The Force.

When I look at an Akai Force, I can't help but to just prefer a Ableton Push 3 the instead. No Idea why. Maybe the layout I just prefer more on Ableton Push 3. I know the Akai Professional Force is not portable due to it's size but I also know it can be used without a A/C power cord like the MPC Live mk2. But all in all. It's the same type of appeal to each. Different manufacturer, same competitive models. I just don't know, from non experience which would have the better work flow.

More info on the type of music your trying to create on the Force & your preferred workflow would be helpful.

I know the Force is good for CV Clip Mode and styles of DnB, Dance, EDM and that style. I personally prefer Sample Based Hip Hop, specifically boom bap, g funk, jazz, soul influenced records. That is the direction I'd prefer.

It really depends on what you want to do.

If you want to grab some stuff from Ableton and shove it into a performance box and go nuts, the Push 3 is the thing.

If you're looking for a studio master that will do soup-to-nuts standalone production with everything from detailed sound design through to a final render, the Push 3 doesn't really do that. You can do some limited sound design on it, but it doesn't really afford you an arrangement interface whereas you can set up a full track on the Force including even autosampling, crafting your own sounds within the plugin interfaces or whatever through to tweaking a final delivery.

And at the price differential, well, you'd better really love the hell out of Ableton for a Push 3. But if you're that person, then more power to you.

So; you're saying the Ableton 3 is more difficult?

I believe the comparison was Ableton Push 3 Standalone, presumably running Live 11 (though you can apparently get Live 12 Beta on it now)... with the Akai Force... and ability to create a full song. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "Ableton 3"... but I believe you mean Push 3 standalone.

It's not whether the Push 3 is difficult or not, it doesn't have an arranger and has other issues that just make it difficult or not a great fit for working standalone to produce a final song. On the Push 3 though it is also dead simple to take what you've made in clip view and work on it from there straight in Ableton Live on your desktop. Which is fine... but takes you out of standalone.

Yup, exactly that. The Push 3! Total standalone experience!

... except for the part that isn't. That part wants a computer. Hope you don't mind.

If that's a problem, have you checked out other manufacturers? You can get end-to-end standalone stuff from many manufacturers, notably KORG, Kurzweil ... and Akai. Whaddya know?

Koekepan wrote:Yup, exactly that. The Push 3! Total standalone experience!

... except for the part that isn't. That part wants a computer. Hope you don't mind.

If that's a problem, have you checked out other manufacturers? You can get end-to-end standalone stuff from many manufacturers, notably KORG, Kurzweil ... and Akai. Whaddya know?

Total standalone except for the part that isn't. That part wants a computer! Well wtf guy than it is not a standalone workstation/sampler/Groovebox. Forgive me but I am lost. I thought it looked like a dope sampler station. I would take Akai's over it though if you care/d for my two cents. I seen a producer recreate an Isaiah Rashad song on it. So I became interested in that machine.

NearTao wrote:I believe the comparison was Ableton Push 3 Standalone, presumably running Live 11 (though you can apparently get Live 12 Beta on it now)... with the Akai Force... and ability to create a full song. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "Ableton 3"... but I believe you mean Push 3 standalone.

It's not whether the Push 3 is difficult or not, it doesn't have an arranger and has other issues that just make it difficult or not a great fit for working standalone to produce a final song. On the Push 3 though it is also dead simple to take what you've made in clip view and work on it from there straight in Ableton Live on your desktop. Which is fine... but takes you out of standalone.

Yes, correct. "Ableton 3" I bluntly was referring to the Push mk3 model yes. Sorry for confusing or missing titles.

It's all good. I was just highlighting the smoke and mirrors of Ableton's marketing. They marketed the Push 3 as an all-in-one, end-to-end, soup-to-nuts standalone production solution. Then it turns out that not only is it not one, it's also very expensive, and literally not equipped (in hardware terms) to provide the end-to-end solution in the Ableton software structure (because the mail slot screen is inadequate for the arranger view even if they wanted to present that).

It's basically an expensive gateway to get people to buy more Ableton Live for their computers.

You'd literally be better off with a Tascam Portastudio, a MicroKORG, and a Novation Circuit.

Compared to the Force, it's a joke. Just last night I started with a completely blank slate, and ended up with a complete track rendered to a .FLAC file.

But if you want a cute way of living the Ableton life, I guess the Push 3 tells the world how you like to blow your cash?

I don't know what you're after and what you're expecting. I had lots of ideas what the Force might be, based on Akai's marketing, and some of it turned out to completely not true. Audio tracks, looping, arranger, that kind of stuff, ridiculous and/or pathetic. But some other stuff works great. To me the Force is a drum machine and a MIDI-based jamming station, and a hands-on sampling weirdness machine. Making drum beats with the step sequencer is great fun. I'll add a bassline, some chords... jamming time.

Did you know that you can import Ableton Live projects to the Force?

Check the video in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=49&t=217026

This guy's workflow looks so good, I'd say that's the Right way to use a Force. But he has real live techno gigs too.