JJOS.net

Today's top priority, is a donate button, and a link to the official site. When it's up, I'll send him some money.

whoa, whoa whoa.
so donations will go to you, then will be forwarded to JJ?

this whole thing is getting more and more f*cked. i wouldn't try that, and i've been in this since the first hint of jjos in 2006.
slow your roll is right. get permission first. you are in over your head. if you get their blessing then the site thing is straight, but the donations should absolutely not go through a middle man. you also absolutely need to make this clear that this is an english-based fan page, NOT in any official way connected to the actual JJOS page.

Pastor-of-Muppets wrote:

Jamon wrote:Feel free to shout out what you want, to help influence how it grows.

A wiki might be useful. Although there's loads of good info on this forum, finding it with the search engine can be hard (and most people don't even use the search engine!) The only way to make useful threads stay easily findable is to sticky them, but too many stickies doesn't scale.

A wiki (which could have pages for each release with lists of changes, sections for tips etc.) can be kept relevant and up-to-date, removing irrelevant cruft, reorganise the info, evolving it as desired.

There could even be a section which annotates JJ's manual with clearer explanations for people who find the original translated English pages hard to read.

+1

Today's top priority, is a donate button.When it's up, I'll send him some money.

Is that not illegal?

I didn't want to chime in. But I will. I feel that this is not a good idea for all the reasons stated already. However, I feel that changing the website to a JJ Wiki would be more of a service to both JJ as well as the visitors looking to find info in a clearer context. A "replacement" JJ site is basically like stealing.
"Dontations" should NEVER be part of this picture at all. If you wish to aid the JJ OS community, you need to provide ALL of the resources yourself... not rely on others to sell repackaged info that's already out there.
Did anyone ever have to pay for Stan Steez's manual? NO, Stan would NEVER charge or accept donations for his services.
There's also the issue of violating the terms of service of MPC-Forums, as this conflicts with Tutor's work as well.

BTW, I'm not trying to put down the original poster. But I just need you to see the grey areas here that you had overlooked. I'd definitely like to see you put together a wiki and see much more positive results all around.

jaydee wrote:

Pastor-of-Muppets wrote:what would be a lot more useful for everyone (and something I plan to do) would be helping JJ improve some of the "interesting" grammar on his website so it's easier to read and understand

having a separate site with fancy graphics and a login (?!) but no information or links back to JJ's site ... not so much

That would be gret..I always have to come here to get help with all the new updats because I can not understand the manual's Lingo!

There's a link to this forum from JJ's site for a reason.

wiki wiki wiki wiki wiki... Jamon It!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbb7CDFDucw

Okay, there seems to be some confusion, and it's probably my fault. I come from an open culture, where everything is public domain, so my assumptions are different from that of the world with territories that are fiercely guarded.

I'm not making a site for whomever is behind "JJ OS", I'm making it for me. I'm interested in information about the firmware I load on my MPC2500. I'm building tools to assist me when I'm thirsty for MPC info.

The site can enrich my life, and it is cheap enough to share that with you, so I do. It does not need you to use it, or permission from whomever is behind JJ OS. If you want to contribute, the value increases for all.

One of the problems I had, is not knowing when there's a new version. Another is, not being able to keep up, and missing out on downloads. Due to the nature of how JJ OS is developed, sometimes you want to run an old version.

So one of the first solutions I'm working on, is automated archival of the OS, and emailed notifications of changes. Another problem is, I thought it'd be nice to donate, because XL 3 was a free update, and I want to keep them motivated to develop.

I paid them for OS XL through PayPal. I have their PayPal address. To solve that problem, of making it easier for me and others to reward them when there's good improvements, I could add a simple method of donating to their PayPal account.

This isn't a territorial issue. I'm not collecting money, or stealing anything. I just see problems, and try to solve them, both for me, and others. I know others wanted to donate, so why not add that feature to my site about JJOS? It's their choice to accept.

They currently choose not to accept. They have PayPal set to refuse website payments like the one I was adding. So, I cannot add the button right now. I tried, but if you click it says a default error that they don't accept it and to contact them for details.

Nym, if you or others have a better idea of who is behind JJ OS, and want to talk to them about accepting donations, then maybe they want to change it. There's a setting, "Block Non-encrypted Website Payment" that they should change to, "Off". They can also create an encrypted donation button and add it to their website.

Just like they probably didn't ask Akai for permission to make MPC-Forums, there also is no need for me to do so before creating a JJOS site. I can build my own layer, that does what I want, without disturbing the people behind JJ OS.

Some take it as an offense to do so without asking, but for me, it's more polite to not bother them. I could try to email them, which is difficult because their website only has a bug form, but why? There's zero chance they'd build website features I want, and even if they did, it'd just distract them from focusing on the firmware. There's also a language barrier, and based on my experience in reporting bugs, it's not easy to communicate.

The same fear was displayed when I created akaios.com. People here accused me of all kinds of impossible things, and refused to use it. That's fine. The site has been up for years, with or without you. Nothing bad became of it.

The whole site will be in the spirit of wiki, and licensed for free sharing. I'll make it easy to download formatted versions of the info, so you can keep it, and if I die then you still have your works.

I understand your intentions are good and you're not trying to do anyone wrong. It's just how it would appear to a lot of people, which you had already addressed above. I'm sure with some more planning, it'll be a valuable resource. I'm glad to see you'd like to go the wiki route. If anything, the constructive criticism being shared is like a blessing in disguise, since you brought it to our attention before proceeding to build the site. Now all your energy for this project will be more focused in the right direction without having to go back and undo any content. Good luck. I got your back and I'll support in any way possible, given that everything is in the process of being sorted out.

Jamon wrote:One of the problems I had, is not knowing when there's a new version. Another is, not being able to keep up, and missing out on downloads. Due to the nature of how JJ OS is developed, sometimes you want to run an old version.

Listen, people here are very protective of JJ. That's a case closed thing. We are all for sharing but we have people here whom check daily (I know I do... it's also a little competition thing as well to see who got it first, it's part of the fun) just so everyone has the latest and greatest and post it as soon as it comes out. If you were on the site the past few days, weeks even JJ placed a date in the brackets of when the next load will take place... you just have to pay attention to the site. Mark it as a favorite or make it your home page.

There is a file somewhere that contains all of JJ's files (if someone can provide Jamon with that, please help him get those files...thanks).

I am going to say that you knowing how many files are DL'ed in numbers and what has been fixed is none of our business as it relates to JJ. Currently there are 792747 visits to the site... the number is on the top right hand corner, you can get an idea of how many people have looked at the site and determine that most have DL'ed files.

It seems like your going overboard with your site idea. When and if you have a request for add-on or possible bug and need a fix, JJ has an email for that and he really pays attention to this site for issues and sets himself up to help with what he can. When he is ready to update something he will let us know in one way or another. JJ has a youtube channel and shows a small vid of thing to come (http://www.youtube.com/user/60017120)... subscribe and you'll also be in the know.

As others have stated there is a link on the JJ site to this very forum. Plus there is a "bug fix" page that lets you know what may have been fixed.

http://www7a.biglobe.ne.jp/~mpc1000/bug/


Again, your heart is in the right place, but I think the wiki thing would do justice for what you may have in mind.


Good luck,


xPEACE goes out.

Jamon, if there's anything we can help out with, let us know. I've been on the JJ OS since the beginning. I may also have the OS that JJ made before the Free OS, which most of us were hesistant to try back in late '05 - early '06. If I can find them on backup discs, you can add them to the archive if you want. Maybe a timeline story of the OS development would make an interesting read for those who are interested in it's beginnings to the present day. Lots of good info like that would make it a more complete resource. Let me know what you need and I'll dig up what I can.

bottom line is that JJ is:
1. a coder not a web or graphic designer.
2. not a native english speaker.

these two things mean that his website is a lot more confusing & cluttered than it needs to be. i've been in the JJ OS game for a number of years & emailed him numerous times and even i get confused by his site sometimes, so i can imagine how someone new to the whole thing might feel.

i think the best thing would be for Jamon and/or others to work with JJ on a new design for his site. remove the clutter, organize the info better, correct some of the confusing wording, etc...

i like the 'jjos.net' url. it would be nice to be able to use that as the home for the full JJ os site with a paypal donation link, etc... Jamon, i really think you should contact JJ directly and discuss this with him. i'm sure a lot of the things you are suggesting (paypal, wiki) are things that JJ just does not have the technical knowledge to implement and never considered. send him a message thru the bug report section on his site and include your email address and then he will get back to you directly via email and you can continue to correspond that way.

most likeley JJ does not have the time/skills to put into a major redesign of his site, but i'm sure if he knew there were people out there who had the knowledge and were already starting to do something like that for themselves, he would be happy to work with them.

The JJ OS is most likely something that he does on the side. All the technology is available to him. But the project moves forward because there is no overhead. I'm sure his site janitor doesn't get paid much. He's probably just a friend with minimal skills at a minimal cost.

Sooty_G wrote:most likeley JJ does not have the time/skills to put into a major redesign of his site

lack of time, maybe, lack of giving a crap enough to improve the site, maybe ... lack of skils? I'm pretty sure that he could handle a bit of HTML given what he can make the mpc1000 do!

Jamon wrote:Just like they probably didn't ask Akai for permission to make MPC-Forums, there also is no need for me to do so before creating a JJOS site. I can build my own layer, that does what I want, without disturbing the people behind JJ OS.

you're free to create a website, but you are distributing the JJOS software, without even saying where it comes from - as far as I know that software is NOT public domain, so you are in breach of copyright. just cos you come from a public domain background doesn't mean you can treat everything like that

Jamon wrote:The whole site will be in the spirit of wiki, and licensed for free sharing. I'll make it easy to download formatted versions of the info, so you can keep it, and if I die then you still have your works.

What do you mean "in the spirit of wiki"? my suggestion is that it should be a wiki. the only difficulty of running a publicly-editable wiki is monitoring it for spammers adding spam to it.
(and by wiki I'm not talking about wikipedia, that site is just one example of a wiki and used the wiki idea from the original wiki wiki web)

Cool Page Jamon

I'm kinda liking the idea of a better front end.

Maybe the page could function like a GUI like in Windows - where you have the OKish user interface which seems to hide all kinds of atrocity behind it. Perhaps a bit of a misleading metaphor, Jamon's GUI is much more stylish than Windows & JJ's pages are merely quirky & idiosyncratic.

But the JJOS.net could link to the relevant pages in JJ biglobe an give perhaps & little explanation of what JJ is trying to say. I'm still confused by JJ's site & I've bought a couple of DLs.

But it'd all be done out of love though. Because, let's admit it, whom amongst us does not love JJ with all their heart.