I Need An Expert

I've seen this issue rarely addressed on the internet, but it's something I run into all the time when I'm working. I'm presenting it here because I'm thinking about getting a 5000 for this sole reason. It would be worth it to me.

I've had a 2500 with updated JJOS for a few years now. I love it. The features, workflow, etc. Often times when I have a sequence going with many stereo samples running at the same time, especially things that are being triggered fast, sounds start cutting each other off- sometimes randomly, sometimes in a pattern (and no I'm not talking about mono mode or mute groups- i know what those are and how to use them!). The problem starts to go away sometimes when I start trimming off the ends of some of my sounds that are moving fast, I guess thus using less memory in sequence(?)

But this is often a pretty big problem for me, because I sample a lot of synth sounds in stereo, and I use them rapidly in my sequences. So this happens a lot, and even though I can get around it with shortcuts sometimes, it ends up being a pain and an issue I deal with on almost every track I make.

My question is: will I have the same problem on the 5000? Or is there more memory available (or whatever the cause of the problem is) for each sequence? It's honestly worth it for me to upgrade to the 5000 for this issue alone.

PS- I have encountered this same issue on the 2000XL and 1000 as well as on my 2500. And spreading the sounds across multiple programs doesn't solve the problem either. Anyone out there with some input or advice? Sorry for the long posting but this is the only place I can think of where I could possibly find an answer. Thanks!

the mpc2500 has 32 voice polyphony, whereas the mpc5000 has 64, so it may help if you're really willing to make the switch. personally, i'd keep the 2500 and learn to limit your use of voices better... there really shouldn't be more than 32 voices sounding at once... things start sounding real cluttered... maybe convert some of those stereo samples to mono so they only use 1 voice instead of 2.

Thanks for the advice. It's crazy. I think some of my sounds must each take up 8-10 voices each or something. Is there a way to reduce that without converting them to mono? Maybe how I sample them in affects it somehow? It seems low when I do stereo samples from records, but when I sample myself playing one keyboard hit, that sample seems to take up so much memory. It's strange. Again thanks for the response.

In cases where the cuttoffs happen..

You could resample some of the combinations of samples that your triggering into 1 or more new samples.

It happen when a total of more than 32 notes, 16 samples, or some combination of the two are triggered at the same moment by the sequencer.

Instead of (in the case above) triggering 16 samples, replace that section of the song with say 1 sample of the mix of those 16 samples.
Or 4 samples each containing say 4 samples each that have been resampled..

Now your playing back 16 sampes at once but only triggering 1 pad.
Or triggering 4 pads each with a sample of 4 combined samples..

I dont actually remember if stereo samples count as 2 notes polyphony wise..
if not, in the 3rd sentence I meant


*"more than 32 notes, samples, or combo of the two"..

funkycoldmedina wrote:My question is: will I have the same problem on the 5000?

In the 4K or 5K it'll be far less of a problem.

A prime example of what used to kill my voices in the 32 note machines was ride cymbals. Sometimes the perfect ride HAD to remain in stereo because it sounded flat when converted to mono. So with a long natural decay and voices overlapping I was forever using up 10-16 of the available 32. Not good.

Since switching to the 4K I've ditched all the workarounds and haven't encountered any voice stealing up to now.

Yeah I think I gotta make the upgrade. I appreciate everyone's suggestions, but I just have too many things going on in my sequences all the time and this is always a big problem for me. I think I'm going with a 5k because the workflow seems real similar to the 2500. I know the 4k is a legend but I just don't have time right now to learn a whole new way of working.

resampling your samples will definitely help this. if you have a pad with 4 layered kicks, resample it to one sound, frees up 3 voices.

i've got a question for you: are you running all your audio out of the main LR outs? I had a similar problem with my 5K until I bought a mixer. I run all 10 available outs into the mix, and make sure to spread my samples/drums/synths apart. for example, tracks 1/2 are for bass, 3/4 for synth, 5/6 stereo drums, 7/8 samples (but obviously you are free to assign anything anywhere). my main outs are kinda there for any random samples or synths that get in the way of other sounds, so if i want to have two basses running parallel, i'll kick one out to the LR channel. or if i have two samples running parallel and they kind of step over each other, route them to different outs. this helps a ton, and is an option with the 2500 since it has all the extra outs. you might not need to change MPCs if this solution works for you. buy yourself a 10 channel mixer, test it out for a week and then return it if doesn't work. hope this helps!

Thanks for taking the time to write but I definitely use the 8-outs and an external mixer. I got my 5k, running it with 2.0 and I'm loving it so far, except trim mode is a little annoying. It's basically a 2500 but with more power and I haven't run into my polyphony problem yet.

noice
i figured you might already being using all the outs, but thought it was worth mentioning as it took me a minute to discover this.
just out of curiosity, what kind of music are you making with it?

Mostly electronic, some hip-hop. I haven't made the full switch to DAWs yet because I've been using MPCs since the 90s and I love them too much.

This is the drawback of JJ OS, he has given you a lot of incredible features but some of those things are voice heavy.
When he added the instrument groups I loved what I could sit and do on the 1k but it didn't take long to realize that a couple of chords a bassline and some drums could get greedy on voices.

Sometimes you were in the mood for the works rounds sometimes you just found it easier to use one of the bigger MPCs or the MV.