For discussion about setting up your studio and advice on the gear and equipment within it.
By tdot Sun Sep 26, 2004 8:22 pm
I'll try to keep this short. Im finished high school and I'm working full time to earn tuition for college so I'm somewhat strapped for cash.

Im looking for something simple, has good effects processors, and most importantly is cost friendly

Anything within the $500 and under category is ideal.


My options?


Roland VS 880 - Cheap, Great Effects, SOUND QUALITY?!?!

Akai DPS 8, 12, 16 - Cheap, Easy To Use, and I'm assuming will have no problems synching up with my 1000

Korg D - I DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS OTHER THAN IT IS FAIRLY CHEAP


OR


I can save up for another 5-6 months and just buy the DigiDesign 002 Control Surface, complete with ProTools and all that other good stuff.


I don't really like using computers for anything other than porn and sampling in SoundForge, so maybe I will hate the 002 DAW.


I need some advice, Right now Im using the MPC 1000, Casio WK, M-Audio Controller.

Please Help Me Youse Guys :!:
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By skalawa Sun Sep 26, 2004 8:46 pm
i understand when you say you dont like using computers for music. i dont either, but if you re gonna use it in a "tape " style fashion, then it shouldnt be too hard.
i dont know how serious you are about your music, and how much your willing to expand. off the bat, the 002 has better converters than list youve mentioned. you also have a big screen to work with, so its easy on the editing. and much quicker.

i dont knw if the horendous extra cost of the control surface over the rack is justified.

although, the list you mention, those machines are very good although i have not seen you listed the yamaha aw16. i have used tht, and i must say it is heavy, really tight piece of gear. u can really churn out some serious demos with it.

these has far less options than an 002, so it makes life really simple, and production may , may flow better for you.

you have to bear in mind, also the cost of a computer, and not some ole a** one, you need the latest, i dont know how much tht is going to put yo back by, hard drives, are an important facotr. so u might have to save a little mo, so as to get a proper pc, or mac.

cant give you definative answer, as i know not how you work, but just a couple of things to bear in mind.

By tdot Sun Sep 26, 2004 8:56 pm
thanks for the response. I really appreciate that


Like I said. I don't want my creativity to be hampered because so and so plugins dont interact well with the p4 delta omega chip bull shit. You know what I mean.

I'll look into the AW 16, but it seems a bit pricy for my blood. Im going to be goint to school for Audio Recording and Engineering so right now that is my main priority. It should be 15,000 for 3 semesters which leaves me about 2,000 for personal allowance for the whole year.

I just quit smoking weed and drinking so i could save money. So any bargains I can get will be top priority.


...
User avatar

By stryke Sun Sep 26, 2004 9:58 pm
You could go with a cheap mixer but why?Save your money up and get what you really want.Remember this is your music and you gotta invest in it.I'm not sayin' go broke tryin' to do this but why settle.I picked up a roland vs840ex but that was more reasonable for me.I don't regret it but i can't aford to wait 5 years before i can afford a digi002.(Wife and Seeds 1st)
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By binger0 Sun Sep 26, 2004 10:51 pm
dps 12i. then midi it to ur pc and control it with mesa. best bang for u buck.

By tdot Mon Sep 27, 2004 1:06 am
good looks on the responses. i really appreciate it



Im leaning towards either the Akai DPS or just sucking it up and saving up for the 002 Bundle.

I mean, in the long run I will be operating on pro tools anyway.

thanks again for the replies

By cooocooo1 Mon Sep 27, 2004 1:17 am
Keep in mind that if you go with PT you may have to get a new PC also.
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By DOVESKI Mon Sep 27, 2004 5:47 am
yo tdot, just save up for the 002 or maybe cop a used digi001, i been through the trenches man for real (i had a dps, korg d8, old tascam & yamaha mt8x) and you cant be pro tools editing (or computer tracking). like dude said its a super advanced tape player.

put this way i just laid cuts over my tracks (bounced stereo tracks) and just have three tracks dedicated to cuts - i just freestyle the scratching through the whole tracks - go back spend three minutes go through the chops on each track and edit them - same with vocals , this woulda taken days on a little DAW screen.
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By The-Shadow Mon Sep 27, 2004 3:38 pm
tdot wrote:thanks for the response. I really appreciate that


Like I said. I don't want my creativity to be hampered because so and so plugins dont interact well with the p4 delta omega chip bull ****. You know what I mean.

I'll look into the AW 16, but it seems a bit pricy for my blood. Im going to be goint to school for Audio Recording and Engineering so right now that is my main priority. It should be 15,000 for 3 semesters which leaves me about 2,000 for personal allowance for the whole year.

I just quit smoking weed and drinking so i could save money. So any bargains I can get will be top priority.


...


Where are you going for your Audio Recording and Engineering studies?

By tdot Mon Sep 27, 2004 9:13 pm
I plan on going to The Harris Institute


check out their website http://www.harrisinstitute.com/

a friend of mine goes their for their Management course and he tells me it's top notch. I have to go and take the tour sometime soon, maybe when there is nothing to do at work
User avatar

By The-Shadow Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:01 pm
tdot wrote:I plan on going to The Harris Institute


check out their website http://www.harrisinstitute.com/

a friend of mine goes their for their Management course and he tells me it's top notch. I have to go and take the tour sometime soon, maybe when there is nothing to do at work


My cousin's friend Michel just put in his application for Harris. that's the best school in Toronto man. All the profs are currently working in the industry. I've been out of school for a while, but after seeing their programs, I'm thinking of going back to school there myself.

1 year, $15Gs. If I had known about Harris before I would never have gone the Ryerson way.

Peace.

I'm going on the tour first Monday in October.

By tdot Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:24 pm
oh word?


I'll be going sometime next week too, my job is finishing friday so I might as well.

By tdot Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:48 pm
So I guess I will be going the ProTools route. Even if I don't like it, the resale value is incredible. I was looking for something cheap, yet something that would help my music creatively by not interfering in the creation process. I guess that is more important than price in the grand scheme of things

Thanks for the help yo
User avatar

By skalawa Tue Sep 28, 2004 1:03 am
ok tdot.

i see where you exactly coming from and where you going.

basiclally you want to be at "school" when away from school.

i did the very same thiing, well doing at least, i am prettty much self taught.

first a;ll

F.U.CK THE all in one porta studio. "real studios dont use sh.it like tht. not saying it in a derogatory way, but its "not industry standard"

doveski is right, pro tools is a copa dona and it is "industry standard" so it will be good to learn, cause i bet my last pound in my pocket, thts what you gonna be using at college.

engineering does not strt with automation, but rather how sound works, and the use of external effects.

try and save, save save and swallow and save again. to try recreate a "hands on" home version.

i did tht and never regreteed it. its twice as expensive as a one of those all in one devices but at least you get full on experience of how it all works.

my advice would be to go with the pro tools. even an 001, even though they have are not being supported by digidesigns any more. you dont have to worry about updates every 3 months, and if you know one pro tools, u pretty much know all.
so you can strt with tht.

important things to note.

1) compatible mother boards with the digi 001 or 002.



a

Digi 002 with Pro Tools LE 5.3.2 for Windows XP Requirements

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Digidesign Hardware Supplied with System

Digi 002
FireWire Cable (12')
Digidesign Software Supplied with Digi 002 System

Pro Tools LE version 5.3.2
(Required, does not work with other Digidesign hardware)
DigiRack Plug-Ins
DigiRack Plug-Ins & Optional Digidesign Software

Digi 002 Plug-In Finder

Control Surfaces & MIDI Interfaces

Optional Digidesign Hardware

DigiDrive FireWire 80
DigiDrive
DigiDrive MediaDock
SCSI|128 Kit
SCSI64 Kit
Performance Guidelines

Recording to the system startup drive is not recommended
For desktop models, a separate internal or external dedicated audio hard drive is highly recommended for maximum performance and track count (see Hard Drive Minimum Requirements)
Although limited recording and playback of audio tracks may be possible using the internal drive in laptop models, a separate external dedicated audio hard drive is highly recommended for maximum performance and track count. Digidesign recommends the use of FireWire drives for use with these computers. (see FireWire Drive Requirements)
When using FireWire storage with a Digi 002 systems, connect the Digi 002 and the drives to separate FireWire ports if possible
If only one port is available, connect the drives to the CPU, then connect the Digi 002 to the drives
For best performance, it is suggested that you set your monitor to 256 colors
Pentium 4 or Xeon systems with HyperThreading technology must have "Intel HyperThreading" in the system BIOS disabled.
Known Incompatibilities

Digi 002 will not function if any other Digidesign PCI cards are installed in the CPU. (Digi 001, Audiomedia III, TDM cards)
Pro Tools LE 5.3.2 is specific to the Digi 002. It will not work with any other Digidesign hardware.
Computers with motherboards containing SiS (Silicon Integrated Systems) chipsets
AMD K6, K6-2 or K6-III, K7 processor based computers.
Dell Inspiron & Latitude notebooks are not compatible with the 002.
Do not connect a DV video camera to the same FireWire bus as a Digi 002. Most CPUs with two FireWire ports still have only one FireWire bus. If you need to add an additional FireWire bus to your CPU, see the list of Digidesign-Qualified FireWire PCI & CardBus Cards
Laptops users need to disable integrated wireless networking
Pro Tools does not support RAID technology. Please do not activate this feature.
Some HP Pavilion models do not meet the minimum requirements as listed in these compatibilitiy documents. Before purchasing these or any computer, please carefully go over these documents and the exact specifications of the computer to make certain that all of the compatibility guidelines have been met.
Maximum Performance Guidelines & Known Incompatibilities — Additional Information

Qualified FireWire PCI & CardBus Cards

A 1394 ("FireWire") controller/interface is required to connect the Digi 002 to your computer. Some computers have built-in 1394 controllers, while other computers require add-in 1394 PCI or PCMCIA controller cards (purchased separately)
See: Digi 002 Qualified 1394 Interface Cards for more information
Hard Drive Minimum Requirements

SCSI Accelerator Card Requirements

Third-Party Video Capture Cards

Playback within Pro Tools is only supported via the computer monitor. Hardware Codecs are not supported. Use a third party application and card to capture video and import the video into Pro Tools. For the best performance use Avid CODEC DV files created by Avid Express DV.

Supported CPU Models & Requirements

The following CPUs are required for best performance with the Digi 002:

Intel Pentium 4 or Xeon CPUs running at 2.0 GHz (or faster)
AMD AthlonXP 2000+ CPUs (or faster)
The following CPUs are compatible with the Digi 002, but may not provide the best performance:

AMD AthlonXP 1500+ CPU (or faster)
AMD Athlon "Thunderbird" CPUs running at 800 MHz (or faster)
The following CPUs have not been fully tested and therefore are not recommended for the Digi 002, as they may not provide the best performance:

Intel Pentium III CPUs running at 600 MHz (or faster)
Multi-processor CPUs
Chipset Requirements

The following chipsets are recommended for best performance with Intel P4 processors:

Intel 850/850e
Intel 845/845e
The following chipsets are recommended for best performance with AMD Athlon and AthlonXP processors:

VIA KT266A
NVIDIA nForce
Note: The VIA KT333A and KT400A chipsets were not tested with the Digi 002.

The following chipsets will work with Athlon and AthlonXP processors, but may not provide the best performance:

AMD 760
VIA KT266
VIA KT133A
Additional Computer Requirements

System Software:

Windows XP Professional or Home Edition
Service Pack 1 Also Supported
Windows XP Settings & Requirements
Pro Tools LE 5.3.2 can NOT be installed or used on systems running Windows 98, Me, 2000, NT, 95, or 3.1
Total System RAM:

256 MB minimum, 320 MB highly recommended
Additional RAM is required for:

High edit density sessions
Sample rates above 48 KHz
DAE buffer setting larger than the default
Extensive use of plug-ins
Simultaneous use of MIDI sequencers or software options
Additional RAM is recommended for better video playback performance
Monitor, color required, minimum resolution of 1024 x 768

Apple QuickTime v6.0 recommended

Required only on systems using video
AGP graphics card with 16 MB or more video RAM required for movie playback
Available at www.apple.com/quicktime
Digi 002 Product Information

Digi 002 Product Section
Digi 002 Overview and Specifications
Digidesign ASIO Driver

Digidesign ASIO Driver for Windows XP and Digidesign Hardware



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Digidesign Compatibility Documents Index
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http://www.digidesign.com/compato/xp5/002/


with tht information your on yur way.

as far as hard drives go.

seagate has strted back thier 5 year warranty, on drives. so you should be safe. scsi would be nice.

but serial ata drives would do the job just fine


you need at least two drives, 1 system drive, with your operating system. and pro tools, absolutely nothing else. not even a scrren saver. or wall paper. no other software, except those related to audio should be on there. if you have to. so no interent, no games, dry as a mofo.
avoid anti virus, and the likes.

ensure optimum cooling. zalman do some good ones. and stay away from sp2 for now with it.

when finished, create a ghost image of the working configuration, using norton ghost. on your audio drive. by creating a seperate partition. what happens is tht, if your systems strts to act up or some shit happens, you can just restore the image back onto your system like new.

its not hard trust me

if you need indepth info, pm . me and i will let you know whts down 100.

it would be good to learn tht program like how you can walk.



as for the rest of things. later on if u cop like a s.e $35 compressor, simple reverb. and a mixer. then you can practice compression techniques and subtle uses of reverb. in accordance with a $20 patchbay. strt with some like just to get the ropes. me personally, i learnt tht as best as i could. and i am know for bass, sitting well with my drums in a mix, whilst kicking hard like jet li.
practice, practice practice. as far as monitors go, i destroyed 2 pairs, so isay leave tht for last and practice on hi fi speakers.
i dont know exact prices in the us, as i am in uk.

but i can get like a allen and heath 16.8.16 mixing desk for like £150, a comp for like £30 and reverb like 50, cables are like another 50, but i was hunting hard, everyday in the for sale section of papers, and second hand shops. i bought 1 of everything i needed, and expanded from there.

good luck on yur course.
maybe one day years down the line i can send you my work so u can mix for me. so u can charge me an arm and a leg :wink:

tweak xp, with a program like xp tweak, to strip the o.s down to its more certainly more important functions.

By tdot Tue Sep 28, 2004 1:53 am
holy sh!t, I wasn't expecting to recieve such an in depth response.

I appreciate that man, really.


It looks like I have a good enough pc as it's 2.5 ghz(i bought it new last year). Do you think I can just format the entire harddrive and load strictly ProTools on it. Would that be enough, or would I still have to create another partition?

Again, thanks for the thoughtful response