OS2 or OS2XL

Sooty_G wrote:but hey, if someone can show me why this is a great feature, i'm willing to listen!

But that's the thing. If the feature holds no advantage or allure to you, then what does it matter how someone else values it? I could say the same thing about the OS2 features missing from 2XL that are apparently so vital to you. Show me why its such a great feature... Because in the end this is all about personal working styles and personal preferences. And that's why JJ created all these different versions of his OS with different featuresets.

To me it basically goes like this:

-The free OS is for cheapskates, and to fix a fatal bug or two.
-OS1 is for people who are comfortable with the Akai OS and don't wanna stray too far from that.

As for OS2 and OS2XL, its all about which set of features is the best compromise for you. The major differences are certain sequencing features (q-link/pattern/mixer automation etc. in OS2 vs. arp/chord/q-strength in 2XL) present in one and not the other, and certain program parameters (ADSRs and filters) that are different in each version.

mp3 wrote: The major differences are certain sequencing features (q-link/pattern/mixer automation etc. in OS2 vs. arp/chord/q-strength in 2XL) present in one and not the other, and certain program parameters (ADSRs and filters) that are different in each version.

no color
it´s round ( os2 )
it´s square ( 2xL )

Jandpoint wrote:

mp3 wrote: The major differences are certain sequencing features (q-link/pattern/mixer automation etc. in OS2 vs. arp/chord/q-strength in 2XL) present in one and not the other, and certain program parameters (ADSRs and filters) that are different in each version.

no color
it´s round ( os2 )
it´s square ( 2xL )

Right!

Sooty_G wrote:i challenge anyone to make a video that shows the importance of quantize strength - with nice clear audio so i can hear what it is doing and the difference between before and after it's use.

+1
I would like to see the video

Sooty_G wrote:if i have a problem with the timing of my hits i just re-record them or move them around in GRID EDIT. just as easy to do with and more controllable.

Well that's where we'll have to agree to disagree, cause i'm not a big fan of Grid Edit... to me it's 'fiddly and anal' to work with, although it's fine for basic shit like erasing notes etc.

When recording drum patterns (on seperate tracks ) with different quantize settings and strengths, you can get a far more versatile sounding swing to your beats than with just 'quantize on or off'. The best of both worlds you could say...

If JJ could implement QS and the Customize Numeric Keys into OS2 i'd jump ship, but for now XL gives 100% more 'feel' with quantizing, and that's an important feature for me.

Sooty_G wrote:the qlinks are the same in os 1 & 2. os 2xl messed it up. you can redo/overdub your qlinks just as easy in 1, 2, and 2xl. i'm not sure what this qlink recording weakness in os 1 is that you are referring to. definitely nothing was improved about the process in 2xl. all JJ did was remove the ability to record/playback 2 qlinks simultaneously.

read the link i posted. that's as in depth analysis as i can give:
http://www.mpc-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=107060

You helped me with this before - the issue in OS1 I had with recording slider changes is here
viewtopic.php?f=25&t=125561
In OS1, when over dub and play are on and the loop is repeating several times, you don't record slider moves over your previous attempt, you just add more MIDI info and you can see this is gird edit, if the fluctuations are big enough you'll just see spikes, it gets messy - you need to record your sliders first take and if you don't get it, manually delete/erase your attempt (unsmooth)
In OS2XL, say a 2 bar loop's been going for 20 repetitions, and you're playing with a filter all the time, it'll only record the last two bars of movements (smooth)

Hope this makes sense. This recording is a big thing for me. Is OS2 like XL or 1 in this regard or have been doing something wrong all along?

mp3 wrote:But that's the thing. If the feature holds no advantage or allure to you, then what does it matter how someone else values it?

because i'm open to changing my mind. back in the day i used to not like synths at all. i just didn't like the sound of them. now i use them all the time.

but the quantize strength thing just seems strange to me. i don't get it. every time someone steps up to give some love to os 2xl this is the first thing they bring up is: "the quantize strength feature is a MUST for me!". but to me it seems by it's very nature to just make very micro adjustments to your tracks.

it reminds me of the whole audiophile thing, where people SWEAR they can hear a difference in the sound if they just use these gold-plated $500 audio cables or whatever. just sounds like voodoo to me but i am definitely open to seeing it in a new light. but i want someone to just once give some hard examples with a youtube vid or whatever with before and after comparison so we can hear for ourselves how quantize strength makes such a difference.

Because in the end this is all about personal working styles and personal preferences. And that's why JJ created all these different versions of his OS with different featuresets.

i gotta say this is definitely not why JJ has all these different versions. if it was up to JJ we would ALL be using 2xl. only one os for him to support/bugfix that way. plus more upgrade $$$ for him.

remember when 2XL first dropped and he pulled the links for os 1 & 2 from his site? it wasn't until a bunch of people made a big fuss that he reluctantly put the download links back up (but he still made it so you have to buy 2xl to get 1 & 2 on the 2500).

Coz wrote:Well that's where we'll have to agree to disagree, cause i'm not a big fan of Grid Edit... to me it's 'fiddly and anal' to work with, although it's fine for basic shit like erasing notes etc.

yeah, i can see that. i usually don't get too hardcore with it. like i said if i have a problem with my timing i usually just wipe the whole problem area out and do it over instead of nudging the notes around on the grid. but sometimes the issue is just one hit that is out of place and then it IS easier to just go in GRID & nudge that one hit to where you want it. depends on the situation.

When recording drum patterns (on seperate tracks ) with different quantize settings and strengths, you can get a far more versatile sounding swing to your beats than with just 'quantize on or off'. The best of both worlds you could say...

youtube it!!! i wanna hear it .

If JJ could implement QS and the Customize Numeric Keys into OS2 i'd jump ship

i'm willing to bet my mpc that quantize strength would be dead easy to implement in os 2! probably a half hour of work, tops.
it's been requested numerous times but no response. JJ's too busy working on his spreadsheet... er,... i mean his sequencer software.

...and if JJ could fix the qlink/filter/crashing etc problems in os 2xl then I'd be willing to jump ship, too!
there's a lot of cool stuff in 2xl for sure but JJ has said that the qlink thing is impossible to fix. i haven't been able to get any response from him via email lately so i think he's really just not gonna develop for the MPC anymore. some bugfixes and that's about it.

sugoisounds wrote:In OS1, when over dub and play are on and the loop is repeating several times, you don't record slider moves over your previous attempt, you just add more MIDI info and you can see this is gird edit, if the fluctuations are big enough you'll just see spikes, it gets messy - you need to record your sliders first take and if you don't get it, manually delete/erase your attempt (unsmooth)
In OS2XL, say a 2 bar loop's been going for 20 repetitions, and you're playing with a filter all the time, it'll only record the last two bars of movements (smooth)

Hope this makes sense. This recording is a big thing for me. Is OS2 like XL or 1 in this regard or have been doing something wrong all along?

ok. i see what you're saying. i think i know why this is:

os2xl only allows ONE pass of qlinks to be recorded, period. so when you go to overdub - your previous qlink data gets completely wiped out so you get a nice smooth recording.

in os 1 & 2, you can have 2 qlinks recorded simulatenously, so when you overdub - what was there before doesn't automatically get erased. it stays there underneath your new pass and so you get those messy q-link data spikes. it's just a difference in how the os's work.

os 1 & os 2 solution: hit the AFTER key above the qlink & make sure it is lit - then overdub. your new pass will completely delete the old recorded stuff so you get a nice & smooth new recording. i just tested this and it works. you can see what it's doing in realtime in the Q-REAL section of GRID EDIT (SHIFT + F1 in GRID EDIT).

Sooty_G wrote:

sugoisounds wrote:os 1 & os 2 solution: hit the AFTER key above the qlink & make sure it is lit - then overdub. your new pass will completely delete the old recorded stuff so you get a nice & smooth new recording. i just tested this and it works. you can see what it's doing in realtime in the Q-REAL section of GRID EDIT (SHIFT + F1 in GRID EDIT).

Thanks Sooty, I'll have to try this out for myself. Seems like you're saying you'd have to have AFTER lit before pressing OVERDUB, right? You wouldn't have REC + PLAY on, first take, hit AFTER, retake - you have to take overdub off first, then press AFTER then switch OVERDUB on? If that's the case I think I'd prefer the XL way of doing things because it's more instantaneous.

sugoisounds wrote:Thanks Sooty, I'll have to try this out for myself. Seems like you're saying you'd have to have AFTER lit before pressing OVERDUB, right? You wouldn't have REC + PLAY on, first take, hit AFTER, retake - you have to take overdub off first, then press AFTER then switch OVERDUB on?

in my testing it worked either way. you can switch AFTER off & on at will while OVERDUB was active. in fact, if you do this you could punch holes in your previously recorded qreal data - if you switch on AFTER and then don't move the qlink it just starts erasing whatever is already there... start moving the qlink & then it records.

it gets a little complicated/funky but test it out while you're in the QREAL screen so you can see what's going on.

also, don't forget about the AUTO feature in the QREAL page. very handy.

Sooty_G wrote:...and if JJ could fix the qlink/filter/crashing etc problems in os 2xl then I'd be willing to jump ship, too!

I'm sure you said that before he reintroduced Simult Pad, so who are you trying to kid?!

Coz wrote:I'm sure you said that before he reintroduced Simult Pad, so who are you trying to kid?!

say what?
i never use Simult.

Must have been one of the other OS2 evangelists, sorry.

I use OS2XL because of Quantise Strength.

It lets me tighten up my live playing as much or as little I like and gels multiple tracks of data together whilst staying as loose/organic-sounding and as close to my live playing as I want. I double tempo too.

I always used Iterative Quantise in Cubase, so it's a natural want from me and something I jumped at when I heard JJ had implemented it.

Everyone has different priorities when being creative. If we didn't, everyone would be doing the same stuff and that'd be bOrin