a call for objectivity.

I had to pull this post from the Korg Forum. It really relates to this particular thread and the tone of this forum:

ScoobyDoo555 wrote:GENUINE.

OK, I think it's fair to say that there's a LOT of complaining in this forum about Kronos and Korg.

Whilst I don't agree with some of the complaints, I DO accept and respect the right to voice your grievances (no, really). I too have fallen victim to complaining and getting rather annoyed with fellow members for this.

As has been pointed out though, WE are the community, and should be sticking together - sadly when you come onto this site at the moment, there is quite an unpleasant tone, especially in the Kronos section. So much so, that personally, I reduced my time contributing here because I could guess what type of threads were going to crop up. Each time I came back, I was proven right.

For example, at the time of writing, 25% on the threads on the opening Kronos page are focussed on complaints, b1tching and whining. I haven't even looked past page 1!!

NOT a good impression to new-comers, nor to the outside world. I think we can definitely agree on this.

Now, instead of complaining about this, I would like to propose a sticky thread/folder for complaints - the regular users on this site ALL know that there have been QC issues and reliability problems - there's no need to keep on putting up NEW threads with the same content imho.

Would a complaints sub-froum sort this out? All the mods would have to do is just move threads into this new area......

This will then clean up the forum and (a) will provide a platform for those with grievances and (b) give a better impression to the outside world when they visit Korg Forums?

After all, as a community, we WANT Korg to support this place and be helpful: at present, I feel the impression given isn't one that Korg would even want to be involved with Yes Korg have a responsibility to sort everything out, and they will.....but publicly complaining about them isn't exactly going to speed the process up, is it?

Yes, we can argue that Korg have caused the problem in the first place, blah, blah, blah....... and if you want to tie yourselves in knots over this, be my guest.
However, let's try an focus on some positives -
1. the machine IS good.
2. the machine IS supported........by both Korg and (more importantly!) US - there are some GREAT threads about the machine.... sadly getting lost in the ether
3. ANY issues you have with your machine ARE covered under warranty, so will be fixed.

Rest assured though, if something isn't done, and there are documented examples of how forum users have caused the demise of a forum, the future isn't as rosy as you would hope imho.

Let's sort it out then

Dan

He is no relation of mine...

I don't see how anybody can hate on the Rennaisance....they have know idea what it can or can't do yet!

I for one like the concept. The fact that it could turn into a 60,3000, or 2000 etc. plus I can use it as a plugin for Logic.

If this was a standalone unit without a DAW I doubt I would have even considered it. My MPC 1000(JJ OS) and 4000 does everything I need a piece of outboard gear to do. The MPC that is coming out now, is the type of MPC I needed- if the software is on point.

scoobylol wrote:In all honesty I don't give a f*ck about this product, it's a sheep in wolves clothing.

You may be right Scoob. There's certainly no innovation going on here, that's for sure. My biggest concern is that it's just a basic MPC in software form, in which case it is bringing nothing new to the table other than a better controller than Maschine, and a bit of extra convenience which Maschine already has covered.

Even on a shiny new Mac with a decent interface, Maschine can start crackling the audio to bits with just a handful of plugins running, so I don't know if Akai will include multi-core support from the start. I personally think it is essential, just so the full power of the computer can be harnessed.

I'm genuinely prepared to be won over, but I'm going to take some serious convincing.

Coz wrote:

switch18 wrote:My recommended track of the week is VCMG's-Spock. These 2 artist haven't collaborated in 30 years and they decided to do some minimal techno goodness over email. VC is Vince Clarke of Erasure, Yaz, Depeche Mode and MG is Martin Gore of Depeche Mode.

Enjoy...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq0eEQCRpT8

Nice one for posting this mate!

+1

Coz wrote:

scoobylol wrote:In all honesty I don't give a f*ck about this product, it's a sheep in wolves clothing.

You may be right Scoob. There's certainly no innovation going on here, that's for sure. My biggest concern is that it's just a basic MPC in software form, in which case it is bringing nothing new to the table other than a better controller than Maschine, and a bit of extra convenience which Maschine already has covered.

Even on a shiny new Mac with a decent interface, Maschine can start crackling the audio to bits with just a handful of plugins running, so I don't know if Akai will include multi-core support from the start. I personally think it is essential, just so the full power of the computer can be harnessed.

I'm genuinely prepared to be won over, but I'm going to take some serious convincing.

How can you say there's no innovation, when you don't know what the software does yet?

All they showed was a controller and a DAW interface.


It's has a soundcard, inputs, and if the vintage emulations are on point..I don't see how anybody can hate. You have MPC chopping and sequencing on your computer that can be used as a plugin for your main DAW. That's tight to me.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:How can you say there's no innovation, when you don't know what the software does yet?

They've already spelt out in basic terms what the software is... in essence, it's a direct copy of what Maschine does. They are even bundling it with a 6 gig sample library. Guess who else does the EXACT same thing?! That's not innovation in my book.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:the vintage emulations are on point

You have absolutely no idea if they are "on point", so stop making assumptions.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:I don't see how anybody can hate.

Genuine concerns do not equal "hate". Akai have made an easy sale with you but I need convincing, especially on the software coding side of things.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:You have MPC chopping and sequencing on your computer that can be used as a plugin for your main DAW. That's tight to me.

I like the idea too (convenience is King in a lot of situations) but Nu-Akai have literally no pedigree in developing software like this. Paired with a real MPC it could be deadly though.

Coz wrote:

MPCWeapon1 wrote:How can you say there's no innovation, when you don't know what the software does yet?

They've already spelt out in basic terms what the software is... in essence, it's a direct copy of what Maschine does. They are even bundling it with a 6 Gig sample library. Guess who else does the EXACT same thing?! That's not innovation in my book.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:the vintage emulations are on point

You have absolutely no idea if they are "on point", so stop making assumptions.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:I don't see how anybody can hate.

Genuine concerns do not equal "hate". Akai have made an easy sale with you but I need convincing, especially on the software coding side of things.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:You have MPC chopping and sequencing on your computer that can be used as a plugin for your main DAW. That's tight to me.

I like the idea too (convenience is King in a lot of situations) but Nu-Akai have literally no pedigree in developing software like this. Paired with a real MPC it could be deadly though.

Ok so you like the idea, but Numark's lack of credibility is preventing you from being excited about it....I get it.....and I'm with you on that.

distortedtekno wrote:

Coz wrote:

switch18 wrote:My recommended track of the week is VCMG's-Spock. These 2 artist haven't collaborated in 30 years and they decided to do some minimal techno goodness over email. VC is Vince Clarke of Erasure, Yaz, Depeche Mode and MG is Martin Gore of Depeche Mode.

Enjoy...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq0eEQCRpT8

Nice one for posting this mate!

+1

I'm so excited about this collaboration. Those 2 are my idols. I ordered the vinyl from Mute. Looking forward to the upcoming EP's too.

Being around here as long as Nym has, it's fair to say nothing will ever change as far as any new products coming out for Akai. It's been that way since the MPC1000 hit the market, and continues with every new product thereafter. I used to be the antagonist back in the day after so many problems with the 1k and with Akai. But spewing hate didn't get me anywhere. In fact, I learned how to be more constructive by talking to Nick from VST a few years ago to come up with a plan to convince Akai to design a pad upgrade. Nick suggested that I start a petition post in the 1000 forum and sticky it. We kept everything in that topic on a positive note and just stuck with the facts that our pads are dead and we need the upgrade. Between Nick, who spoke with Akai and showed them the petition topic, and all the forum members who responded in kind, Akai saw the demand and designed the upgrade. Of course many people were complaining that it cost $180. But at least we got out pad upgrades.

The point I'm making here is similar to what Nym and Jah were saying... being proactive and constructive is a better way of handling things. Akai isn't perfect, and neither are most other companies in the industry. However, in these times where competition in the industry is stronger than ever, companies like Akai and many others are listening... they're up in these very forums taking notes, trying to get info on what people would like to see in future products. Knowing all this is a good thing. Many of the features in new products came from our suggestions. So criticism is good when done in a constructive way. It's a lot easier for a company to improve when they can cut through all the hate-posts and find all our valuable constructive criticism.

MPCWeapon1 wrote:Ok so you like the idea, but Numark's lack of credibility is preventing you from being excited about it....I get it.....and I'm with you on that.

Bingo!

If they come out at Namm and reveal that it's a specially selected team from Ableton who have developed the software, I may be a lot more interested.

switch18 wrote:I'm so excited about this collaboration. Those 2 are my idols. I ordered the vinyl from Mute. Looking forward to the upcoming EP's too.

Yeah I definitely wasn't expecting a collab from them. I thought Martin Gore had cancer a few years back when DM "Sounds Of The Universe" came out. Guess he's recovering well, or I got my info wrong?

distortedtekno wrote:

switch18 wrote:I'm so excited about this collaboration. Those 2 are my idols. I ordered the vinyl from Mute. Looking forward to the upcoming EP's too.

Yeah I definitely wasn't expecting a collab from them. I thought Martin Gore had cancer a few years back when DM "Sounds Of The Universe" came out. Guess he's recovering well, or I got my info wrong?

I liked Sound of the Universe, but I think it was lacking MG's passion. I don't know about the cancer, but it could be. VCMG and Matt Johnson of The The are probably some of my favorite songwriters of the last few decades. I wanna see another Daniel Miller or Flood produced DM album in my lifetime.

Lampdog wrote:It seems like people just want something to hate.

I watched a video yesterday JAH posted of an MPC battle. Two people performed as onlookers held cameras and acted excited. Then a judge announced the winner, and the crowd voted by taking turns shouting for their pick.

It looked very tribal, like everyone there was caught up in primal instinct, excited by the aggressive peacocking, and enjoying the fight between them and their group. It got me thinking about what people here do with their MPC.

It seems like the hate and irrational frenzy is part of the point of the MPC. The hip-hopish culture seems to derive from embracing and unleashing primitive behavior. It explains why there's so much drama in these forums.

I think it's entertaining and interesting. Humans take nothing more than a ball and basket, and around that build stadiums to get worked up into a frenzy. The MPCR and Beat Thang are boring compared to their threads.

@Jamon.... Awesome.