Challenge:

Ok, once again, this could be a rant again.....but:

How do you get timing done?

I've read the manual. I've bought the tutorial book. I did all the lessons till the end. All of 'em.
However, neither of those "manuals" tells you how to make good beats. I listened to the posted beats here, and they're all nice.

But: It's not what I'm after. Problem is, you can't describe dopeness, you gotta feel it, but for me, its slo-mo stuff, Portishead, Dj Krush, old Alec Empire in case you know.

How would you start to get a beat done like, say "Cowboys" from Portishead or "Low on Ice" by Alec Empire.
I name these beats to give you an example of what I'm talking about. "Dope" is such a subjective word.
(Slo-mo, lo-fi, crispy, swingin, deep and all that.)

I wanna program these rhythms with my own drum-samples, I spend a year to get good ones!
(And I did

It sounds naive, but I just need some impressions/suggestions by someone else.
Don't give me the "Everybody has to find on its own blablablablabla!". I f****in' know that!!
Or you'll tell me: "Make more beats, spend more time with the MPC blablablablabla".

This is what I do, I do sacrifice my precious spare summer-time alone to get better at it, wake up, get it on and all...BUT: Being an autodidact is always one-sided. I don't like it. It's quite boring to me.


I simply ask how you guys would work on this kind of sound. (except smoking weed, lol)


P.S.: We can make this thread a goddamn flame-war-pit, I don't care.
If you got serious answers, please PM.

what you don't want to hear is the truth.
btw you can check the samples used on your favorite song and reflip it on your own!!!

I do that. I dedicate my free summer time to get better at making beats, like today

Its just I'd like to hear from other people. Its honestly pure curiosity.

Btw, I usually loop music I like and record my own drums to it, then delete the original track, however, I always see that there are new tricks, or that there's sth more to it. Its still not sounding dope.

But there are mistakes in timing, heavily, thats why I was asking.

On the contrary, I wanna get to my own style, and do it my way. And I'm also aware I gotta pay dues to get there.

Besides its really funny how anal people get when its about production methods
Instead of giving real advice, its rant-digging.


I'm not a fan of trial and error, it get's you anywhere. And you can hear this! Thats why I asked.

I usually loop music I like

speed down the music and analyse
i can't tell you how to make a "dope" beat , i learn more everyday of my life
put a song on the 500 beat section to hear where you're at and maybe someone could give you a trick to progress
in first place i want to respond you:

except smoking weed, lol

try others drugs

You seem to know something about making beats but I don't understand what you're asking. Those groups you mentioned use a basic boom bap method for drums, only thing, they add effects and reverb on top. If staying on time at 69BPM is too much then you probably need to build up on your rhythm skills.

Ever saw somebody bang out drums on the lunch room table? Thats what you should be doing. Bang out drums bare handed on your desk or whatever and practice timing. Then when you get a good rhythm, try to whistle and drum at the same time or sing. If you can do those things then go back to the MPC and be like "its on mother ****!"

But thats the truth, you aint got rhythm.

Ill-Green wrote:You seem to know something about making beats but I don't understand what you're asking. Those groups you mentioned use a basic boom bap method for drums, only thing, they add effects and reverb on top. If staying on time at 69BPM is too much then you probably need to build up on your rhythm skills.

Its interesting, I learned about layering, chopping, filtering and so on, I know the basics of the production techniques, to make it sound nice (FX, compression and all that). But that made me more an engineer than a musician.
Hey, at least I got this topic done, hehe.

Here's what I usually do:

Safest method :
I go to step edit. TC=OFF, Entering the pads at the right time, if the result don't feel right timing-wise, I move or delete. This goes on until it feels ok. This is a more calculating and theoretical workflow, though.


Now, since you was talking about "boom-bap"-methods. I'll browse the forum to find out what you mean...uhm...but what does it really mean? Is there a safe definition of it?!

Ill-Green wrote:Ever saw somebody bang out drums on the lunch room table? Thats what you should be doing. Bang out drums bare handed on your desk or whatever and practice timing. Then when you get a good rhythm, try to whistle and drum at the same time or sing. If you can do those things then go back to the MPC and be like "its on mother ****!"

But thats the truth, you aint got rhythm.

Its more about recording by hand which is the problem. Specially quantize f**ks it up big time.
Also, what's really annoying is recording track-by-track if you play it live. #
I completely get out of the rhythm that way. I couldn't find a good, practical way to get this part done to my delight.


So, yes, I admit it. It might be my lack of rhythm.
I'll practice live-recording until its good. No doubt.

bambam69 wrote:How would you start to get a beat done like, say "Cowboys" from Portishead or "Low on Ice" by Alec Empire.
I name these beats to give you an example of what I'm talking about. "Dope" is such a subjective word.
(Slo-mo, lo-fi, crispy, swingin, deep and all that.)

In the case of the Alec Empire track, you'd need a hardware/software filter plus good quality reverb, 'cause there's no way you can get 'that sound' solely out of a 500. You can imitate or replicate the rhythm by chopping up breaks and re-sequencing them though. That's probably the best place to start for you.

Different sized chops will help/hinder you depending on your natural rhythm. For example, it may benefit you to leave some hi hat with the kick as a guide, rather than chopping everything clean. I would also recommend learning how to quantise correctly, and leaving it switched on.

Much of the sound and vibe you're after comes from post production, so bare that in mind.

Yeah, you got me on the Boom Bap question. I guess I should rephrase that. What they did was sampled drum breaks and slowed it down with Pitch Tune. They then chopped it up and created a drum pattern, they also layer live drumming on top which are probably mic to a reverb box for extra seasoning. I call their drums Boom Bap because it sounds closer to 90's Hip Hop style of drums but slowed down.

bambam69 wrote:I go to step edit. TC=OFF, Entering the pads at the right time, if the result don't feel right timing-wise, I move or delete. This goes on until it feels ok. This is a more calculating and theoretical workflow, though.

huh? why so complicated? you should record in realtime. that´s what it´s all about...

bambam69 wrote:Specially quantize f**ks it up big time.

then you´ve set it up the wrong way. don´t set it to 8th when you actually want to record 16th notes

**** wrote:I go to step edit. TC=OFF, Entering the pads at the right time, if the result don't feel right timing-wise, I move or delete. This goes on until it feels ok. This is a more calculating and theoretical workflow, though.

huh? why so complicated? you should record in realtime. that´s what it´s all about...

I agree on that.

The point is just when I have TC, the samples won't play how I want 'em.
Its good in Step-Edit, combined with the auto-jump, I really can program shit well this way.

Playing live is different, its my favorite! While recording, I'd use TC, but never ever I turn the swing up more than 53%. It tends to be a mess after.

TC=OFF

After that, no excuse but your own timing! (Practice Lunchroom table trick that Ill Green suggested)

Nuff said!

You should post up some of your beats so we can tell where youve gone wrong. As others have said it may be that you want a much more polished sound and only have the 500 to do it.

also, when you get bored of making something that does not work out, just load a random kit, some funky jazzy or whatever-you-like samples and make a beat... and then, without recording, put samples on it (i like to play with pianos and bass)... it`s a good way to find and practice your own style at least that`s what i do :p

Yep! This is what I do pretty often.
It's when I get in "Trial-and-error"-mode. I like this a lot.

Usually, I take a 909-kit. For some reason, the dry 909-frequencies never distort the samples, they always match
with it. Then, I switch the drum-program, and things get more interesting.

I'll upload some beats on my soundcloud pretty soon and show you what I mean with "quantize **** my rhythm up", lol.
It will take some time though, since I just upgraded to the 2000xl and I'm quite busy with it and like it a lot.

MR (Monkey)BGREEn is absolutely right about his comment, and this is what I usually do. (More challenging too!)