Sometimes diggin just don't feel right

I love listening to hip hop and creating it but when I make a sampled beat something just feels wrong inside me. I dig through records and find a great sound or a loop that another artist made and I feel guilty taking it. Sure I may chop it up or change the pitch and put some drums over a sample but the sound I am manipulating wasn't mine in the first place. I understand the culture of the DJ in hip hop and how sampling came about but I still feel like a rip off artist when I play a beat with a rhodes sample that sounds great and I didn't play it.

Does anyone else feel the same way, even sometimes? Does anyone have a philosophical viewpoint that will help me plunder other artists recordings guilt free?

Lol I dont feel guilty, they made their music a certain way, Im just looping a piece up or chopping a piece up and making it my own, the focus is usually the rapper over top of the beat anyways..besides thats the whole way of hip hop...back when they just got the breakbeats or watever as a rhythm for the rapper

-1

dennison wrote:I love listening to hip hop and creating it but when I make a sampled beat something just feels wrong inside me. I dig through records and find a great sound or a loop that another artist made and I feel guilty taking it. Sure I may chop it up or change the pitch and put some drums over a sample but the sound I am manipulating wasn't mine in the first place. I understand the culture of the DJ in hip hop and how sampling came about but I still feel like a rip off artist when I play a beat with a rhodes sample that sounds great and I didn't play it.

Does anyone else feel the same way, even sometimes? Does anyone have a philosophical viewpoint that will help me plunder other artists recordings guilt free?

Actually dennison.......................

I Had To Adjust My Reply once I Realized it Was U.....

(Respect Due............. U Strike Me As A Kool n Knowledgeable Brother)

As Far As How U Feel While I Understand I Don't Feel the Same Way.........


Here is Why............................


A Scientist or Doctor Dedicates His ENTIRE LIFE to A GOAL A FORMULA or A PROCEEDURE He Dies Before it's Completion..................................
years Later Someone Whom May or MAY NOT Even Know Him Comes Along and Finishes or Masters it.............IS This Wrong (NO) .........
Is He A Thief (NO).............................

Yet Many of these People Become RICH and Famous For This.............


A Lawyer IS IN the Heat Of A High Profile Case..........................
He Feels the Pressure on Him And Knows that this Case Could Make Him or Break him in the Site of his Peers.................................................
H Researches (Diggs if U Would) and If Needed Samples The Info From An older Landmark Case..............and He WINS...............
Is He Wrong (NO) IS He A Thief .........Again I Say (NO).................

He Can Build A Reputation and Win Favor With many Important Clients Like His and IS Never Made The Lesser For IT...........................


SO When I Sample A Record Usually 20+ years old I Don't Feel Like A Thief...................................And I Shouldn't............................

In Fact Much Like "Scarface" he Movie owes alot to the Hip-HOP Culture
Many OL' n Forgotten Gems have Been Revived By MY DIGGIN' FAMILY................................


NO I am NOT Sayin' U Should Violate Ur Own Moral if u Feel Samplin' Will not Be Proppa' For U (And I Respect That if That US Ur View)................

And Remember U Can And Should TRY TO Clear A Sample When U Able............................



P.S. I am not in Favor of (Puffalizin') Some Typical Grooves............ But Samplin' in IT Self IS AN ARTFORM AND.....................SAMPLIN' ITSELF IS MUSICAL>................................


In All Fairness I Only Loop on Occasion....................


ODDLY IF I DON'T DIG I DON'T FEEL RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TRUST THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good points most definately. I guess if I don't feel bad playing some jazz sheet with my own interpretation, then I shouldn't feel bad sampling and using the sound in a different context.

dennison wrote:Good points most definately. I guess if I don't feel bad playing some jazz sheet with my own interpretation, then I shouldn't feel bad sampling and using the sound in a different context.

Hey I RESPECT U VIEWPOINT.................U Have To Live With UR ART.......

as Always The Choice is Yours......................

Hope this Was Insightful n Useful.............................

I would never feel bad about usin' a sample but,since i can't really play strings or woodwinds i have to use what i have.Lol.

No seriously,it's to each his own.I think if you sample something and do it respectfully,it's cool.We can pay homage to the artist before us that laid the groundwork by letting their music live on through us.IMO.

2

i always looked at sample based music as more of a tribute to older musicians rather than a straight jack... even though, as we all know, there are a few artists who have problems with their music being sampled

I like how Ricci Rucker put it into perspective:
"Water is as pure as anything can be. But hydrogen it couldn't do it alone, it had to sample oxygen to get H2o. " Those aren't his exact words but damn it makes sense right?

Yeah I mean you continuing a musical legacy and revisiting the heritage of your people. Everything is fair when you livin in the city. But there is a code of ethics to this sh!t that may alleviate some of your worries.

In many respects it's an unspoken one, but as DJs and beatmakers I'm sure you've heard em.

For examp: not staight jacking loops a la the Trackmasters, taking the sample art form very serious because you are tinkering with history and you could get dicked or feel you have betrayed your morals if it sounds like yo' jackin' 4 beats (unless that's your statement like Ice Cube's joint of the same name).

But the rule of the day is to each his own of course. But being you're a instrumentalist and asked, you could always learn them basslines or what have you, although I'm sure you've done this.

Some people just don't get, or can't feel sampling. So that's why there is a diverse variety of producers out there, from samplers like Prince Paul, to fusionists like Dan the Automator who have musicians play and sample, to brash musicians like the Neptizzles. The choice is yours but you won't be a Black Sheep if you choose to chill on the sampling. You could get wit disc or you could get wit D.A.T.

*But to me the classical fossilic home grown sound of Hip-Hop that gives me goosebumps will always be sampling, more dusty than digital (or live). That is the blueprint. But I used to and still love h.e.r., in all her forms. And musical growth is beautiful too.

(Just flowers withcu on all them analogies)


XANDRE

oops double post


XANDRE

coming from an visual arts background, i like too look at it like andy warhol. When he took liz taylors or Marilyn Monroes or Mao's likeness, screen printed it and reinterpreted it, it became not only art in it;s own right, but a cultural refernce point to what when before it (ie- campbells soup cans and the industrial revolution)

you connect the dots, i know you guys know what im'm getting at

So some more questions on the ethics of sampling.

I remember hearing that Puff song with the Police "Every breath you take" sample. Everyone was real critical of the use of that sample. On the other hand The latest Ghostface album "Pretty Toney" (incredible album in my view) he just rhymes over a whole song. What makes Puffy whack in the world of sample ethics while Ghostface is praised?

i dont feel this but if you want i'll take your records if you feel that strong about it

I used to, but Im not ashamed to lift a loop here and there anymore. Its hiphop. Its what it is.

dennison wrote:So some more questions on the ethics of sampling.

I remember hearing that Puff song with the Police "Every breath you take" sample. Everyone was real critical of the use of that sample. On the other hand The latest Ghostface album "Pretty Toney" (incredible album in my view) he just rhymes over a whole song. What makes Puffy whack in the world of sample ethics while Ghostface is praised?

Dennison....................................

This IS DA SCOOP From the 4000XL.................


If U Look At Early HipHop It Was Usually Derivin' In Idea From A Song Not easily Recogniged....................
It is Like What I Said Before...........................
What is The Point of Using A Huge Hit and Not Bringin' Nuttin' 2 Da Table..........................


I Was Shocked to Hear A new Commericial Use.............. IBB"Apache"

there is a movie Out with this in the Background.............The Point is U Know That IF Not For HipHop Most People Would NEVER CARE who "INCREDIBLE BONGO BAND" WAS much Less License the Track For A Box office Movie U See My Point IS.............................


Don't Sample A Billboard Hit (Unless U Plan On Jus' Usin A Sec. or U Are Going to Do Some thing And Freak it)

Don't Sample A Artist Only Hit (Unless U only Use A Short One Shot Etc. or U Plan A Respectful Remake With An Actual Band Member) example....
Puffy Did A Performance with Sting OF That TRACK and U Have To RESPECT The OG on Stage with Him that (KOOL)

Don't Sample An OVER USED AND Abused Sample ALA The (Funky Drummer, Amen, Levee Break, Substitution, Big Payback ETC.) Unless U Chop, Filter or otherwise Alter it ....U Can Use It As A Quick Drop ETC. But U Cannont Make IT A Basis Sound AGAIN When it's Tired And Propperly SO....................

Don't Sample Off A HipHop Record Unless That is Ur FAM Personally or IF U Make A Reply Record or IF U Snip A Vocal Clip for A Sound Bite Etc .....(Would U Want Other Samplist Moochin Off Ur Diggin' Blood, Sweat, Tears n Innovation...NO)

Most of the Things I've Said Are Understood By Most TRUE Samplist That Have Respect For The Culture........................

And Usin OL' HipHop as a Loopin' Excuse Does not Apply..........................

We Have Sooooooooo Many Samplin', Choppin', Groovin', Blendin', Effectin' n Other Options That Grand Master Flash or SugarHill Did not Have....................

This IS A Different Day..............................................................


Now I Don't Know The Pretty Tony Track But Ghostface Will Not............. I Suspect Be Usin' A Billboard Top Hit For A New Track While NOBODY Would Be Suprised IF Puffy Did and That IS Sad...........................

See Real a Digger Not Only Does not Do That He Does not Even Want to......................................................


Respect The ARTFORM..................REAL RECOGNIZE REAL..................

SKILL RECOGNIZE SKILL.....................................




IF Ur Really INTERESTED IN Learnin' Mo' On Samplin Ethics THIS BOOK Does DELIVER DA GOODZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(Don't Let People Tell U This IS Trash View IT For DELF'......................And The DECIDE I Was Iffy in IT But NOW I LUV IT!!!!!!!!!!!

Not A Production How To But IT IS A MENTAL TOOL that VERY KOOL

MAKING BEATS



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Book Description
The First book on Hip-Hop sampling as a musical process


Inside This Book

African American, Kool Akiem, Prince Paul, Elements of Style, Sampling Ethics, King Otto, Strath Shepard, The Outer Circle, Mixx Messiah, Pete Rock, Oliver Wang, Bob James, Karen Dere, James Brown, Russell Potter, Moment of Truth, Sesame Street, Chairman Mao, Harry Allen, Tribe Called Quest, Mardi Gras, Neil Sedaka, Sugar Hill, Large Professor, One Love, Domino and More.........

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http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/ ... 67-3789526


TRUST THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!