Ren Vintage Mode - Im impressed - What do you think?

NIKFAR wrote:Hi Jah, the virtual output of 1&2 are different to the others as this is the only output that outputs in vintage mode even using the usb to output into the daw. shame!!!

I see.

I never really use the Vintage Mode. I may turn it on every once in awhile because I am curious to see how a sequence sounds with it on. Other than that, I leave it off.

Both Pete and Dan frequent the forum. You can send them a PM and point to this thread.

ill do just that very thing.
We need a proper statement about whats going on, or what their intention was/is

Jonespnice1 wrote:
One thing that everyone always talked about was the extra punch that the MPC 60/3000/2000 would give you compared to other samplers, Dan said the output gain staging was identical to the MPC 3000, now that combined with the emulation (which is software) will give you the full emulation sound. I can tell a difference.

Yes I can clearly hear the difference. But is the Ren emulation on, and if so which one?

labcoats wrote:Yes I can clearly hear the difference. But is the Ren emulation on, and if so which one?

I didn't have any of the emulations selected. The difference in the Ren's output is slight but it still adds a little more character to the sound, so that along with the emulation definitely gives you a more solid sound than without using the Ren's outputs.

Wow, thats quite a difference with no emulation on. Interesting..

I don't have another interface I can try at the moment as my studio room is down
for refurbishment. When its up and running I will have to do a bit of testing my self.

Jonespnice1 wrote:

toxicc wrote:

JAH wrote:Dan said it multiple times and even at this year's Namm that the outputs of the Ren contribute to the Vintage sound. He said the Vintage Mode is both software and hardware.

No he did not say that, but that's what he wanted us to hear. He've been asked if it was software emulation, and he 'answered' by saying that the 'mpc 3000' outputs helps to give punch to the sound. It's like if you're asking a cars saleman if the car runs on diesel or gasoline and he answer that the gas consumtion is low. He really did NOT answer the question.

I believe that the Ren's output definitely contributes to the sound of the emulations, check out the YouTube video comparison I did

.

One thing that everyone always talked about was the extra punch that the MPC 60/3000/2000 would give you compared to other samplers, Dan said the output gain staging was identical to the MPC 3000, now that combined with the emulation (which is software) will give you the full emulation sound. I can tell a difference.

This is cool. But what about comparing the Ren's outputs to the Ren's offline exporting or plugin tracking? This is the comparison I have made. Didn't really notice much difference. I haven't compared the Ren to my 003 though!

DJ Hellfire wrote:
This is cool. But what about comparing the Ren's outputs to the Ren's offline exporting or plugin tracking? This is the comparison I have made. Didn't really notice much difference. I haven't compared the Ren to my 003 though!

I haven't compared it that way yet, but when I had my MPC 2000 and 4000 I really never liked the tracked out sounds compared to bouncing/recording the whole stereo buss at once into my DAW, it always seemed like I would loose a little bit of thump.

labcoats wrote:

i don't know if the outputs have anything to do with vintage mode but they do contribute to the vintage sound imo. the ren's outputs sound better than my soundcard.

Can I ask what your other sound card is?

m audio delta 1010lt

Jonespnice1 wrote:I haven't compared it that way yet, but when I had my MPC 2000 and 4000 I really never liked the tracked out sounds compared to bouncing/recording the whole stereo buss at once into my DAW, it always seemed like I would loose a little bit of thump.

I can relate to that. Even when I've rendered stuff from one Daw to mix in another I have sometimes felt something changed. This is despite rendering via the master outs to achieve the exact same levels (no fader adjustments required). Havent really noticed anything with my 4k, but I didnt really use it for a whole song. In saying that, the only software I fully trust to render exactly is Pro tools.

When i first started using Ableton Live when it was releases way back in 2002 I complained that songs didint sound the same after rendering. I had no idea what it was as this was early Daw years . I kept at it right up to version 5 - usually being called an idiot on the Ableton forum. Then Ableton sort of admitted they had changed the mix buss coding and thng's should be better - Absolutely because my early Live version 2-5 tunes I made sound like total arse. 5 was better, but I felt something was still wrong. Around Live 6 they sneaked an addition in to the manual suggesting that to keep the integrity of a rendered file intact its best to render at 32 bit. Oh really! Thanks for the heads up five years later....

I started rendering at 32 bit of course - and still would if I used live. By the time Live 7 arrived I did feel things had improved a lot - but not perfect. That non perfection I eventually realised was down to its shoddy latency compensation - still there in Live 8. Simply creating and sending stuff to busses creates all sorts of mess, including messing with the groove (the loss of groove was what I absolutely felt). it was only last year some folks on the gearslutz forum started speaking about the latency compensation stuff I realised that was the problem. It messed with the sound, and the groove - proving to me that when using a Daw even stuff randomly moved in micro increments can create havoc. Very very subtle but I never had so much problems with any software getting a groove. For years I battled with that software. Even with Live 9 they have seemingly made improvements to the mix buss Im personally not convinced the internal latency thing has been fixed as I never saw any mention of it.


After that ramble...
Point is a complete song playing live - in real time from the Ren could sound different over an internally rendered song, or individually rendered tracks/parts. May not be noticeable individually, but perhaps when all parts are summed in a Daw?... When the Rens mixer starts to get more comprehensive I will definitely err on the side of caution due to my experience with Ableton Live. Akai are very new to this side of the game after all - So essentially if your tune is rocking as you hear it live, it makes sense to record what you hear. This is not a criticism of Akai - I don't expect them to get everything right first time around.


yeah that was a long one - I type fast..