16 levels basslines - pete rock, dilla, kev brown

it does seem so easy how cats like nottz, dilla, pete rock and kev come up with these bass lines.

i like the sub bass sound but find it hard to have the bass stand out and not distort but at the same time still have a subb sound.

and just gettting dope patterns and bass that is strong enough to lead the whole track is a tough challenge for some i have many challenges in this area. so good post on this thread.

I've got a couple of INST programmes with bass sounds sampled from various sources (one I made from a sine wave and a saw wave). I then play around with my midi keyboard till I come up with something that suits the rest of the song.
Having just about no knowledge in musical theory is not helping me much though..
I'm really thinking about taking a course in keyboarding or sumthing like that..

good thread.

jpeg wrote:
i like the sub bass sound but find it hard to have the bass stand out and not distort but at the same time still have a subb sound.

maybe you should try out trying to cover a larger frequency range without raising the volume to clipping levels.

the easiest way I can think of to explain what I mean is.. instead of raising the volume or velocity.. maybe try doing the same notes in c2 and c3 (or on 16 levels... doing pad 1 and pad 13 at the same time) so it does medium and lower bass frequencies at the same time in the same note key...

or else you can try using EQ's to boost frequencies using a wide Q range so neighbouring frequencies also get raised... in your case that may be the lower end of the spectrum... that doesn't mean it has to be louder but simply that it could use a boost in the lower areas.

Like dwizzynfp, I got a program full of bass tones that I go through every time I start a new beat. 16 levels. I find that putting the root note at pad 4 (or 8 ) is crucial--once you make enough beats like that, you start figuring out the patterns/scales pretty soon. Sometimes working the scale out on a keyboard is necessary, it's just quicker, easier and "safer" that way.

I like this method, and have gotten some pretty great results. However, it would definitely be nice to get some note bends (etc.) going for some extra flavor. And you tend to end up with filtered basslines most of the time... I need to make some new programs and get some fresh sounds, too.

i need to get a bass guitar!

thanks for the links cyrus

I usually use the same bass note, (which was standard in the mpc lol ) but I have to get rid of it. I've also used my fl studio, there its very easy to layer like a sub with a guitar, and it sounds dope.
btw I love the 16 level function with my bass, I usually play a decent sounding bass with that, and afterwards sometimes shift it up or down a little to make it sound just a little bit more righteous. Marco Polo also does his basses this way.

knowing how to create a melody that fit the beat and leaving the space to allow shit to breathe also choosing a good bass note

jpeg wrote:knowing how to create a melody that fit the beat and leaving the space to allow **** to breathe also choosing a good bass note

definately been finding that to be the hardest part. like, i can find some melodies. but its about that space, even if its just 2 notes, or 1 main note and some ghost notes out and about. its like some of those basslines string you along and sprinkle stuff in just the right amount.

word it tough but ur approach is good like i did something similar focus on drums for a while to step up.

then im also workin on bass and wanna also work on my approach to choosing and using samples, while on the same time working on my mixing

mr_debauch wrote:try doing the same notes in c2 and c3 (or on 16 levels... doing pad 1 and pad 13 at the same time) so it does medium and lower bass frequencies at the same time in the same note key...

yeah, sometimes i've done this (pad 1+13 or 2+14 or 3+15 o 4+16)

I have a disk with like 2-3 different bass sounds in the key of C which I usually end up pitching, but that's really only when I'm trying to do a simple bass pattern for my beat... otherwise i'll wait until I've recorded everything into reaper than pull up a decent VST (trilogy/minimonsta/scarbee bass for kontakt) or sometimes just simply use the Reasynth and make a sub bass I like and use that.
But I really agree, Kev Brown, Pete Rock, Dilla (RIP) know (knew) something we dont lol, It feels like their basslines come off smoother, not to mention the fact that kev brown's bass's almost always sound pitch perfect (which is surprising when he uses higher notes) as the pitch deteriorates on my 2kxl when I do too much with it.
I'll definitely be watching this topic cause It'd be nice to see some real bassist (felt like i typed racist then) ideas and techniques.

been heavy learning. definitely 'note on' is your friend. if you listen real close, in some of them dilla,KB,PR tracks you can actually hear the note on (i knew this before, but really started experimenting and taking it more serious)

I've been chopping out bass notes from samples, random bass heavy notes or chord hits, not just open bass sounds..........then turning note on, and filtering it real low 20 or less. it works real nice especially if the bass note is from the same sample as your main chops. its already in the same key and matches.

its been working real good. you sort of have to pick the right notes because some songs have strong bass hits that will work and some just dont cut it.

once you filter them down you loose a lot so they have to be strong, other times, the hits that are ill are covered with other instruments.

note on helps facilitate the appearance of just a bass note. like say i have a phrase with a strong bass hit at the beginning but there is a slew of piano notes on top. if i were to just chop out the bass note, id get a very short and unnatural sounding bass note....but if i where to turn note on (i can then control the length the sample plays and mess with its envelope for a smoother decay), then once i filter it down, the piano sounds are gone and the bass doesn't abruptly cut off.

another thing ive been finding to be helpful is "multiple passes" basslines. I've kind of already done this before because im not the fastest on the pads.....but after listening to kev brown's commentary, he mentioned that sometimes he'll get an ill bassline in one try, but then other times he'll do multiple passes to get the whole thing.

so i decided to really try this out. i've been figuring out the main notes, then in the first pass laying down the main. starting with the meat of the bassline - the root note on the first of each bar of my sequence on the first kick. then once i have those real main notes down, ill let it loop with record off and just experiment trying to add ghost notes or accents around the beat to make those main notes more interesting.

another thing that seems to work is to just listen to the beat and imagine the bassline in my head. the problem with that is that i cant always translate whats in my head onto the pads. so instead i listen to whats in my head, lay down the first main note in first pass. then turn off record and try to find the next note, and repeat that until i get all the notes.

another thing ive been messing with is the concept as described by dude victor wooten: in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H66K9eugZZM i found that vid in that groove secrets blog in my previous post.

anyways, i think dude is kinda dorky, but whatever, he has a point. so if you just stick that video through i think youll learn something. so he explains a concept of 'no wrong notes because you are always a half step away from a right note'. I thought about this and actually tried it out with sixteen levels. i think he's right. thats not to say that you will have magic basslines after watching the video and just pressing other pads will solve your bassline problems, but point is to not worry about the right notes, worry about the groove first.

so what ive discovered is this:
1.try to find the main notes of the sample to start with
2.once you have those main notes, stop worrying about the notes and just start experimenting with the pads, always comming back to one of those main notes.
3.finding the groove is most important, if you get that right groove, lay it down immediately, you can always go into step edit later and change the notes to the correct ones.
4. do multiple pass. listen to groove in your head, then try it out, even if the notes are wrong. you might actually get a few right, if you do, lay those down in 1 take, then go back in another pass and try to get the others right. but multiple passes
are your friend. once you get a note, lay it down in a pass. dont try to memorzie the pads and lay down the whole bassline
(unless its really simple)
5.dont worry about the ntoes, cause like in the vid there is no wrong note. things wont sound interesting if you just stick to all the note you know for sure match with the sample. leading notes, ghost notes, accent notes, etc. dont always have to be in the sample.

i think this video illustrates what im describing a bit : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_jFAhN6V9s

anyways just some thoughts. still no dilla bout basslines but just sharing somethings ive really tried to absorb since starting this thread.

ive discovered my new favorite thing with basslines:
sampling phrases or chunks of bass lines, not just one note, but then turning note on, and treating the first note of the phrase like a 1 note bass hit, occasionally holding the pad down long enough for the second or third note to play.

this seems to help me get more expresive with the bassline. i might be able to sample a nice bass hit with a slide before it, or some articulation happening from 1 note to the next. but then i get to use it in sixteen levels adding more expressive ness to my basslines.

ive been using some random bassline samples ive had and its been working out nice.
i really wish i had a real bass guitar to try this out. but what i'd eventually like to do is have a bass player lay down a bassline to my track. then take that bassline and chop it up into chunks, lay it out on the pads, then start experimenting. capturing his movements from one note to the next, but then combining it with the niceness of note on and 16 levels.

i'd like to sample several "ba dunks, boomps, da dums, wo womps" etc. then just play with those, tuning them to fit the track, but still capturing that space and articulation between the notes. feel what im saying?