MPC 5000: Synth vs Sampler

Below is a compare/contrast of the Sampler and Synth. Some people suggested that running samples through the synth will give you some additional benefits. You will see many of the parameters are the same. Please let me know if I missed any. Note that Synth programs have identical parameters that are displayed on different pages. I removed these parameters from my list.

Sampler:
1. 4 Sample Layers (unlimited types)
2. Sample Layer Levels
3. Semi/Fine Tuning
4. Velocity range
5. Play Mode (Velocity/Cycle/Random sample switching. Mode: One shot, Note On)
6. Voice Mode (Mono/Poly)
7. Amp Envelope (Delay, Attack, Decay, Sus Level, Sus Decay, Release, Velocity Attack/Start/Level/Pitch)
8. Filter Envelope (Amount, Delay, Attack, Decay, Sustain Level, Sustain Decay, Release, Velocity Attack/Amount/Frequency)
9. Filter (Type, Slope, Frequency Cut-off, Resonance)
10. LFO (Wave, Rate, Delay, Sync, Pitch, Filter, Level, Pan)

Synth:
1. 3 VCOs types (7 fixed types w/ depth/shape/width parameters)
2. Program Level + VCO Levels
3. Semi/Fine Tuning
4. VCO cross modulation (FM synthesis) and Ring Modulation
5. VCOs (Env/LFO VCO1, Sync)
6. Master (Voice Mode, Transpose, Legato, Glide, Random Range, Pitch bend, Mod wheel VCO1/Filter/Amp/Vibrato, Aftertouch VCO1/Filter/Amp/Vibrato)
7. VCA envelope (Attack, Decay, Sustain, Release, Velocity/Key/LFO Amp, Program/Key/LFO Pan, Stereo Spread)
8. VCF envelope (Attack, Decay, Sustain, Release, KeyK>Cutoff, LFO Cut-off, Velocity Cut-off)
9. Filter (Type, Slope, Frequency Cut-off, Resonance, Envelope1 Cut-off)
10. 2 LFOs: one for Vibrato; one for modulation (Wave, Rate, Fade In, Sync, Retrig, Level)

So, which porgram type would you prefer for shaping sounds? Are there some specifc parameters that one program has that the other doesn't that you really need? Please feel free to leave your comments and discuss.

Askia Shaheed wrote:So, which porgram type would you prefer for shaping sounds? Are there some specifc parameters that one program has that the other doesn't that you really need? Please feel free to leave your comments and discuss.

TMK-The 5000 can't process user sampled waveforms through the synth engine nor can the the synth process external audio. With that being said the synth is completely removed from being a factor as far a shaping a sound.

Either could be used to create a given sound but only the sample engine can act on any given waveform while the synth is restricted to what was installed and programmed by the factory team. On a superficial level this may not mean much but if one wanted to seriously design a sound from ground up, the very foundation of the sound is highly restricted.

This thread is about a feature request some forum members wrote about. They want to use their own sampled waveforms as volatge controlled oscillators (VCO) and use synth parameters to shape the sound.

I wrote a list of all the synth program parameters as well as the sample program parameters. Many of the parameters are exactly the same which many forum members don't realize. (Blue Haze has posted links to tutorials about using a sampler as a powerful synth here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=75982). The sound shaping possibilities of the sampler section is not restricted at all. In fact, in many incidences, it is equal to or more powerful than the synth section (ie., the ADSR envelopes).

So running a sample through the synth section may not be needed. But if anyone feels that using your own samples as VCO waveforms is a more powerful option because of certain synth specific parameters, please feel free to leave your comments about which ones you need.

Well i don't know thing about how they design this sht to be honest i just know how to use it.I really don't think that you can use synth sample to shape sounds i would love to but i don't think its possible,however i have used combinator in reason and got similar results.What Synth mode needs at this point is to be able to browser all patches from ram/hd/cf and beeing able to preview them before loading them.

ToOxSicK wrote:Well i don't know thing about how they design this sht to be honest i just know how to use it.I really don't think that you can use synth sample to shape sounds i would love to but i don't think its possible,however i have used combinator in reason and got similar results.What Synth mode needs at this point is to be able to browser all patches from ram/hd/cf and beeing able to preview them before loading them.

Basically synths use a specific set of waveforms (sine, sawtooth, square, triangle, pulse, noise, etc) which can be shaped/layered and fed into filters, amps, envelopes, modulations, etc to create new sounds. Some forum members suggested that it would be great to use their own samples instead of the MPCs waveforms and adjust them using the synths parameters. But I don't believe many of them are aware that the filters, amps, and envelopes of the sampler section are equally or more powerful than the synth. Because of the way the synth is set-up, it appears that it has more parameters than the sampler section. But if the sampler section was laid out in a similar fashion, you would be able to see that it as just as many parameters as the synth. In fact, both the synth and sampler have parameters that are unique to them. The purpose of this thread is to address this unique parameters. Some people have voted but have not discussed why they made their choices.

I agree with you 100% on previewing synth patches from hard drives, CF card, etc. It's a possibility that this can be added with an OS uodate.

you guys are totally forgetting that there is even 'another' way, that is found quite often on subtractive synthesizers.

'vocoding'.

....or even if there were only an audio 'input' to create a similarity to vocoding.

but other than that, ...user sampled waveforms all the way.

anything and everything is possible, ..because this "is" the future! ; )

besides, you could always go back and just use the regular sampler. ...which would be used primarily for short samples like drum hits, ....long samples or looped samples would be used for melody, .....so you have the 'sampler-synth' totally interconnected in every possible way.

oneday2one wrote:you guys are totally forgetting that there is even 'another' way, that is found quite often on subtractive synthesizers.

'vocoding'.

....or even if there were only an audio 'input' to create a similarity to vocoding.

Your absolutely right !