By Dr.Foo
Mon May 19, 2003 8:04 pm
I thought I would share some of my recent hunt with y’all since I see a lot of posts re: second/other samplers.
I was looking for a sampler that would: serve as a drum “cruncher” to add crunch to drum sounds as well as be nice for some multi-sampling for instruments. Everything tested was done by me in a studio environment and with the aide of someone who knew how to use the gear. (with the exception of the ASR-X)
Akai S900/S950
I got onto these at my friends pad with him showing me how to use it. It is simplicity itself to use, the drums come out real nice. For multi-sampling all the stuff you need is there to get the samples to come out proper. The main beef I had was the size limitation on samples. 750 K isn’t much when you wanna do a real nice mulit-sample where you take afew (3 or more per group) instead of taking like, 3 per octave and tuning it. The time spent loading up samples is ok, but can get unbearable if you want to work fast. 8 outs & Scsi cool.
7/10
Yamaha TX16W- W/ typhoon OS
Nice unit, the sound is close to the S900/S950 or maybe even an SP-1200, but not quite. The Typhoon OS makes is a much better unit. It loads up quick and has a good size memory for getting larger multisamples into it. Great filters, and great editing (compared to the yamaha OS). The layering is a bit tricky but when you get the hang of it, this thing is a monster. Add to that the price is around 75-100 dollars (with the OS disks and samples) on ebay and it can be a nice way to get the crunchy sound for less. 8 outs built in, sweet.
8/10
Boss SP-303
Not really a great unit for crunching up drums, and the sounds come out “fake” they don’t sound like they did before they went in and not in a good way. Its mad portable and got a ton of storage space from smart media cards. I did the “buy and try” from Guitar Center, carried it around in my backpack and would just pull it out to work on it like a sketchpad (like a painter carries a notebook to jot down idea’s) and it works great for that. The built in mic is OK, noting special, but its useful for grabbing samples “out of thin air”. The mic DOES impart a pretty cool sound to stuff it grabs though, the rumble in the back of the bus sounds grimey coming out of it, so it could be great as a means to grab stuff and then get it into the MPC. Still, a Mini-Disk or voice reocorded would likely sound pretty close. The use I found for it was as an effects /re-sampling box. Run the mpc to it via midi and hook the I/O into the MPC I/O and you can use it to resample sounds to the MPC with effects from the MPC, external gear or the 303’s internal effects. It’s also useful as a effects box for scratching. It’s effects aren’t the best though, and for the price its not really worth it. I did like using it as a sketchpad and a couple of the idea’s I jotted down on it made their way into tracks I did on the MPC. Dedicated knob is cool, and the features are single buttin pushes away for the most part. Basically, for what I would end up using it for, the SP-202 would do the same I would use it for (grabbing samples from odd sources out and about away from my home mic, and as a sketchpad) and cost only 150 (vs 350 for the 303). 6/10
Emu-Esi 32
Old skool sound, easy as pie to multi sample, tons of memory, a rock solid interface. (my friend claims his has NEVER crashed on him) easy to use for everything and sample editing internally is not a cumbersome as it is on some of the other models. Pretty nice for the price, but I would like to see better filters. 8/10
Ensoniq ASR-X
A MPC “knockoff” but cheaper, holds more ram (ton more ram), but I find that the ASR-X does give samples a nice sound, it colors them well. I didn’t think it would be easy to use but it was, the display is tiny though and a pain to navigate. Good sampler section. I would buy one, but the MPC does better with drums and with multisamples for some reason. I just hated editing on it, what a joke. The main beef I have is that it doesn’t know what it wants to be good at, drums? Instrument samples? Its got the ram to hold tons of multisamples, but doesn’t work well with them. The sequencer is a joke, just like all of Ensoniq’s sequencers. Timbaland uses it, but I can see how a “programming” freak such as he would love it. I like to groove my beats out live so I didn’t feel the thing. But it is useful, no doubt on that, but not for the same price as a used MPC 2000. PS the effects are a joke. 6/10
Ensoniq Mirage
Hahahah. Cheap as all get out, only numbers for editing, no graphics, next to no memory; BUT it does have a sound that is unique. When I play back beats I could tell which drums came out of the Ensoniq mirage. I don’t know if that is good or bad, but I loved this little box. Dan the Automater says this was his first sampler and he loves it still. Easy to use and easy to get out what you put into it. The thing sells for like 50 bux. The model with a keyboard built in was $75. I would buy it for drums only though as that is where I found it to excel. Nice for the $$ and great as an alternative to an S900/S950 for drums, but not as powerful, and cant do as much.
6/10
Roland Sp-808
A remix sampler. Basically a sampler, multi-tracker in one. It is ok, but I think it tries to do too much and not enough of it well enough (whew!). The sampler section is cool, wish the pads were bigger. The multitracker is a pain to use and my buddy couldn’t really explain it well enough to get what I wanted out of it, so its not easy for me to use anyway. Who cares about the “D-Beam” controller. I found myself trying to use it, then getting real frustrated by it. It sounds like most other Roland gear, which I don’t really care for. If you are using it as a self contained remix unit, it would work well, but the price is more then enough to make me want to use another device that is cheaper and better for remixing, see below. 8 tracks of recording, and built in efx that are ok, I’d say the EB16 is better. Zip disk built in is cool, but I have heard it gets funky real fast. Basically this is a “jack of all trades, master of none” device. The 3 control knobs are cool, but I expected more from a unit at this price (basically, for 300 more you can step up to a used 2K XL)
5/10
Akai Remix 16
Yikes! A cool little device geared towards remixing (hence the name). Basically it’s a dj mixer, with a sampler built in. It has pads and it samples and works a lot like a mini-MPC. Its no longer made and there are more powerful devices out there, but you cop it, toss in another 16 MB of memory and the device is proper. Its a lot like the S20, which I think is what replaced it in the Akai line when it went out of production. I can’t figure out why. The coolest is being able to just plug up a sample source (Turntable, CD etc.) and go. It is a mixer so you don’t need one to sample from Records like on the MPC. It has MIDI, 8 voice poly, which you can get around with re-sampling, 4 track sequencer, again some re-sampling and “track bouncing” and it works out real nice. RCA’s I/O (booooooo) but its ok, since this box does so much more that I can deal with it. SCSI & floppy drive, so storage ain’t no worry. For 160 dollars I like it, I like it a lot. If I wanted to use it as a re-sampling device for the MPC of a place to run the signal of acapella’s for making the remix, its nice. 16 bit stereo sampling. 7/10
Akai S20
Very similar to the Remix 16. Midi, disk drive for sample storage, pads almost just like the Remix 16 pads. Upgrade to 17 mb memory. 8 voice poly, overcome with some “sample bouncing”. RCA inputs/ outputs BOOOOOOO!. Sequencer For the $$$$ I’d rather have a remix 16. Only 32khz max sample rate. Booooooo. I think it would be useful as a drum cruncher, since the drums I put in sounded crunchy. I don’t like the lower sample rate then the MPC, which makes it a pain to move samples to and from the S20 and the MPC. I spent most of my time trying to figure out how to “de-chipmunk” samples from the MPC on the S20. It would have a use in DJ applications to trigger one shots or loops to scratch over, extend an instrumental break etc., but for the $$$$ the SP-303/SP-202 does this and more.
5/10
Yamaha SU-10
Crap, Crap, Crap, Crap, Crap. The only thing I did with it that was any good was use the ribbon controller to control some midi parameters. What a piece. It does have Midi In AND Out, but I can’t imagine what I would use it for? An external controller maybe? But I have a keyboard for that so I dunno. Portable, sure, but not really powerful or useful, at least the SP-303/SP-202 has uses beyond as a sampling unit.
2/10
Yamaha SU-200
44.1 sampling, 2 1seconds. Anything you put into this sounds terrible. The I/O is crazy noisy. Crap sequencer. Crap effects. Crap. Crap. Crap. Don’t buy this, it is totally useless.
-1/10
Akai S1000
Ok, a nice little box. 16 voice poly means layer away. 44.1 16 bit, so drop stuff between the MPC and it at will with no trouble. Killer filters, this is what I found most useful on this box. Midi, built in 8 outs, and XLR connectors so you can go right from a mic into it. SCSI, and the basics that Akai gives you. Nice gear, programmin’ it is pretty simple, my buddy showed me what to do and in 10 minutes or so it was doing what I wanted it to do, so the learning curve ain’t steep at all. Don’t sound like an S900/S950, but it does a little more in terms of multisamplin’. I like it a lot, and would cop it for what I described as my goal.
8/10
Akai S612 W/ Quick Disk Drive
W/o the drive it is worthless. Samples can go through Sysex but takes 4EVER. The poly is bunk, and so is the LFO and the filters, but for drums DANG. Grimey. Grimey. Grimey. At 50 bux, 75 w/ FDD, its worth it for drummin’
5/10
SP-12
We all heard the SP-1200, the SP 12 is similar. It don’t sound the same and has some limits, but it’s close enough. Add a commodore disk drive (super old skool) and its nice. I wouldn’t pay more the 200 for one, no matter how much someone compares it to the SP-1200, it’s not the SP-1200. the preset sounds make me laugh.
Oberheim DX
Old skool as it gets. It uses EPROM’s where you burn samples onto them, then insert the chips into the sampler. It is really a drum machine, but the EPROM burning thing makes it a sampler. Kinda expensive to use, since it costs 100 bux for an eprom reader/writer. And it takes a while to get a song onto an ep-rom and into it, but once it is, it is all good. I have a friend who uses this device and he has been telling me he uses it for ALL his drums. To use midi you’ll need to mod it, but I’ve heard that its not too hard to do. The coolest thing is its super easy to get a funky groove out of this thing with little effort. EPROMS (blank) cost almost nothing so once you start burning them you have a drum machine that you can load any sample you want into (kinda like reason’s drum machine) and it does rolls and other stuff nice. Real faders for the drums too. I messed around with a layered 808 sound my buddy had burned to roms and made a kit from 18 sounds, so you have a lot to play with. Basically, chop a loop, burn it to eprom’s and then go. Or, you can chop, layer to get the sound you want then burn to rom’s. Changing them takes no time, just pop it open, pop ‘em out and in the new ones go. Eproms from Oberheim sell cheap on the net as do EP-rom’s “sample Cd’s” just collections of roms people have burned and sell. A complete 808 kit goes for like 20 bux on the net. 6 voices, easy to use and kinda kool looking and cool sounds, not very versatile, hence the lowered rating.
6/10
Basically, I plan on going for either:
Yahama TX16W- main reason, Price Vs. Performance
Akai S1000-main reason Price Vs. Performance
I just cannot justify paying an extra 100-200 dollars for an Akai S950, when I can get a smilar effect with the Yamaha or the S1000. Proll’y go with a S1000.
I was looking for a sampler that would: serve as a drum “cruncher” to add crunch to drum sounds as well as be nice for some multi-sampling for instruments. Everything tested was done by me in a studio environment and with the aide of someone who knew how to use the gear. (with the exception of the ASR-X)
Akai S900/S950
I got onto these at my friends pad with him showing me how to use it. It is simplicity itself to use, the drums come out real nice. For multi-sampling all the stuff you need is there to get the samples to come out proper. The main beef I had was the size limitation on samples. 750 K isn’t much when you wanna do a real nice mulit-sample where you take afew (3 or more per group) instead of taking like, 3 per octave and tuning it. The time spent loading up samples is ok, but can get unbearable if you want to work fast. 8 outs & Scsi cool.
7/10
Yamaha TX16W- W/ typhoon OS
Nice unit, the sound is close to the S900/S950 or maybe even an SP-1200, but not quite. The Typhoon OS makes is a much better unit. It loads up quick and has a good size memory for getting larger multisamples into it. Great filters, and great editing (compared to the yamaha OS). The layering is a bit tricky but when you get the hang of it, this thing is a monster. Add to that the price is around 75-100 dollars (with the OS disks and samples) on ebay and it can be a nice way to get the crunchy sound for less. 8 outs built in, sweet.
8/10
Boss SP-303
Not really a great unit for crunching up drums, and the sounds come out “fake” they don’t sound like they did before they went in and not in a good way. Its mad portable and got a ton of storage space from smart media cards. I did the “buy and try” from Guitar Center, carried it around in my backpack and would just pull it out to work on it like a sketchpad (like a painter carries a notebook to jot down idea’s) and it works great for that. The built in mic is OK, noting special, but its useful for grabbing samples “out of thin air”. The mic DOES impart a pretty cool sound to stuff it grabs though, the rumble in the back of the bus sounds grimey coming out of it, so it could be great as a means to grab stuff and then get it into the MPC. Still, a Mini-Disk or voice reocorded would likely sound pretty close. The use I found for it was as an effects /re-sampling box. Run the mpc to it via midi and hook the I/O into the MPC I/O and you can use it to resample sounds to the MPC with effects from the MPC, external gear or the 303’s internal effects. It’s also useful as a effects box for scratching. It’s effects aren’t the best though, and for the price its not really worth it. I did like using it as a sketchpad and a couple of the idea’s I jotted down on it made their way into tracks I did on the MPC. Dedicated knob is cool, and the features are single buttin pushes away for the most part. Basically, for what I would end up using it for, the SP-202 would do the same I would use it for (grabbing samples from odd sources out and about away from my home mic, and as a sketchpad) and cost only 150 (vs 350 for the 303). 6/10
Emu-Esi 32
Old skool sound, easy as pie to multi sample, tons of memory, a rock solid interface. (my friend claims his has NEVER crashed on him) easy to use for everything and sample editing internally is not a cumbersome as it is on some of the other models. Pretty nice for the price, but I would like to see better filters. 8/10
Ensoniq ASR-X
A MPC “knockoff” but cheaper, holds more ram (ton more ram), but I find that the ASR-X does give samples a nice sound, it colors them well. I didn’t think it would be easy to use but it was, the display is tiny though and a pain to navigate. Good sampler section. I would buy one, but the MPC does better with drums and with multisamples for some reason. I just hated editing on it, what a joke. The main beef I have is that it doesn’t know what it wants to be good at, drums? Instrument samples? Its got the ram to hold tons of multisamples, but doesn’t work well with them. The sequencer is a joke, just like all of Ensoniq’s sequencers. Timbaland uses it, but I can see how a “programming” freak such as he would love it. I like to groove my beats out live so I didn’t feel the thing. But it is useful, no doubt on that, but not for the same price as a used MPC 2000. PS the effects are a joke. 6/10
Ensoniq Mirage
Hahahah. Cheap as all get out, only numbers for editing, no graphics, next to no memory; BUT it does have a sound that is unique. When I play back beats I could tell which drums came out of the Ensoniq mirage. I don’t know if that is good or bad, but I loved this little box. Dan the Automater says this was his first sampler and he loves it still. Easy to use and easy to get out what you put into it. The thing sells for like 50 bux. The model with a keyboard built in was $75. I would buy it for drums only though as that is where I found it to excel. Nice for the $$ and great as an alternative to an S900/S950 for drums, but not as powerful, and cant do as much.
6/10
Roland Sp-808
A remix sampler. Basically a sampler, multi-tracker in one. It is ok, but I think it tries to do too much and not enough of it well enough (whew!). The sampler section is cool, wish the pads were bigger. The multitracker is a pain to use and my buddy couldn’t really explain it well enough to get what I wanted out of it, so its not easy for me to use anyway. Who cares about the “D-Beam” controller. I found myself trying to use it, then getting real frustrated by it. It sounds like most other Roland gear, which I don’t really care for. If you are using it as a self contained remix unit, it would work well, but the price is more then enough to make me want to use another device that is cheaper and better for remixing, see below. 8 tracks of recording, and built in efx that are ok, I’d say the EB16 is better. Zip disk built in is cool, but I have heard it gets funky real fast. Basically this is a “jack of all trades, master of none” device. The 3 control knobs are cool, but I expected more from a unit at this price (basically, for 300 more you can step up to a used 2K XL)
5/10
Akai Remix 16
Yikes! A cool little device geared towards remixing (hence the name). Basically it’s a dj mixer, with a sampler built in. It has pads and it samples and works a lot like a mini-MPC. Its no longer made and there are more powerful devices out there, but you cop it, toss in another 16 MB of memory and the device is proper. Its a lot like the S20, which I think is what replaced it in the Akai line when it went out of production. I can’t figure out why. The coolest is being able to just plug up a sample source (Turntable, CD etc.) and go. It is a mixer so you don’t need one to sample from Records like on the MPC. It has MIDI, 8 voice poly, which you can get around with re-sampling, 4 track sequencer, again some re-sampling and “track bouncing” and it works out real nice. RCA’s I/O (booooooo) but its ok, since this box does so much more that I can deal with it. SCSI & floppy drive, so storage ain’t no worry. For 160 dollars I like it, I like it a lot. If I wanted to use it as a re-sampling device for the MPC of a place to run the signal of acapella’s for making the remix, its nice. 16 bit stereo sampling. 7/10
Akai S20
Very similar to the Remix 16. Midi, disk drive for sample storage, pads almost just like the Remix 16 pads. Upgrade to 17 mb memory. 8 voice poly, overcome with some “sample bouncing”. RCA inputs/ outputs BOOOOOOO!. Sequencer For the $$$$ I’d rather have a remix 16. Only 32khz max sample rate. Booooooo. I think it would be useful as a drum cruncher, since the drums I put in sounded crunchy. I don’t like the lower sample rate then the MPC, which makes it a pain to move samples to and from the S20 and the MPC. I spent most of my time trying to figure out how to “de-chipmunk” samples from the MPC on the S20. It would have a use in DJ applications to trigger one shots or loops to scratch over, extend an instrumental break etc., but for the $$$$ the SP-303/SP-202 does this and more.
5/10
Yamaha SU-10
Crap, Crap, Crap, Crap, Crap. The only thing I did with it that was any good was use the ribbon controller to control some midi parameters. What a piece. It does have Midi In AND Out, but I can’t imagine what I would use it for? An external controller maybe? But I have a keyboard for that so I dunno. Portable, sure, but not really powerful or useful, at least the SP-303/SP-202 has uses beyond as a sampling unit.
2/10
Yamaha SU-200
44.1 sampling, 2 1seconds. Anything you put into this sounds terrible. The I/O is crazy noisy. Crap sequencer. Crap effects. Crap. Crap. Crap. Don’t buy this, it is totally useless.
-1/10
Akai S1000
Ok, a nice little box. 16 voice poly means layer away. 44.1 16 bit, so drop stuff between the MPC and it at will with no trouble. Killer filters, this is what I found most useful on this box. Midi, built in 8 outs, and XLR connectors so you can go right from a mic into it. SCSI, and the basics that Akai gives you. Nice gear, programmin’ it is pretty simple, my buddy showed me what to do and in 10 minutes or so it was doing what I wanted it to do, so the learning curve ain’t steep at all. Don’t sound like an S900/S950, but it does a little more in terms of multisamplin’. I like it a lot, and would cop it for what I described as my goal.
8/10
Akai S612 W/ Quick Disk Drive
W/o the drive it is worthless. Samples can go through Sysex but takes 4EVER. The poly is bunk, and so is the LFO and the filters, but for drums DANG. Grimey. Grimey. Grimey. At 50 bux, 75 w/ FDD, its worth it for drummin’
5/10
SP-12
We all heard the SP-1200, the SP 12 is similar. It don’t sound the same and has some limits, but it’s close enough. Add a commodore disk drive (super old skool) and its nice. I wouldn’t pay more the 200 for one, no matter how much someone compares it to the SP-1200, it’s not the SP-1200. the preset sounds make me laugh.
Oberheim DX
Old skool as it gets. It uses EPROM’s where you burn samples onto them, then insert the chips into the sampler. It is really a drum machine, but the EPROM burning thing makes it a sampler. Kinda expensive to use, since it costs 100 bux for an eprom reader/writer. And it takes a while to get a song onto an ep-rom and into it, but once it is, it is all good. I have a friend who uses this device and he has been telling me he uses it for ALL his drums. To use midi you’ll need to mod it, but I’ve heard that its not too hard to do. The coolest thing is its super easy to get a funky groove out of this thing with little effort. EPROMS (blank) cost almost nothing so once you start burning them you have a drum machine that you can load any sample you want into (kinda like reason’s drum machine) and it does rolls and other stuff nice. Real faders for the drums too. I messed around with a layered 808 sound my buddy had burned to roms and made a kit from 18 sounds, so you have a lot to play with. Basically, chop a loop, burn it to eprom’s and then go. Or, you can chop, layer to get the sound you want then burn to rom’s. Changing them takes no time, just pop it open, pop ‘em out and in the new ones go. Eproms from Oberheim sell cheap on the net as do EP-rom’s “sample Cd’s” just collections of roms people have burned and sell. A complete 808 kit goes for like 20 bux on the net. 6 voices, easy to use and kinda kool looking and cool sounds, not very versatile, hence the lowered rating.
6/10
Basically, I plan on going for either:
Yahama TX16W- main reason, Price Vs. Performance
Akai S1000-main reason Price Vs. Performance
I just cannot justify paying an extra 100-200 dollars for an Akai S950, when I can get a smilar effect with the Yamaha or the S1000. Proll’y go with a S1000.
