Share your knowledge on these two classic MPCs
By cane beatz1 Sun Jul 24, 2022 9:18 pm
Does anyone feel like they have lost something on the timing after upgrading from 2.12 to 3.15 ?

I used to use the MPC60 heavily back in the 90s and the timing always had something magical about it, I know I don't have the extra features of 3.15 but I feel like there is something slightly off with the newer 3.10 or 3.15 OS
It sort feels looser and so it feels like it takes longer to get those breakbeats sitting tight with each other.

I know most peeps must be thinking this is ridiculous but I swear the 2.12 has something else going on that makes everything sit tighter, anyone have any thoughts?

Also, I remember fully well when the MPC3000 was released in 93/94 and was exciting and of course is legendary and prob the king of all MPCs but even back then, I remember feeling like the feel, the way the beats dropped was looser and took some getting used to, I wasn't sold on it for a long time.

thoughts ?
By thabutcha Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:45 am
What you are implying might be true. I’m using Vimana 3.15

But I personally feel that the timing comes from how “tight” or “dirty” you chop your samples.

Also

It might have to do with the processing power of the 60 and how elaborate your compositions are. If you have a lot of tracks plus CC info and program changes I can see how the timing might drift.

Personally I love my 60 for the Simple workflow and the 12-bit crunch. Modern sequencers can emulate any vibe you are looking for timing wise
By cane beatz1 Thu Jul 28, 2022 3:26 pm
yep that would make sense, the MPC3000can handle a lot more data with its processor, I imagine, soinstalling the 3.10 or 3.15 must take a toll on the MPC60 processor I guess and therefore must take away something in notes and timing... I also really love the sound
By CoastCoaster Fri Aug 05, 2022 11:36 pm
So I don’t have a clock test and that would be interesting to have. I will say that new functions do not necessarily have to interfere with timing. A good programmer like Rohan would have known to avoid messing up the key portions of playback/ recording. New stuff in the Hybrid windows disk area for example should not affect timing because they are only called outside of the playback/ recording zone.

The only person who can really settle this issue is David at Innerclock. His page is linked below. He has the numbers for the 60. But no OS version. David was in the loop with Rohan and he might have or be able to get the numbers.

Also as you may know Rohan passed last year and his friends said there may be some revived OS versions to come.

https://www.innerclocksystems.com/litmus
By cane beatz1 Sun Sep 04, 2022 11:58 am
Today I took the plunge and tried installing OS 2.12 and it’s a bit nerve racking because I have a fully upgraded to the max, beautiful MPC60 MK 1 with all the trimmings but I have decades of experience with the 60 and I knew that this 3.10 and 3.15 vimana was changing the feel or timing.

And boy was I right!

I installed the EPROMs and fired it up and reacquainted myself with the old OS and straight away the timing felt 100% on point - much tighter and just much easier to beat match breakbeats, I’m absolutely gobsmacked for the last 10 years I just felt like the 60 wasn’t as good as I remember but it was the freaking OS.

Now I just have to figure out connecting a floppy drive as I have an SCSI SD emulator that no longer works unless I upgrade to 2.14.
For now I’ll test more but if anyone knows where I can get a ribbon cable to connect the floppy drive that would be awesome

Or if it is a generic floppy ribbon cable if anyone knows the name or an online site ?

Thanks

Cane
User avatar
By richie Tue Sep 06, 2022 2:30 pm
You will experience a difference in timing when downgrading from Vimana 3.15 back to 2.12.

The timing on Vimana is tighter and much more accurate due to the increased PPQ in the firmware code.

I know a decent amount of people that have had the same complaints, that the feeling they had in earlier ROM versions was lost when upgrading to 3.15 but when looking into it more, as I said above, the increased PPQ resolution will make someone that doesn't have great physical timing programming with quantize off stand out more.

About your other issue - Logically it has nothing to do with a ribbon connector, the disk drive connector is not a SCSI connector so don't bother trying that unless you intend to fry your SCSI emulator. Unless you're calling the SCSI emulator the Floppy Emulator, then it not working when downgrading to 2.12 is something else all together.

If what you have is an actual SCSI SD unit, You're going to have to upgrade to at least 3.10 if you want your SCSI working the way you want again. Or install Vimana back in and get used to the better timing and improved SCSI handling.
By KTMPC3K Mon Jan 23, 2023 7:17 am
In the late 90’s I purchased the 3.10 upgrade and SCSI board directly from Roger Linn. I had used my MPC60 with OS 2.12 for a couple of years ans was very familiar with the timing and feel of my sequences. Within a day of installing OS 3.10 and the SCSI board, I could instantly tell that something was off with the timing when I played back my sequences done with OS 2.12

I immediately thought that maybe I had done something wrong with the SCSI board installation. So, I decided to call Roger Linn and ask what the problem could be. He seemed slightly irritated and basically told me that there was nothing in the SCSI upgrade that would cause timing issues and that it was just in my head. I just accepted his response. It never occurred to me that it could have been OS 3.10. Seeing this post makes me feel better thay it wasn’t just in my head.

So is it the SCSI board or the OS 3.10 and later that is causing the issue?

I guess OS 2.14 would help to pinpoint the problem, however, OS 2.14 EPROMs or code is impossible to find. Anyone with OS 2.14 willing to dump the code?
User avatar
By Dusty Snares Thu Jul 20, 2023 1:58 am
I still use the 2.12os till this day Ive also tried 3.15 and think 2.12 is better but I don't just think timing sounds better I also thought the pitch adjustment on the tune drums screen made my samples sounded warmer when tuned up or down when compared to the 3.15os sounded like crap.
User avatar
By Dusty Snares Thu Jul 20, 2023 2:52 pm
mr_debauch wrote:yeah but it's worth not having to save the sequence all the time


yeah I know what you mean. I used to make entire beats on the 60 2.12os and every once in awhile I would have to go back and sample more which deletes the sequence but now I just sync the 60 with the mpc2000 and I do my drums on the 60 and chop my samples on the 2000 so I don't run into that problem anymore.
User avatar
By mr_debauch Fri Jul 21, 2023 12:49 pm
right.. i suppose that is a work around... i might just make the whole beat on the 2000 in that scenario
User avatar
By Dusty Snares Fri Jul 21, 2023 2:17 pm
mr_debauch wrote:right.. i suppose that is a work around... i might just make the whole beat on the 2000 in that scenario


I prefer the mpc60s swing and quantizing more then the 2000s and I sync it thru external so I trigger the 2000s sounds with the 60.