mixing down on an analog board

so i'm in the process of saving up for an A&H ZED R16 as my main mixer for recording and mixing and all that. but one thing i noticed on this board, and all analog boards actually. but the INSERT point is always before the EQ, so if you wanted to use a compressor, you would be entering it in the signal chain before it gets EQ'd.

normally i like to EQ before i compress, but thats usually only when recording thru my pre-amp. is it the same in mix-down? isn't it more normal to EQ before you compress? whats the most effecient workaround to this problem, assuming its even a problem to begin with...?

any tips or thoughts welcomed

thanks

chances are if you are doing a mix down you already have it recorded with the EQ at full volume and you are playing that back and trimming and compressing.... and recording that as your mixed down piece of music.

Fung45 wrote:I would mix everything then compress everything from your main L and R outs use the inserts for sidechaining (i.e. kick drum) I've been doing this with great results lately.

yeah i might just put the compressor in the main L+R bus, might get a more well rounded sound that way anyways. i'm not familiar with sidechaining tho, i know there are a lot of side-chain outputs on compressors and such, but i never figured out what they are for...

Yes a sidechain input is basically a control input for the compressor to react to. more common than using the kick for a sidechain (though that can be fun...) is to send a high pass signal of your stereo mix to the sidechain while sending the whole mix through the compressor. that way bass and kick won't cause your mix to "pump" ie a noticeable drop in volume everytime some in the lowend hits. a lot of compressors have a high pass button on them for this very reason, and to save you from having to actually route signal to the sidechain input. an internal sidechain of sorts.

namotu wrote:

Fung45 wrote:I would mix everything then compress everything from your main L and R outs use the inserts for sidechaining (i.e. kick drum) I've been doing this with great results lately.

yeah i might just put the compressor in the main L+R bus, might get a more well rounded sound that way anyways. i'm not familiar with sidechaining tho, i know there are a lot of side-chain outputs on compressors and such, but i never figured out what they are for...

***CAUTION***
A comnpressor on the MIX Bus can also suck the life out of your mix if you don't have a good understanding of compressors or the particular compressor you are using.

ntalec wrote:

namotu wrote:

Fung45 wrote:I would mix everything then compress everything from your main L and R outs use the inserts for sidechaining (i.e. kick drum) I've been doing this with great results lately.

yeah i might just put the compressor in the main L+R bus, might get a more well rounded sound that way anyways. i'm not familiar with sidechaining tho, i know there are a lot of side-chain outputs on compressors and such, but i never figured out what they are for...

***CAUTION***
A comnpressor on the MIX Bus can also suck the life out of your mix if you don't have a good understanding of compressors or the particular compressor you are using.

yeah i've heard, but i've realized its hard to compress each individual sound, or at least a few, with individual settings on a compressor for each sound. its like you'd have to buy a compressor for each sound you want to compress, soo much different than software.

maybe i could just own a few, and then mix and match them and see what works best with what instruments. any other suggestions? in software you basically own like an unlimited amount of compressors, and they each can be tweaked seperately. thats one thing that i've found to be a big problem when mixing in analog

@namotu
just caught this thread and hopefully this will be useful too you.
pre and post EQ compression and its uses.
Live situation:
post eq compression is usually the way to go as in a live situation I would generally be using the "one cut is worth a thousand boosts" rule. effectively you are removing bad or highly prevalent sounds and trying to increase the overall perceived volume of the source in the mix.

recording:
during the recording phase I generally am using compression Pre Eq to control those wayward transients and then using the EQ to sculpt the sound. otherwise trying to boost frequencies and then compressing them you tend to in fact turn them down as they are prominent and the compressor can react to those rather than the transients that you are trying to control.

also as far as your concerns to having to buy a compressor for every channel. sorry man thats the realities of the analog world. That said the desk you are looking to purchase is super flexible and i think that you should investigate the signal flow digitally at least to save yourself some bucks otherwise just start buying those alesis 3630 and dbx 266XL's and whatever else you can grab.

At the end of the day though, it's whatever works best for you and what you can afford.

hope thats been useful to you.
Peace.

yes yes, thank you man. its nice to have someone just put it in simple, hard-facts terms. most people would suggest otherwise, or tell me something that makes it seem like i can use 1 compressor for all 16 channels. but its nice to know that its just the way things work in analog. i figured it was like that, its only common sense.

your right tho, about the board. its real flexible between digital and analog. so i figure i'll get a few nice compressors for the things that need it most, and then maybe use the comp's in Logic for just simple things i guess. that is, until i can hopefully afford to have a hardware compressor for any and all channels i would need.

but again, thanks for the input. i appreciate it

one of the best and most important accessories for a mixer is a dust cover.

also I suggest grabbing a nice studio reverb unit just for that subtle touch..

yeah i hate covering up my equipment, but your right. when dust gets on the MPC pads it feels so weird, and not that easy to get it completely off either. i'll definitely be keepin' it covered.

i was lookin at some reverbs too, some TC Electronics stuff just for fun. some seem real nice, others not as much. i bet the TC Electronics one would out-perform the plug-in reverbs in Logic yeah? i mean the Space-Designer reverb thing in Logic is real dope, its just really difficult to use unless you just run off presets

Those TC electronics verbs are pretty bananas but dont sleep on those pawn shop scores. I picked up a Korg DRV1000 which is literally 4 knobs and 12bit algorythms but i tell ya what, on drums that things is bananananananananas. so crunchy and fat but at the same time spacial and crisp. all that and it only cost me $5 NZ (=approx$3 US) cant go wrong, aaaand no cpu drain.