit would be to first fill in the high hats on the grid, then look at the lines to know where the snare goes, and then randomly try different slots to see what the kick does? I would think that if you do that enough, you would naturally be able to play it with quantize on, on the main screen. There are only so many places the drums can go. Anyone else?

nah, i'm just saying for example :

while i understand polyrhythms, i can't play them.. but if i can see it all mapped out infront of me, i can get it programmed. i can't do that with step edit either.

it's desirable for me (because i'm not a drummer), so I can hear it in my head, and then lay it down in a grid, without needing the go between of manual dexterity..

i'm not the spokesman for grid edit though. i'm sure other people have other uses for it.. that's just why i'm looking forward to it..

i mean if u had a problem with editing drums and doing them manually then ull hav a problem with step edit. clearly grid editing is much better than step editing. theres no comparison. step editing might b better for editing things like velocity, attack, etc, but now where near as clear as editing drums. i done even think theres an argument at hand. if u can play drums or not....if ur the best drummer there is, then obviously u dont need to edit whatsover...im sure no one really just uses step/grid edit on an mpc, it such a hands on machine that ur gonna b forced to play drums out, and anyway mpc quantizes everything, so its not hard to get things sounding right if u do slightly mess up. but grid edit is damn useful feature. that clearly could hav bn included with the machine if akai really cared about making the best product for the money. thats the thing with these companies...once they've had a well established line of products, it becomes formulaeic rather than intuitive and they just look at what the competition offer rather than going all out and giving the full bang for buck. the mpc 1000 os could hav bn much better from the start.

all this carry on about grid edit.. heres my opinion

i had a 1000 for a year or so and upgraded to the 2500 for numerous reasons,

bigger better pads
tilt screen
more qlinks/ real time
more outs
chop shop
cd drive
better layout
and grid edit

but the original grid edit was crap - u could only see 3 tracks at once, since os upgrades you can now see upto 16 and its much clearer and easier to navigate

it is handy for fixing missed/outoftime samples but as for making beats this way it DEFEATS THE PURPOSE of your mpc, if u want to make musical patterns use fruity loops or better yet master reason,

BANG THEM PADS



even though this new os steps it up
has anyone been game to install a 2500 os on a 1000??

Vincepro wrote:

Im curious as to why it seems counterintuitive to you. Explain the intuition you have that this long running (longer running that step edit) and popular method or programing/editing runs counter to and maybe we can help you out? [/code]

Well if I'm programming a drum track, I'll just listen to the metronome click and play it out like a drummer while the metronome runs. I dont understand why anyone would rather input the notes in the grids. I can see how it would be useful for editing what you have already recorded...say, I want to be able to "see" where my badly played kick is and it is faster to find the dot on the grid than listen to it...but other than that, please tell me..Do a lot of you guys input the drum hits dot by dot on the grid as opposed to just letting the metronome run and bang it out? Why? Thanks!

You seem kind of confused here! its called grid EDIT yes? You seem to be able to see how it can be useful for editing already....

ill run through a couple of reasons that make it useful aside from correcting a misplayed part.
1) making a number of slightly different beats from one. Im able to play them in or use step edit but unless they re staggeringly simple its just quicker to use a grid. I know what i want changed and could have what i want done faster than someone using either of those other methods...however practiced they are.
2) Playing a whole beat into one track. Rather than playing bass, snare, hats etc etc on to each track OR playing them live into one and then copying it and deleting everything but one part from each track for the sake of later editing i can play them in and then see a number of parts in an editable format.
3) I dont know how to put this without people taking it the wrong way but not every style of electronic music out there is arranged as sparsely as hip hop often is. I and others write a lot of stuff which you couldnt play in live.

Id add to all that one other thing. Grid edit is an addition to the option of playing ides from the pads live and editing them in step edit. It doesnt mean people wont do all these things. But (and maybe this should be 4) if you cant come up with or realise different ideas with grid edit than you would bashing pads along with the metronome then you should think a bit harder about it!

What is this lunacy! MPC purists don't like grid edit?
Grid Edit is great if only to avoid Step.
Best of both world. Bang it in then go and tweak. Step, grid whatever.
If you're trying to speed up the process grid rocks. (& it's easier to handle when you been smokin)
I for one am loving it.

OK, news from JJ's site:

1. Chop shop not included in Beta version, but is planned to be included in release version. (Note: I sent him a message about how people want both the old and new version of the slice function. I think this is his reply).

2. Next Beta version available July 2.


Nym just sent me the compiled list of bugs. I'm going to be in Tokyo until Sunday. I will try to translate and send to JJ when I get back.

Excellent work.
You NEED to get some drinks out of this

3) I dont know how to put this without people taking it the wrong way but not every style of electronic music out there is arranged as sparsely as hip hop often is. I and others write a lot of stuff which you couldnt play in live.

Agreed. Music like Squarepusher or Aphex Twin have really intricate and complex rhythms that can't really be played in real time. So grid edit is essential for alot of drum tracks. Hip Hop producers can also benefit if ithey want to add more intricate percussion that's not always possible to play in realtime as well. I prefer to have the best of both worlds, so I'm very happy to have grid edit in the 1k.

Maybe you guys don't need me to translate. Looks like JJ understands English. If you can't wait for me to translate the list on Sunday, just try uploading to his site in English:

http://www7a.biglobe.ne.jp/~mpc1000/bug.htm


BTW, he has a note there that says he will fix the Slice Region issue in an upcoming beta version....