MPC Key 61 vs Force + MIDI keyboard controller

Hi guys! I am not sure which option would suit me better. I am not familiar with any of AKAI units as this will be my first time owning it. I want to use it in standalone mode (away from PC) and will not make beats but will mostly use melodic instruments. I just need simple to use and intuitive hardware sequencer to work on ideas for songs. I prefer to use keys over pads for melodic instruments, just need pads for one acoustic drum track. As far as I understand, Force workflow is more like Ableton DAW but I am not familiar with Ableton but am prepared to learn if the Ableton/Force workflow would suit me better. I also tend to record more variations of the same track and working on different harmonies and such. I also make a lot of mistakes so need a quick way to undo last sequence layer. And the thing I like about Force is disk streaming as I would like to use bigger size multisampled instruments. Thanks so much

the Force is (i think) intended more as a live performance machine, hence the disk streaming and arranger mode. that is, you "play" the Force moreso than an MPC One or Live/X within the box itself. if your intention is to play keyboard parts live with accompaniment from the MPC as backing/rhythm tracks, probably don't need all the bells and whistles of a Force? the load time for projects on a non-Force MPC is usually under 30 seconds so unless you know you want uninterrupted songs, disk streaming might not be a dealbreaker.

(i don't use a DAW or abelton so i can't speak to that side of the Force)

I use the force with 88-key Midi Controller & I also used a MPC since 2005.
Keep in mind the Force & MPC is about 80% the same. Based on the fact that you like to make lots of idea & hopefully be able to manage & access them in a more visual & easy way, it's the Force all day!
The Force seq has a clip based sequencer but you can use it like a MPC style Seq.

The Force/MPC both have 128 tracks per "Sequence" (this is call a "Launch Scene" on the Force but us on the Darkside just calls them "Scenes" ), but the Force has 999 clips per track, I don't know what the MPCs Seq limit but I think its 128 - Does anyone know the limit?

Each clip can be different sizes; 1bar, 2.3bars, whatever, this kinds of make up for the lack of time-sig changes other than 4/4. Also you can't change the tempo per scene like you can on the MPC so you'll need to do that by hand or use a ext clock. As a work around you can resample the scenes at diff tempos, then seq them together. I never done but it should work hopefully.

Disk-streaming allows you make long ass jams or record you whole band practice or live-set, even play back a whole audio-book (they be having dope quotes to sample).
The Force has better macros & this is where it really takes things to another level - if your willing to put in the time to set them up. There also the 16 Envolpe followers that can be use as 16 LFOs. Here's a Macro-thread for way more info:https://www.mpc-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=216161

Also the 8x8 pads of the Force lets you set them up to emulate a 4 oct piano with each oct stacked on top. Check the manual for "Note Modes". It still not as good as real key but it's waaaay better then the MPCs 4x4 pads design.

This demo may help you:



Anyway keep us post on your decision.

Force (or any MPC) + MIDI Keyboard, this is a no brainer.

The reason is simple: flexibility, immediacy when it comes to assigning keys to a track and drumpads to another track, which would require defining keyranges on the MPC Key, a tedious workflow.

I am thinking about exactly this for years now ... Force vs MPC. It's so complex that imho there is no clear path here. And even though I am using the MPC even though I initially wanted a Force the question bothers me till this day.

The main things for me might be summarised as follows

Force:
- Ableton Live flow for creating, arranging, playing live w/ Push-2 feel
- you stay mainly in your device
- Focus on creation/getting ideas out and playing live

MPC:
- Controller mode
- Focus on producing and arranging - thinking about the final product earlier makes for cleaner procedures imho
- exploding Drum tracks

Everything else is the same really.

The Ableton Workflow is a hit or miss. You either like it or not vs more linear flow. I know both sides and cannot decide.

Keygroups can be used on both devices for multisampled instruments. And might be the best way to use them anyway independent of disk streaming.
Undo and variations is easy on both.
Disk streaming is great but you might not need it.

Both MPC and Force are different in a way that makes it possible to own both without regret but similar enough to switch between them and not feel like you are learning a new device.

If money is no issue I'd say get both and send one back. Or try to use both in a shop and see. It's really details that may make or break one device. For me it's Controller Mode and Drum Exploding that break the Force for me. For others it's the Ableton workflow that breaks the MPC.

Both are unfortunately/fortunately too complicated or feature rich to really get to know well enough by testing at a shop. There have to an understanding from the user/buyer of how fundamentally they way the like to create & determines which of the 2 have the best workflow their needs. Which actually may be to buy/steal both to really get to bottom of it....or read both manuals I dare suggest.

I still think most MPC users would be better with the Force & MPC style MIDI controller if you got fat finger. If not the Force pads are actually better for playing...once you adapt to them & properly adjust the pads sensitivity levels.

B-Wise wrote:I still think most MPC users would be better with the Force & MPC style MIDI controller if you got fat finger. If not the Force pads are actually better for playing...once you adapt to them & properly adjust the pads sensitivity levels.

For me it boils down to the two main things:
Drum explode and Controller Mode. Yes I know you don't need Drum explode. But I have found so many advantages in it that I feel hindered when it's not there. Same with Controller Mode. It's so much easier to transition from MPC to Studio One (Where I do not only my final mixing but some piping through for other stuff). And in Controller Mode I can still access all Midi devices from the MPC as well as S1 at the same time. And use the MPC audio interface.

Do you know by any chance if the Force can do that and is still usable? Meaning: all midi gear is connected to the Force to use it as a midi interface and use the connected midi devices in the Force and also in my PC DAW at the same time? Same for the audio interface. Can I make music on the force with the internal synths and samples and route each of the 32 channels to the PC while doing so? This is something I did not test yet. The last time I had the Force I wasn't even coming to the point where I would test it because it lacked other things then that are included/fixed now. If these two things would work, then I might give the Force another try at some point.

mrmarbury wrote:

B-Wise wrote:I still think most MPC users would be better with the Force & MPC style MIDI controller if you got fat finger. If not the Force pads are actually better for playing...once you adapt to them & properly adjust the pads sensitivity levels.

For me it boils down to the two main things:
Drum explode and Controller Mode. Yes I know you don't need Drum explode. But I have found so many advantages in it that I feel hindered when it's not there. Same with Controller Mode. It's so much easier to transition from MPC to Studio One (Where I do not only my final mixing but some piping through for other stuff). And in Controller Mode I can still access all Midi devices from the MPC as well as S1 at the same time. And use the MPC audio interface.

Do you know by any chance if the Force can do that and is still usable? Meaning: all midi gear is connected to the Force to use it as a midi interface and use the connected midi devices in the Force and also in my PC DAW at the same time? Same for the audio interface. Can I make music on the force with the internal synths and samples and route each of the 32 channels to the PC while doing so? This is something I did not test yet. The last time I had the Force I wasn't even coming to the point where I would test it because it lacked other things then that are included/fixed now. If these two things would work, then I might give the Force another try at some point.

I use it in standalone mode so I can't answer.

B-Wise wrote:I use it in standalone mode so I can't answer.

Alright. Will ask that in the right sub-forum again. Just thought you might know.

I love my MPC Key 61 and think it’s the best MPC you can buy. It’s an incredibly powerful sampling/synth/sequencing workstation that lets you do pretty much all your music production inside the box. The advantage of a workstation built around a sampler cannot be understated imo. It really enhances the creative process and provides a lot of utility. And having an integrated keyboard along with drum pads provides for a very cohesive workflow

I think if you are coming from a more traditonal DAW like Logic, the MPC would be easier to get around, conversely, if you are familiar with ableton, than maybe
the Force would be the better choice.

Anyway, I highly recommend the MPC 61. If I was on the market for a single standalone music production workstation that would be it.

mrmarbury wrote:I am thinking about exactly this for years now ... Force vs MPC. It's so complex that imho there is no clear path here. And even though I am using the MPC even though I initially wanted a Force the question bothers me till this day.

i'm also a One user who is constantly side-eyeing the Force..
like i know the real answer is "just run both".. but it's a lot of desk real-estate (and the desire to just keep it simple)

underblu wrote:I love my MPC Key 61 and think it’s the best MPC you can buy. It’s an incredibly powerful sampling/synth/sequencing workstation that lets you do pretty much all your music production inside the box. The advantage of a workstation built around a sampler cannot be understated imo. It really enhances the creative process and provides a lot of utility. And having an integrated keyboard along with drum pads provides for a very cohesive workflow

I think if you are coming from a more traditonal DAW like Logic, the MPC would be easier to get around, conversely, if you are familiar with ableton, than maybe
the Force would be the better choice.

Anyway, I highly recommend the MPC 61. If I was on the market for a single standalone music production workstation that would be it.

Mind you the Force can be used like an mpc sequencer so there no advantage as long as you play only the clips on the same scene at a time...but you don't have to & that's the advantage the Force has. The advantages is Tempo changes per sequence & the MPC DAW. But just get a little external seq like the One or if that's too much over lap or you want something smaller but with a more powerful sequencer get something like the Pyramid which has 64 tracks each with 32 clips that can be different bars lengths & time-signatures, plus it has an Euclidean seq for them funky rhythms.