Hidden Mpc modes

Did you know there are hidden Mpc song and next sequence modes within the force, I’ve known for some time but I didn’t think they worked, but they do albeit fiddly.
Essentially an arrangement is a sequence. So in next sequence mode, if you select another sequence, the arranger goes blank enabling a new arrangement to be recorded.
These arrangements/sequences can then be strung together in song mode and even converted to a new sequence/arrangement.
I’ve found this out because I use the Hakai firmware and I made a midi learn template in the Mpc software to externally control the standalone Mpc and some of the functions control the force too, including song and next sequence mode.

Wul wrote:Did you know there are hidden Mpc song and next sequence modes within the force, I’ve known for some time but I didn’t think they worked, but they do albeit fiddly.
Essentially an arrangement is a sequence. So in next sequence mode, if you select another sequence, the arranger goes blank enabling a new arrangement to be recorded.
These arrangements/sequences can then be strung together in song mode and even converted to a new sequence/arrangement.
I’ve found this out because I use the Hakai firmware and I made a midi learn template in the Mpc software to externally control the standalone Mpc and some of the functions control the force too, including song and next sequence mode.

That's really great, but how can this be done on the Force that not hacked?
I never seen next sequence mode on the Force.

B-Wise wrote:

Wul wrote:Did you know there are hidden Mpc song and next sequence modes within the force, I’ve known for some time but I didn’t think they worked, but they do albeit fiddly.
Essentially an arrangement is a sequence. So in next sequence mode, if you select another sequence, the arranger goes blank enabling a new arrangement to be recorded.
These arrangements/sequences can then be strung together in song mode and even converted to a new sequence/arrangement.
I’ve found this out because I use the Hakai firmware and I made a midi learn template in the Mpc software to externally control the standalone Mpc and some of the functions control the force too, including song and next sequence mode.

That's really great, but how can this be done on the Force that not hacked?
I never seen next sequence mode on the Force.

Yea it needs to be hacked for sure . There’s a post and video on the akai force warranty voiders Facebook group of a guy showing a slightly different way of doing it .

Does that other way needs to be hacked as well?
How many arrangement seq can it do?

B-Wise wrote:Does that other way needs to be hacked as well?
How many arrangement seq can it do?

Yes afraid so.
The Mpc can have up to 128 sequences. So I guess that’s what it is.

I'm not & don't really want to sign up to Facebook so is there another way to download the hack?

B-Wise wrote:I'm not & don't really want to sign up to Facebook so is there another way to download the hack?

No not really, although there’s github

Wul wrote:

B-Wise wrote:I'm not & don't really want to sign up to Facebook so is there another way to download the hack?

No not really, although there’s github

Do you have a link & is it free? Thanks

Does the set of launch clips change as well, when you switch sequences? To me it has been quite clear that the arrangement is an MPC sequence internally, but I've also thought that the launch clips are tracks inside the same sequence.

HouseWithoutMouse wrote:Does the set of launch clips change as well, when you switch sequences? To me it has been quite clear that the arrangement is an MPC sequence internally, but I've also thought that the launch clips are tracks inside the same sequence.

I don't know, but I doubt that would be the case, nor would I want it to be. Though I can see good reasons for it.

As you mentioned about me in another post, I may not get what you mean, but I see the clips as pattern variations of the same track & each 999 launch row/scene as an MPC sequence.

Since each track can have 999 clips, if we had multiple Arrangements instead of just 1, it would mean that the clip matrix can used as a clip pool for different projects/songs, but still be limited to the same 8 plugins & 8 audio track. If each different clip matrix allows for different plugins/audio tracks then that's the good thing I was talking about.

Also, since the tempo can't be changed you would still have to do that externally which is inconvenient but easy to do for each new Arrangement.

Akai please add tempo changes! Or can it be done with the hack?

HouseWithoutMouse wrote:Does the set of launch clips change as well, when you switch sequences? To me it has been quite clear that the arrangement is an MPC sequence internally, but I've also thought that the launch clips are tracks inside the same sequence.

Agreed, that’s what I think too , plus Mpc programs are force tracks.
Although it takes a bit of getting your head round.
Also, force scenes are Mpc mute groups. I say that because in my aforementioned iPad Mpc controller made from a midi learn template. I have created what can only be described as 128 mute groups when on the track mute page.

B-Wise wrote:

HouseWithoutMouse wrote:Does the set of launch clips change as well, when you switch sequences? To me it has been quite clear that the arrangement is an MPC sequence internally, but I've also thought that the launch clips are tracks inside the same sequence.

I don't know, but I doubt that would be the case, nor would I want it to be. Though I can see good reasons for it.

As you mentioned about me in another post, I may not get what you mean, but I see the clips as pattern variations of the same track & each 999 launch row/scene as an MPC sequence.

Since each track can have 999 clips, if we had multiple Arrangements instead of just 1, it would mean that the clip matrix can used as a clip pool for different projects/songs, but still be limited to the same 8 plugins & 8 audio track. If each different clip matrix allows for different plugins/audio tracks then that's the good thing I was talking about.

Also, since the tempo can't be changed you would still have to do that externally which is inconvenient but easy to do for each new Arrangement.

Akai please add tempo changes! Or can it be done with the hack?

Regarding tempo changes , on the aforementioned Facebook group a member posted a video with automated tempo changes . You ought to check it out, because he’s also created a Euclidean sequencer and a subtractive sequencer , both can run in the background on the force and Mpc.

Wul wrote:Regarding tempo changes , on the aforementioned Facebook group a member posted a video with automated tempo changes . You ought to check it out, because he’s also created a Euclidean sequencer and a subtractive sequencer , both can run in the background on the force and Mpc.

A euclidean sequencer is something I've been wanting on the Force after first using it on the Pyramid in 2019. I don't know what a subtractive sequencer is. If I can't find it on the Git hub link then I guess I'll join Facebook just for that Thanks for taking the time to share all this info.

Also, just noticed within a saved project file the arrangement is referred to as sequence 1

Yeah, a Force Track is a mute-grouped stack of MPC tracks using the same MPC program. I've been saying that a Force project is an MPC sequence, and I drew a picture about how I think things in the Force user interface map to MPC things under the hood viewtopic.php?p=1847858#p1847858

Since Force 3.1 there's now even Bus Automation, and that stuff must be implemented using similar Track thingies as well, because it behaves just like MIDI tracks. (brilliant feature, by the way)

It's good to know that the other sequences are there, it opens theoretical possibilities for future enhancements. It might be useful for switching between songs in a set. If a Force project is an MPC sequence, why not load multiple MPC sequences? It's just that each sequence has to have its own separate set of Programs as well, and this will eat a LOT of memory, and managing the mixer could involve non-trivial decisions when combining projects with different routings and submix/return effects. When adding another sequence by loading the Force project from disk, each sequence would either need to have its own mixer and submixes and returns etc, or there would need to be a way to specify how the routings and submixes in the projects are combined.

To deal with mixer routings and memory and CPU consumption issues, I think there needs to be an explicitly supported concept of "Force Project Group", where it's possible to specify which programs are shared between sequences, and how the mixer routings work between sequences. And where you could assign some tracks to be common between sequences so that they're not muted when you swap sequences i.e. songs... smooth transitions between songs!

(now that I think about it... since Force projects are XML data and WAV files on disk, I wonder if it would be possible to write a project merger contraption that could be used to construct sets by combining multiple projects)

If you switch to another sequence in the hacked Force, do you get a fresh set of Submixes, or does it use the same ones between sequences?