[request] Constant midi clock, even when MPC stopped

innovine wrote:i think the point is to be able to stop the mpc to do some edit, but leaving the rest of the gear running, and then somehow starting the mpc again at rigt right time. not sure how youd sync that tho.

well if the rest of the gear has some kind of beat playing then you'd just hit play according to the beat, the MPC should start playing right away and in sync.

This method works for the Rm1x running together with the Korg MS2000R.

astronaut wrote:

innovine wrote:i think the point is to be able to stop the mpc to do some edit, but leaving the rest of the gear running, and then somehow starting the mpc again at rigt right time. not sure how youd sync that tho.

well if the rest of the gear has some kind of beat playing then you'd just hit play according to the beat, the MPC should start playing right away and in sync.

This method works for the Rm1x running together with the Korg MS2000R.

I understand this request although I would think you would have realized that the
MPC did not send constant clock thus not optimal to be used as master in your midi
chain.I am not for or against this request as long as it is a selected constant clock
on/off request.

TYPO wrote:I am not for or against this request as long as it is a selected constant clock
on/off request.

yep. I don't think it would require a lot of coding to have an on/off switch.

Ooooooo kayyyyyy...... Even more confusion here now. Though I know some of you get it. For the rest, I do have to admit that last post might not have been completley clear to you but people didn't seem to have quite as much of a problem with this stuff the last time the issue came up as it was requested by user thedvs1 on this now ancient thread from the (pre?) JJv2 days:

viewtopic.php?f=25&t=85866&hilit=sync&start=15


Now if you still don't get it, the first thing I would recomend is to look at a complete table of midi standard messages:

http://www.midi.org/techspecs/midimessages.php

If you actually read through all the seperate messages and what they do, you will understand that:

1) The MIDI CLOCK message has nothing to do with starting, stopping or restarting sequencers. It only tells the sequencer what speed to run at. That's it.

2) Seqencer running status IS controlled by MIDI STOP/START/CONTINUE. No, not Midi Machine Control messages as those are a seperate set of messages added post-midi v1 and intended for use in conjunction with MIDI TIME CODE and pro audio recorders.

So, if your setup requires constant clock but you still want to control running status for all connected sequencers you need a master seq that sends STOP/START/CONTINUE when you hit the master trasport buttons and a clock signal that runs all the time. I think this is the option the OP is looking for.

On the other hand we now have some in the thread who still want a constant master sync but with independent control of connected and syncronised sequencers running status. In that case you need a master seq that still sends clock all the time but does not send STOP/START/CONTINUE when the master transport buttons are pressed (that's assuming you don't have the option of filtering S/S/C before or at the recieving device).

Both of these requests are valid. There are also reasons why you would want the MPC to behave exactly the way it already does with clock but we've already got that functionality so I won't get into it. Suffice to say that a three way toggle would be optimum.

elektrik_muz wrote:Ooooooo kayyyyyy...... Even more confusion here now. Though I know some of you get it. For the rest, I do have to admit that last post might not have been completley clear to you but people didn't seem to have quite as much of a problem with this stuff the last time the issue came up as it was requested by user thedvs1 on this now ancient thread from the (pre?) JJv2 days:

http://mpc-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f=2 ... c&start=15


Now if you still don't get it, the first thing I would recomend is to look at a complete table of midi standard messages:

http://www.midi.org/techspecs/midimessages.php

If you actually read through all the seperate messages and what they do, you will understand that:

1) The MIDI CLOCK message has nothing to do with starting, stopping or restarting sequencers. It only tells the sequencer what speed to run at. That's it.

2) Seqencer running status IS controlled by MIDI STOP/START/CONTINUE. No, not Midi Machine Control messages as those are a seperate set of messages added post-midi v1 and intended for use in conjunction with MIDI TIME CODE and pro audio recorders.

So, if your setup requires constant clock but you still want to control running status for all connected sequencers you need a master seq that sends STOP/START/CONTINUE when you hit the master trasport buttons and a clock signal that runs all the time. I think this is the option the OP is looking for.

On the other hand we now have some in the thread who still want a constant master sync but with independent control of connected and syncronised sequencers running status. In that case you need a master seq that still sends clock all the time but does not send STOP/START/CONTINUE when the master transport buttons are pressed (that's assuming you don't have the option of filtering S/S/C before or at the recieving device).

Both of these requests are valid. There are also reasons why you would want the MPC to behave exactly the way it already does with clock but we've already got that functionality so I won't get into it. Suffice to say that a three way toggle would be optimum.

Give it a rest with the midi 101 as I feel you both are talking down and even more confused yourself with what constant clock means to a extensive chain.

TYPO wrote:Give it a rest with the midi 101...

Hey, where else do you send somebody who doesn't understand midi, especially when they demonstrate their ignorance in the most obnoxious and arrogant manner possible? I'm just putting the facts out there, don't like it, don't read it.

TYPO wrote:...as I feel you both are talking down...

Ok for the sake of an argument lets assume it was "talking down" as you put it. Who do you think it was "talking down" to? You? Why would you think that? Do you have self-esteem problems? FYI that post had nothing to do with anything you posted in thiis thread.

TYPO wrote:....and even more confused yourself with what constant clock means to a extensive chain.

Now you can give it a rest because nothing in my post had anything to do with running an "extensive chain" and made no presumption of such. It was about adding a switchable clock feature to the MPC 1000. Did you read it?

Ah but since you so kindly bring up the subject of running an "extensive chain" you now have to suffer my standard advice on the subject (blame yourself).

My advice on running an "extensive chain" with midi is... DON'T. If timing matters with more than three devices, you always run in paralel through a patchbay. That's standard advice for working with midi. There's some things you can get away with running a daisy chain but you want max flexability and performance with midi you have to go paralel, preferably with filtering.

TYPO wrote:No word on the snooze button?

Mine says "SNOOZE"

Mine says "SNOOZE"[/quote]

I agree I hope my parallel and daisy chain are still set to 10 minutes.

TYPO wrote:Mine says "SNOOZE"

I agree I hope my parallel and daisy chain are still set to 10 minutes.

Whoa... with tech knowledge like that you should be working for Akai Pro.

Ahh, Internet.

What a heated thread for a perfectly valid request.
I was kinda amazed yesterday to see my friends' MPC1000 doesnt send midi clock when stopped.
Most midi devices do send clock when stopped (Roland TR boxes, Hardware sequencers like the QY700 etc,...). The only "devices" I know of that don't do it are most DAW's (except Renoise).

Always sending clock is needed to sync delays, feed clock converters that rely on approximation algorythms, arpeggio's,. ...

So constant MIDI clock, yes please!

Before we go any further debating the validity of such a feature request, can someone please tell what would be the exact real world use case where such a feature would be absolutely necessary? You can switch sequences or mute all playing tracks if you just need to mute sounds/notes. For being able to load samples, now then, that would require a stop, but one could load up stuff prior to starting playback, no?

I'm just thinking that incorporating this feature into JJOS might be difficult if not even impossible.. AFAIK all MPCs have frustrating aspects that require stopping of playback, usually easier to adjust workflow instead.

it has nothing to do with "stopping playback"
its just about sending midi beat clock at all times, just like 99% of midi hardware does.

I cannot speak for all MPC's, but I know for sure that the MPC60 always sends clock, regardless of whether it is playing or stopped.

tsutek wrote:can someone please tell what would be the exact real world use case where such a feature would be absolutely necessary?

I just did:

Always sending clock is needed to sync delays, feed clock converters that rely on approximation algorythms, arpeggio's,. ...

Well if you just need it to be on all the time to cater to your clockslaves, ie. not doing anything on the mpc itself that would require stopping, why can't you just have the mpc playing all the time? This I really don't get.. It's just one green LED to ignore, no biggie.

Thats not the point.
the point is when i press start, i want my clock converters (who rely on approximation to get higher resolution than 24 ppqn) to generate decent clock right away, not after ± one bar. Lot's of midi slave devices rely on approximation.

Again, 99% of midi hardware does this, why can't JJOS do it? Why is there even discussion about something which is standardized almost everywhere else?

also, when i press stop, I want whatever tempo-synced delay effects I have running to fade out gracefully, not to jump to whatever the device does when Midi Beat Clock stops.

Leaving the MPC running at all times kinda defies the purpose of a sync master device.. I can't even see how I could use it in the studio if I'm not allowed to press stop Invite my friends over and ask them to press play simultaneously on all my sync-slave devices?