Different track lenghts per sequence please?

Hello,

I just got an MPC 2500 with JJOS and XLCD. I love it and I started creating from the beggining. But, in the midst of a song, I got dissaponited: i had a 4 bar 7/4 drums and bass sequence running and noticed the vocal loop I wanted to add on top of that was a standard 4/4 4 bars loop! I couldn't make it fit in.

I am trying all different kinds of setups to make it work. I can do it with simult sequence but it is not that flexible setup (only 2 sequences, etc.). I also tried to use an sp404 as a looper for that vocal loop and it works, but I still cannot program it into the midi sequencer in the mpc (still not the correct timing). I am using the mpc to construct whole songs so this limits me greatly.

Have any of you found a working way to do polyrhythms/metrics on an MPC2500 with JJOS? Any workarounds using other machines maybe? I don't want to get another sequencer to slave my mpc (pyramid for example) but would really really like to keep it in one box, the mpc 2500!

Any hints, tips and tricks appreciated. Thanks.

And by the way: is it worth it requesting the feature to JJ, or it has already been requested many times and not implemented? Thanks.

I know you can accomplish some of this using Patterns, but I'm still getting my head around using them most effectively, especially in live/real time situations.

Grump wrote:I know you can accomplish some of this using Patterns, but I'm still getting my head around using them most effectively, especially in live/real time situations.

Thank you. I tried with patterns but couldn't make it work. Can you tell me roughly how you do this and what version of JJOS you use please?

I'm using OS2XL. You can convert a track or part of it into a pattern, then either assign the pattern to a pad, or even a series of them, which can play independently of the sequencer, if you choose, or you can record them back into a track, reassigning to another program, or a MIDI out, etc. You can even use a pattern as a midi macro, if you so choose. Very powerful tool. When in the Main screen, hit Window, and the Pattern menu should come up on a soft key. Just dig in from there. You'll figure it out.

Thanks.
I think I tried everything and still can't program polyrhythms using patterns. It all slaves to the sequencer in my experience.

Lampdog wrote:Tracks reside "inside" the sequence. Once you understand that fact then you can move on.
Manipulate your sequence is my suggestion. Make seq long as hell.

Gotcha. I have been doing that as well, just copying bars and constructing bigger sections or going linear.

What Lampdog is saying.
And again: Seq edit. You cut, break, combine, multiply at any point, mix tracks from few sequences, with diff Tsig by infamous, not cool looking Seq Edit. Just spend some time on it.

Or you can just learn how polyrhythms actually work.

e.g. 3/4 crossing 4/4/ can be programmed with 6 bars of 4/4 OR using 12/8 depending on what the feel is supposed to be.

That is what the listener is hearing, one combined and complex rhythm. They may be able to pick the different lines out, but they are still hearing a combined rhythm with one time signature.

Drummers that read music don't read separate lines with separate time sigs for poly rhythms that would be insanity to try and work out, counting in 2 different times. They count to what the overall time signature is.

Drummers from cultures that don't use our notation don't even think about it in these terms at all. In western terms Ghanian music is often framed as 12/8 but in actuality they define the rhythm by whatever the cowbell is doing and work from there..

Sorry for the necro-bump but I just wanted to say I think it's unfortunate that patterns have to be 4/4. I get the workaround for copying it until it's 4/4 but that's pretty unruly in my opinion - for example if you want to go tweak it later, you have to go copy it again however many times to make a new one. It would be awesome to support other time signatures some day. I realize that the original request was for polyrhythms which has an additional requirement of independent sequence position (and of course time signature) per-track. While that would be really cool, it adds a lot of complexity, and I personally am more concerned with being able to make sequences of arbitrary time signatures and drop them into arbitrary positions, like Jeskola Buzz circa 2003.

For those who need polyrhythms, I suggest taking a look at the Octatrack and BeatStep Pro. I seem to recall the RM1X having a similar feature too.

what about using Second Sequence? it basically allows you to play two sequences at once. You can set each one to different tempos, time sigs, bar lengths, etc.