You either have it or you don't?

One theory...

I think having difficulties and struggles in life can relate directly to approaching a new skill set like making music. If you are faced with having to develop problem solving skills thru your life, you are better equipped to attack the angles and means to make music. There is no cookie cutter way to make a good song. It is always different.

Like what was said earlier, you don't want to imitate or do EXACTLY what your favorite producer did. It won't be fun even. It's important to analyze music when you want to start making it, but don't forget your own ability to be creative and innovate new techniques. That's what's important, to sort of struggle through and have 20+ mini revolutions every time you sit down to make music. To have a spontaneous decision making process, plus an understanding of the basics. You want to be able to understand how a producer got somewhere, but sometimes, that ignorance to the means of making a beat can be a powerful motivator.

If you're just trying to get to a certain 'sound' or a goal in mind to sound like *artist A* that is a boring pursuit. How do you think that artist became so renowned? They innovated. You have to admire certain things, but you have to do you.

So, let the MPC or DAW or whatever u use be a blank, open canvas. Let that first spark, be it the tempo, or the kick drum and snare be a new thing, every time.

when people refer to my art as a 'hobby' i get angry!!!

i am an artist..art is not just stuff that i shit out..

hobby!!!

course u gotta enjoy but ull enjoy more if ur good at something


this aint about how much gear u have thats a dead issue dudes been making classics with just a sampler be it an mpc, sp or whatever else.

im saying if u got it then even ur throw away tracks is gonna be on a certain level of quality like look at petestrumentals.

yes there is an element of subjectivity as to what is good but if i play a dre track a jake one track a premo track a pete rock track and a beat from a guy who has been struggling with dedication to make shit for 10 or 15 years and has all the discipline and diligence in the world his shit would sound laughable in comparison to the aforementioned cos he just aint got it.


so dont u have the eye of the beholder argument as a way to justify some wack shit with no rhythm

bare in mind the pop idol gen3eration has everyone thinking they are a true gifted artist u ve seen some of the deluded peeps on this programs thinking they have talent but most of it is self delusion

jpeg wrote:dudes been making classics with just a sampler be it an mpc, sp or whatever else.

That's not exactly true. With a few exceptions (like 36 Chambers), they were all aided by (1) talented audio engineers with thousands of dollars worth of gear, and (2) talented vocalists. Gear isn't everything, but you can't really build a house (classic record) with just a screwdriver (sampler). Maybe the framework.. But not the whole house.

if i play a dre track a jake one track a premo track a pete rock track and a beat from a guy who has been struggling with dedication to make **** for 10 or 15 years and has all the discipline and diligence in the world his **** would sound laughable in comparison to the aforementioned cos he just aint got it.


Show me that guy. The dude who does not have the talent will not have the love,therefore he won't have the discipline to stay at it for that long . That's what separates the pros from the amateurs, the dedication. Sounds like you gave up on yourself.

Cause everytime I read a interview with any of the dudes you mentioned, when they're asked to give advice to other producers the last thing they always say is stay at it.

im sure they mean stay with it if ur good at it and got the knack for it if u aint got it then u wasting ur time

dont assume that a guy with talent has no discipline, again look at alc, pete rock and dilla dudes with natural talent that r in the lab all day look at madlib.

a dude with no talent can cling hopelessly to the idea that he is good at beats and cos he has invested so much time and money in it he looses his objectivity, which if he had he would of hung it up a long time ago.

i think self assesment is important to. being real with yourself. hey, you might not be that dude like alc, dilla, or whoever...but that mean you aint ill at something close. be real with yourself, admit your strengths and weeknesses. you may realize you "aint got it", but that dont mean you should stop. you gotta enjoy yourself and stumble upon smoething you are ill at.

you might not beable to make fire beats, but aspiring to do so may lead you to being a great mixing engineer............or expert in vinyl. or great dj, or meeting people that lead you to becoming an artist manager, promoter......whatever.

your passion still may be beat making, but your talent may be something related.

stop looking at things as loses but as gains.

my wife has discovered this. she is a great communicator. she started in sales when she was like 15. went to school, etc. and got great sales jobs, people would say she was a talented sales person.........even me. but that was never really her passion. she hated it. she was awesome at it, but hated it..........took a long time to realize what her passion was and what her real talent was (communicating and helping people). now she is a esl teacher here in china. loves kids, loves teaching, loves traveling - her passions. she still get to user her talent to communicate, but can apply it to her passion.

just saying, you might have a passion for hiphop, but you might not fit gthe part of the puzzle "make beats like alchemist" you might be more like "create the album art for alchemsit". feel what im sayin? still dont mean you should stop makin beats if that makes you happy.

jpeg wrote:im sure they mean stay with it if ur good at it and got the knack for it if u aint got it then u wasting ur time

dont assume that a guy with talent has no discipline, again look at alc, pete rock and dilla dudes with natural talent that r in the lab all day look at madlib.

a dude with no talent can cling hopelessly to the idea that he is good at beats and cos he has invested so much time and money in it he looses his objectivity, which if he had he would of hung it up a long time ago.

You missed my point. The truth of the matter is there are plenty of people who can make beats, produce, play instruments, sing etc. but everybody won't make it based on those skills alone. I agree that these days the way the music game is, you should definitely keep your day job, but if you enjoy it and your good at it, then you should never stop. And it doesn't make sense to compare your beats to alc, dilla or pete rock. Those are not your peers.

cyrus wrote:i think self assesment is important to. being real with yourself. hey, you might not be that dude like alc, dilla, or whoever...but that mean you aint ill at something close. be real with yourself, admit your strengths and weeknesses. you may realize you "aint got it", but that dont mean you should stop. you gotta enjoy yourself and stumble upon smoething you are ill at.

you might not beable to make fire beats, but aspiring to do so may lead you to being a great mixing engineer............or expert in vinyl. or great dj, or meeting people that lead you to becoming an artist manager, promoter......whatever.

your passion still may be beat making, but your talent may be something related.

stop looking at things as loses but as gains.

my wife has discovered this. she is a great communicator. she started in sales when she was like 15. went to school, etc. and got great sales jobs, people would say she was a talented sales person.........even me. but that was never really her passion. she hated it. she was awesome at it, but hated it..........took a long time to realize what her passion was and what her real talent was (communicating and helping people). now she is a esl teacher here in china. loves kids, loves teaching, loves traveling - her passions. she still get to user her talent to communicate, but can apply it to her passion.

just saying, you might have a passion for hiphop, but you might not fit gthe part of the puzzle "make beats like alchemist" you might be more like "create the album art for alchemsit". feel what im sayin? still dont mean you should stop makin beats if that makes you happy.

sick point cyrus..love it

I think individuals have natural talents different from each other.

There are creative, original, stylish people. There are people who are good at mimicking. (biting)

There are people who learn faster.

Practice goes a long way, but it wont give you style and taste.

obviously if ur good at it and u like ur gonna keep going, im saying when a person is shit but wont accept that despite all the hard work time and money invested ur still shit u may as well quit

jpeg wrote:obviously if ur good at it and u like ur gonna keep going, im saying when a person is **** but wont accept that despite all the hard work time and money invested ur still **** u may as well quit

If Dre, Swiss Beatz, or Madlib told you that your beats are crap, would you quit? (I hope not!!). Maybe your music or style doesn't appeal to THEM. That doesn't make it bad or terrible. You seem hellbent bent on saying that someone is crap, wack or doesn't have it. I hope that person that you tell that to DOESN'T make a decision based on your opinion. What the guy just said about an "honest self assessment" are some of the most powerful words that I have ever read on this forum. Where is the line between "You can't play guitar as well as Steve Vai" so u are wack" vs. "You need to work on your rhythm playing and maybe increase your chord vocabulary so your music will sound better".

I never use words like "wack" because they are too general. I will judge an artist on how much EFFORT they put into their craft. Sonically, I will evaluate the mix, instrumentation, timing and technical side of it. I will then say that a track doesn't appeal to me for whatever reason. If an artist explains to me what they were trying to accomplish, I can give them my honest opinion on how close they came to it. But I would never use a word like "wack".

nothing to do with a top producer saying ur wack its about u as a fan evaluating ur shit objectively.

if u have a group of people who know hip hop and how it sounds and have knowledge of the classics from early 90s and how sounds have progressed in the 2000's 15 years of listening gives u a perspective which allows u to asses what level something is on and if its up to par.


if u know consistently that ur shit is up to a certain level then most likely u got somthing if it aint then it prolly aint in u.

again im saying this assuming u got a good work flow and knowledge of the fundamentals and taking into account u have done some years of working on the craft.

if given all of the above ur shit is not coming out on a certain level then it prolly aint for u

jpeg wrote:
again im saying this assuming u got a good work flow and knowledge of the fundamentals and taking into account u have done some years of working on the craft.

if given all of the above ur **** is not coming out on a certain level then it prolly aint for u

I have never met an artist who meets your criteria that couldn't create at least a marginally good track. If a person claims to meet your criteria and can't create a decent track - then they probably don't meet the criteria that you set forth in the quote above.

Work flow, fundamental knowledge and years of work are the larger part of what Dilla and the like have. There is no magic to it. At best they may have more aptitude for music, but the rest comes from the 3 things that you cited that ANYONE can have if they put their work in.