MPC 3 -- Let's GO!!

bitermc wrote:I'm not sure a sampler -any sampler- is able to perform a realistic legato.

Who said "realistic". Legato is s musical expression which means continuous, uninterrupted, without detaching notes. Samplers do it by not retriggering the sample.

but a sampler is somehow a different animal and reads a sample every time you trigger a note.

It's not rocket science, keep sounding sample, change pitch but don't retrigger the sample. Ableton, Kontakt, HALion have it. According to internet search, Reason has sample players that can do it. Renoise most definitely can do it. Can you name a few samplers which cannot be set to not re-trigger samples?

So. New user here getting my head around MPC 2 and Ive just been working on a project/template where I have 10 or more (techno/electro/house) drum programs loaded and all mapped to be the same kind of drums on each pad and tweaked to be track ready. The idea was that id be able to boot up record some drums into a sequence and have a drum loop running that I can lay down my hardware synths over the top.

Currently I can do this and on the main screen switch between all the different drum kits to select one with the right vibe as the loop is playing by just turning a knob with the program box selected.

Is there going to be a way in 3.0 to do the same thing? Looks like with kit per track this is going to get unruly pretty fast.

bitermc wrote:I'm not sure a sampler -any sampler- is able to perform a realistic legato.

The SP404mk2 can play legato.

B-Wise wrote:Your the last person to talk about poor logic. My logic is poor because I said they may make a new device in a few years instead of next year & your basing the release of these new MPC on nothing but your options. OK.

I think they won't make a new gen next year based the the fact that they just released 2 new MPC recently & people will need more time to adjust to the new OS, which won't be available for desktop untill 2025. I also said they may try to be slick & make a new model of the current gen made more for 3.0 before that indicating that a new MPC could come out next year.

No need to insult me, this is the one reasons I stop replying to you & how months ago you flat out lied about what another member EnochLight said, got called out on it & you didn't provide proof or apologize. I don't block people, but please don't reply to my posts. Or reply but don't except a response in the future.

on a public form u should expect comentary on anything that is posted; as such I will continue to coment on anything I choose.

The intent was not to insult anyone; I never insult anyone I just give my take on the words posted.

Akai is about to release a free software update; so its only logical that they will pair this with new hardware so that they can make some money of that development time.

Why would they give a free software update then wait years to make money off that software update?

Surely u can understand the logic that new hardware out with the new software pre-installed makes sense so they can captialise off that new software release, very simple.

Cashman wrote:So. New user here getting my head around MPC 2 and Ive just been working on a project/template where I have 10 or more (techno/electro/house) drum programs loaded and all mapped to be the same kind of drums on each pad and tweaked to be track ready. The idea was that id be able to boot up record some drums into a sequence and have a drum loop running that I can lay down my hardware synths over the top.

Currently I can do this and on the main screen switch between all the different drum kits to select one with the right vibe as the loop is playing by just turning a knob with the program box selected.

Is there going to be a way in 3.0 to do the same thing? Looks like with kit per track this is going to get unruly pretty fast.

In 3.0 load all the Programs as their own drum track then you can make a "dummy drum track" meaning it's meant to be empty, then MIDI send it from the track settings to another track. As you press the pads on the dummy track it triggers the pads on whatever track your MIDI sending it to.

This is something you can test out on MPC 2 if you want. Also any track data you recorded will get sent out ad well. So you can record a drum pattern or whatever & in real time switch to other tracks to change the vibe.

B-Wise wrote:MIDI send it from the track settings to another track. As you press the pads on the dummy track it triggers the pads on whatever track your MIDI sending it to.

This is something you can test out on MPC 2 if you want. Also any track data you recorded will get sent out ad well. So you can record a drum pattern or whatever & in real time switch to other tracks to change the vibe.

Pad mutes for Drumsynth Multi... Nice trick !

Yes, can confirm the dummy track workflow seems to be the best way to deal with auditioning multiple kits against an existing sequence. Example:

1. Load up first kit and record/load a patten. Mute the track.
2. Now load up 10 kits, each one to its own track. Press PLAY START
3. In track 1 'I/O' settings, change the SEND TO' to point to track 2 to hear the beat with the new kit
4. Change SEND TO to the next kit. Repeat for all kits.
5. Once you find your kit, delete the unwanted tracks. Optionally, first copy the MIDI pattern from track 1 to the wanted track - you can copy the events, or, new feature I believe, you can merge the tracks together (with the option to not merge the kit itself).

It's a bit fiddly though, I will try to refine it while creating the new MPC Bible course.

Neodymium wrote:
Hmmm, Akai wants to take your money, and the processors are all the same (i think?) so backwards compatibility on plugins would be one of the things they'd want to keep going for a while? I wouldn't expect it forever, but the platform is 6 or 7 years old, thats along time in modern tech!

Yeah, this swings both ways. If I don't upgrade, but I can get plug-ins, then I'm just missing out on any bug fixes and new features. Or, If the next plug-n requires an upgrades they've reduced their revenue stream from a group of users staying on 2, so the incentive is their to address their needs.

I like a lot of the new features, especially the simpler audio routing and choice to rearrange FX order, but playing live is my real goal and why I got the MPC. So it currently works for that. And to be honest I have more than enough synths, so not paying for new plug-ins isn't that much of a kicker. Although missing out on the Midi bug-fix would be a frustrating, if they ever get around to it.[/quote]

u say Akai wants to take ur money despite the upgrade being free; u sound ungrateful

Neodymium wrote:
Hmmm, Akai wants to take your money, and the processors are all the same (i think?) so backwards compatibility on plugins would be one of the things they'd want to keep going for a while? I wouldn't expect it forever, but the platform is 6 or 7 years old, thats along time in modern tech!

u say Akai wants to take ur money despite the upgrade being free; u sound ungrateful

MPC-Tutor wrote:Yes, can confirm the dummy track workflow seems to be the best way to deal with auditioning multiple kits against an existing sequence. Example:

1. Load up first kit and record/load a patten. Mute the track.
2. Now load up 10 kits, each one to its own track. Press PLAY START
3. In track 1 'I/O' settings, change the SEND TO' to point to track 2 to hear the beat with the new kit
4. Change SEND TO to the next kit. Repeat for all kits.
5. Once you find your kit, delete the unwanted tracks. Optionally, first copy the MIDI pattern from track 1 to the wanted track - you can copy the events, or, new feature I believe, you can merge the tracks together (with the option to not merge the kit itself).

It's a bit fiddly though, I will try to refine it while creating the new MPC Bible course.

When i do that, i just do the 1 step with a kit, load others kits and change the kit program on the track.
Am i missing something ?

kejlabal wrote:

MPC-Tutor wrote:Yes, can confirm the dummy track workflow seems to be the best way to deal with auditioning multiple kits against an existing sequence. Example:

1. Load up first kit and record/load a patten. Mute the track.
2. Now load up 10 kits, each one to its own track. Press PLAY START
3. In track 1 'I/O' settings, change the SEND TO' to point to track 2 to hear the beat with the new kit
4. Change SEND TO to the next kit. Repeat for all kits.
5. Once you find your kit, delete the unwanted tracks. Optionally, first copy the MIDI pattern from track 1 to the wanted track - you can copy the events, or, new feature I believe, you can merge the tracks together (with the option to not merge the kit itself).

It's a bit fiddly though, I will try to refine it while creating the new MPC Bible course.

When i do that, i just do the 1 step with a kit, load others kits and change the kit program on the track.
Am i missing something ?

3.0 programs are linked to tracks and only way to change a tracks program is load a new kit that purges the old kit.

A very convoluted workaround unfortunately.

kejlabal wrote:When i do that, i just do the 1 step with a kit, load others kits and change the kit program on the track.
Am i missing something ?

Yes, with mp2 this works, not with mpc3, that's what we're referring to, this is what all the fuss is about as it's going to impact a lot of workflows.

When you load a program it must be loaded into a track and effectively it gets absorbed by the track. Programs do not exist inside a project, only tracks, which now handle all sample assignments and parameters themselves.

You can no longer have programs sitting around in memory unused. If you want to load a second program into your project you have to load it into another track. You cannot select a box and change the kit on a track.

Instead, create a blank drum track and use the midi SEND TO to send the MIDI you play on this track to one of the other drum tracks you loaded until you find a kit that works for you. From what I can tell, this is currently the best way to achieve what you normally do in mpc2.

Be aware that this might change as I'm sure Akai did not expect so much backlash, and perhaps they can be persuaded to come up with something to accomodate these existing wokflows.

HouseWithoutMouse wrote:

bitermc wrote:I'm not sure a sampler -any sampler- is able to perform a realistic legato.

Who said "realistic". Legato is s musical expression which means continuous, uninterrupted, without detaching notes. Samplers do it by not retriggering the sample.

but a sampler is somehow a different animal and reads a sample every time you trigger a note.

It's not rocket science, keep sounding sample, change pitch but don't retrigger the sample. Ableton, Kontakt, HALion have it. According to internet search, Reason has sample players that can do it. Renoise most definitely can do it. Can you name a few samplers which cannot be set to not re-trigger samples?

I'd of thought portamento is more challenging than legato for samplers, especially over larger ranges, something an oscillator has no problem with.

If you can program a sampler that has working pitched playback and envelopes, and MPC/Force EASILY has that, then you can easily make a working legato and portamento, it is completely trivial stuff. The only thing you need is a CLUE. If you don't have a clue, you have challenges.

HouseWithoutMouse wrote:If you can program a sampler that has working pitched playback and envelopes, and MPC/Force EASILY has that, then you can easily make a working legato and portamento, it is completely trivial stuff. The only thing you need is a CLUE. If you don't have a clue, you have challenges.

Just samples struggle in general when pitch bent over bigger ranges. I'm no saying they can't do it easily, just bending a sample up an octave with a slow portamento means playing the sample at twice the frequency, and sample tone get weird then and would it match the sample it's moving to an octave up. An oscillator however can easily go up 8 octaves really slowly no sweat. An extreme example unless you are doing risers.

I believe some software samplers start stepping through samples in between to mitigate this.