Hardware Vs Software your opinion please?

it is not about anyone sweating anybody. i dont need my ego fed by anonymous people on a forum. in my day to day life i let my music speak for itself.and your arguments about sampled based synths are pretty rediculous. the ppg 2.2 uses wavetables which are samples so does this make it a sampled based synth or analog? hmm. grand pianos are not made by the player so should everyone learn how to make a piano to be taken seriouly cause it is harder? just a little backgound about me cause u seem 2 have things twisted. i have studied the drumset for 16 years, piano for 10, and the bass guitar for 8. i started engineering 6 years ago and have been mixing for 5. music isn't my hobby. my goal in this forum is to learn as well as educate people on things that i am knowledgeable in. i have made and seen people make music on the worst equipment. the thread starter wanted to know which is better hardware or software and the point is that there is no right answer to that question. i can play several instruments so sometimes i pick up the sticks and play the drumset and other times i will program a part. sometimes i will play a bassline on an electric bass and others i will play it on a keyboard or sometimes both. is the keyboard better or is the e-bass better? no they are just different and excel in different areas. if u look at a carpenter u will not see 1 tool in his toolbox, u will see many.
My main point to anyone trying to do this is to take the time out and learn what it is that are trying to do. the reason why i brought up the situations concerning publishing is because a lot of aspiring producers don't understand the logistics behind clearing a sample and how that impacts their pockets. this business is all about publishing and that has been kept a secret to the artists up until the late 80's. a perfect example is the riddim by a jamaican producer that was on countless songs last year. it was in uh oh by that chick i forgot her name and that nina sky song. the problem for a publisher is that once more than 1 person samples a track it gets very confusing, because the original artist always gets paid but if the 3rd artist to use the sample took it from the second then the second artist is also supposed to get paid. now if u have 20 people using the same sample how do u know which song they actually got the sample from? this is what happens on the business end of things that the general public doesnt see. and if u r choosing to be in music as a profession, then these are things that impact your pockets.

now back to the software vs hardware debate. for someone starting out software is going to be the cheaper way in. so they can decide if it is the right thing for them. the downside is that if they try to resell the sofdtware it will be hard and sometimes just not possible and the resale value will be low. know if a person buys hardware they will take a bigger hit upfront but if they decide that music isnt right for them then they can sell it a lot easier and not loose that much money.

I think looping a sample is more original than just loading up VST's or your motif and triton and fantom and just going through presets until you find a sound you like then recording a part, then doing it again with your fantom.
Get off your high horse and realize that nobody sweats you, and you shouldnt sweat anyone, we're supposed to be a community here, not try and down eachother for our working methods.

yo yo yo no one is on a high horse, brother. in a community you have all kinds of people whether you like it or not. you should reread some of your previous post here on this forum. in other word "dont throw stone ..."

when i compose the last thing on my mind is the sample/patch/tone. i rather have a melody/song first. since i have put time into my setup/vsti(s) i do know which sounds/samples i do have. thru my training, experiences and listening to music 10 hours i know exactly how i want my sh!t to sound.

i rather an individual who listens to my music hum the melody than say wow that is a bad @ss sample. so, again in a community you have all kinds, leaders, following and people who do not have a clue. i have not point out anyone in particular. i said "most people", which could be anywhere from 6 out of 10 to 9 out of 10. to say 9 out of 10 is not saying anything negitive because if out of every 1000 individual here at the forum 100 are talent i think that is pretty good.

by the way i am that person in the community who like to keep it real(better known as a leader).

you have a nice day brother.

some useful info from a producer called Raven



======ATTENTION ALL RADIO DJs AND UNDERGROUND DJs========
This letter is regarding how underground artist are treated and handled by major labels and producers. My name is Raven, and I am an underground artist and producer. I have been trying to break into music industry for some years. I recently produced, recorded, and released to mix tapes, a single containing a Luther Vandross sample titled “One Night,” featuring Rick Ross and Jimmy Chocolate. The song became a hit in the underground world of music, and was mixed into a variety of radio mix shows. With the success I received underground, I felt that this song was going to be my break. The song was submitted to So So Def for a compilation album that was going to be released; little did I know that by So So Def receiving my song everything would change.

On April 12, Bow Wow appeared on 106 and Park, on BET, with Jermaine Dupri, and had a clip of him working on his new single, “Let Me Hold You”. What I saw blew my mind, Bow Wow was recording a song to the beat that I produced, and was even attempting to rap like how I did on my song. I knew that the beat was mine because of the sounds and the pitch I used was identical. Jermaine Dupri only added an extra kick and clap to try to make it less obvious that the beat was STOLEN. Major labels and popular producers have a habit of stealing music from unknown artist and producers. Kanye West and Ludacris were involved in a lawsuit regarding music they stole from the group, IOF “Stand Up,” after the group gave them their demo. A young woman in Atlanta, GA was stripped of her creativity by Cassidy, “I’m a Hustler”. Major artist and producers rip off unknown artist because they feel they can. The majority of underground artist do not have the financial capability to back their projects and stand up against these industry thieves.

Here is a link that takes you to the original song that I created:http://www.myspace.com/JIMMYCHOCOLATE

Please, all I ask is that you check out the link, and compare the songs. It is very obvious that my creativity and hard work was ripped off from me. For any further contact regarding freestyles, drops, or anything else to help promote the record, feel free to contact me at: [email protected].

listen to the last poets if u think hip hop started off with samplers.
and just random knowledge for your brain the first time a drum machine was used on a record was by sly and the family stone fresh (1973)

what if you flip the sample to a point where its totally unrecognizable? sampling doesnt have to be blatantly ripping off a whole melody. what if you sample yourself playing or sampling radom noises/sounds that sound like certain instruments... i dont let the legality prevent me from sampling because i flip it hard and i know people wont recognize where it was sampled from, even the artists themselves. cause, in the end, you have to be called out to owe some. i dont think people care about acting in good faith. if they could figure it out then i guess they deserve a piece of the pie. i dont think ill be making money off selling beats so it doesnt even matter

Mwalker that wasn't directed at you, but yeah it was getting a little heated.

Beat God Alright, I understand what you were trying to say about the sampling, but throwing that originality thing in there muddied it up. Yeah sample clearances is something that is hotly debated by lawyers right now, and no doubt the laws will change in some unforseen way. Like I've said, I always enjoy your contributions.

Oh yeah, and the PPG is a digital synthesizer with analog filters, like the Emax is a digital sampler with analog filters. It does use samples, but of single cycle waveforms that are looped and can be swept through. Not quite a sampler since you can't load your own in, a mellotron is more of a sampler than a ppg design wise, although the technology of the ppg is more similar to the modern day samplers, but if you're comparing the ppg to the triton, that's a bit heavy, you might as well compare the wavestation to the triton. The two come from very different design philosophies, PPG and WS are more about making wild unreal sounds, or just simply making your own sounds with them, where as the triton is more geared as a large sampling cd with some editing and midi. Sure you can go deeper and do more, but the approach is more rompler.

And yeah, that Raven thing is real. Ive worked with producers who are shady like that, seen them straight out steal a song, starting by sampling the drums, trying to make a similar song to what's on the radio. I havent seen this kind of ripping off a demo stuff, but I know it happens, the neptunes were involved with something like that last year.

Anyone trying to take credit away from another producer is garbage. that's why I am trying to clear the samples I use. I wish we lived in a world where we could credit all the samples for some fixed percentage, say where we got all of our samples from, and everyone knows what flavor came from where and what you put into it. but with the current laws, you're an outlaw and have to get away with what you can, or avoid the situation altogether like you opt to do. We're all taking risks.

Mwalker, sorry if I offended with the preset juggler comment, I'm sure you know more about synthesis than most people here, but I was just using an example, coming up with a melody is great. If you play piano, and only piano, you don't have to worry much about tone, you have few options, but on computers, or or electronic equipment like synths and samplers, you have a whole lot of control over the tone. sifting through and picking what yu like is one thing, but altering it or making your sounds from sctratch is another option, and a viable avenue of expression for a musician. Many musician have modified their instruments and searched for a new sound for more than novelty, but to express what they want in their head. It's another layer of the art. Like mixing your own music.

[quote]I'm sure you know more about synthesis than most people here[\quote]

according to your previous posts with Beat God i am not on the same level with synths/samplers and the history of. i am not a sound designer. i am about the music itself the melody,the groove and the feel. i am into writing stories in my music, better yet expressing my emotions thru the music. i do tweak the presets and i do layer allot.

I have a question for those software users. Probably directed to mwalker.

mwalker. I want to get a vst so that i can create some multisamples that i can load into my mpc4000. Basically, sampling the vsts, then keymapping them. I want to do this so i have everything inside my mpc4k and am not reliant on my keyboards, or computer. i dont know exactly how you do it, but i read somewhere that you can export multisamples from vsts fairly easy. Anyways, i want to use the vsts for thier presets, and creating my own, I already own a triton, and know a fair amount about synthesis.

What ones do you reccomend for "orchestral sounds" and vintage analog sounds-im not looking for any specific analog keyboard, but more of an all rounder-for basses, and classic sounds.

Essentially, im not gonna rely on the sequenicng or complete functions of the computer, but just as a good synthesis sound source that i can sample.

Btw. i was gonna either go that route or purchase some better sample cds......I was thinking of the peter sziedlacks advanced orchetra set in akai fromat.

ive got cubase, cakewalk, soundforge, and can acquire other softwares to host the vsts-my friends got logic. When i finish sampling my triton, im selling it, and investing in software for tracking-most likely protools.

learn me!

This is funny... If your music isn't hot, that's all that matters in the industry. If your beats are hot, whoever wants them WILL do what it takes to clear any samples you have. And yes you make your money in publishing, but don't mis-inform people into thinking you can't make publishing money being a sample-based producer either. Like I said before I play piano (14 years) but I also sample, things I can't clear I'll replay them with different notes. Every other form of art or invention has sampling. It's just funny when people talk seperately about music. If other art was put to the test like music you would have alot of your so called best painters, writers etc.. being sued to death!!! You would one have ONE type of car to drive, ONE keyboard to play, ONE computer to use...

Beautifully put Doc.

I think it was MPC4000XL that said if a lawyer quotes a previous lawyer's argument and the verdict from that case to apply to his case, he can be considered a genius for doing so. But a samplist can't?? Sorry if I'm wrong about who said it or fckin it up.

Mwalker, yeah, I like story tracks alot. Too much sometimes where I've had to actually work some repetition into my stuff because I can just keep going with different changes. I'm with that, but I think this speaks to what beatgod was saying earlier that out of necesity you learn enough about all aspects of music production to get the results you are after.

The sounds are just another way to invoke emotion. We all use em.

no-one saud that you can't make money being a sample based producer but the clearance charges comes out of your cut. and there isn't a standard rate. i have seen producers having to give up 100% of the publishing. the point is that if u can replay of do whatever it is u have to in the pursuit of not using a sample then due it cause in the long run you will see a dramatic difference in the money u make. if u dont care about making money then this doesnt apply to u.

damn! i came late into this thread! this is like my everyday argument with other producrers.

mpc4000xl i will see you next week, i land on monday 16th!

right......HW rocks period. but i really think that if you are experienced in the HW realm you should give the SW realm a look. I have and have benefitted from it tremondously. but then i love freeness, but thats another issue.
anyway

I like Hardware cause i love that analogue feel, that touch of I'm making the music, like i'm seasoning it like i'm actually cookin up suttin nice. plus i can turn it up and not get DISTORTION.

with SW, omfg, everything is to precise to quick too MICROWAVE! (excuse my cooking analogy with making music). mpc4000xl however is right cause its all on the producer and how he uses it.

software has come along way, from the dayz of midi orchestrator & hiphop eJay. anyway now the best thing is having al your favourite synths as software racks and not hardware racks with near or nuff the exact same sound, definetly alot cheaper!!,

by the way the guy with all the original, paid for software, yeah the one with the pic of all his software, i have to give u props!! thats alot of money spent there!!! people like me must make u feel sick when i download it.
maybe one day when i can afford em i will pay.

cyrus wrote:I have a question for those software users. Probably directed to mwalker.

mwalker. I want to get a vst so that i can create some multisamples that i can load into my mpc4000. Basically, sampling the vsts, then keymapping them. I want to do this so i have everything inside my mpc4k and am not reliant on my keyboards, or computer. i dont know exactly how you do it, but i read somewhere that you can export multisamples from vsts fairly easy. Anyways, i want to use the vsts for thier presets, and creating my own, I already own a triton, and know a fair amount about synthesis.

What ones do you reccomend for "orchestral sounds" and vintage analog sounds-im not looking for any specific analog keyboard, but more of an all rounder-for basses, and classic sounds.

Essentially, im not gonna rely on the sequenicng or complete functions of the computer, but just as a good synthesis sound source that i can sample.

Btw. i was gonna either go that route or purchase some better sample cds......I was thinking of the peter sziedlacks advanced orchetra set in akai fromat.

ive got cubase, cakewalk, soundforge, and can acquire other softwares to host the vsts-my friends got logic. When i finish sampling my triton, im selling it, and investing in software for tracking-most likely protools.

learn me!

keep the triton, imagine playing chords on mpc, wow! thats hard! anyway if u do sell, it i got the Refill version of it for reason NNXT patch. holla at me .

with regards to samplng, the better way to get around getting screwed by others is releasing that shit ya self. run ya own indie label, no one is gonna come after um cause its not worth it, u aint gonna have no money to give em, and all the money they spend trying to get u only brings u to the media's attention which only helps you. so when u keep dropping joints at that time people wanna hear cause they like comotion.

thank god for white labels! get your name out there sample to death anything get noticed then see how things unfold. dont limit ya creativity do what you want.

Also i advise reading the new scratch mag, read MADLIB's interview, that will wake up alot of producers.

MYYYYYYY BRAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!