Bug reports & end-user support for Akai's MPC Software 'controllers' including the new MPC Studio 2, the MPC Touch, MPC Renaissance & original MPC Studio and MPC StudioB lack.
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By Blue Haze Fri Feb 10, 2012 10:24 am
Nah it wasn't me and I don't even know what you guys were talking about.
I'm just looking forward to the fully functioning completion to the
Ren and the studio. And I do happen to like the retro 3kese like look and feel.
However Coz and you are right, we can all finally agree that
TWO SONGS BUTTONS are redundant!!!!
By inthemix Fri Feb 10, 2012 10:34 am
[
JAH wrote:
xparis001 wrote:
JAH wrote:No matter which MPC you currently use, you will most likely have to adjust to the new MPC like every other MPC before it. The workflow of every MPC is different and its impossible to cater to ever MPC user.

For MPC 2000XL users, the control surface in on the left and pads to the right. The MPC Ren is the opposite. Adjustments like these will have to be made.


strictly on a personal level, I loved the 2000xl layout, but then again, I'm left handed. I realize I'm a minority.


Yup...I still use an MPC 2000XL to this day. I honestly can't really say which MPC layout I like the best. The MPC Ren layout is a good compromise taking into all account all MPC users.


Blue Haze wrote:
Coz wrote:
Blue Haze wrote:Anyway the unit is called Akai MPC RENAISSANCE going after the mpc60 and mpc3000 look and feel. This isn't the MPC 6000 so how could you expect a 2xlish layout on a semi retro classic machine?




I don't think anyone is arguing for a return to the XL layout, but it's a fair point to make comparisons because using the 'shift + button' way of jumping between modes hasn't been a predominant feature since the XL. The Mode button superseded it.



I agree that it is a fair point to compare the shift+button way to jump into mode oppose to a mode button. As far as the present pad and number layout I believe that keeping it for the classic retro style at least for this neo classic addition.


It's funny that you all mention this. I'm right handed and I can honestly say that starting on an XL then switching to a 2500 and dabbling in a 1000, the thought of the machines' layout never really crossed my mind. I mean, I noticed subconsciously that shit was switched left to right, but as far as having an impact on workflow, I never thought about that. I always felt just as comfortable on one machine as I did the others. Using the keypad or transport with my left or right hand never made any difference to me. Shocking that this affects people. Something I would have never thought of. Crazy!

The one thing that often did throw me off was the location of the Play Start button on the 1000. I was just always used to them being in a single line. But the actual placement of pads, keypad, and transport was never an aspect in my mind in regards to workflow.[/quote]


I am 'ambidextrus' ( honestly ), so the layout never bothered me either way :)
User avatar
By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 11:56 am
We don't know what the second Song button is for. I think it's a little too premature to say if it's needed or not. My educated guess is that it has something to do with saving/loading actual Song files (that you made in Song mode) from your hard drive. Maybe it brings up a list of all your save song files? Maybe in .sng format or something? Although, if this is what it's for, it could be made as a shift function for the Song Mode button. But they probably separated it to keep Data function buttons away from Mode function buttons. My guess! 8)

I personally think the shift button should stay where it's at. The majority of users are going to be teenage to adult men. They will have no problem reaching from shit to function button with one hand. However, if you move it, people with huge hands are gonna have a hard time pressing shift and accessing the Sample or Song button for example, because you'd have to twist your wrist in an uncomfortable way to hit them with your index or middle fingers due to the buttons being laid out horizontally. You'd likely have to reach those buttons with your pinky, which would also be uncomfortable after several presses.

The reason the close button layout works on an XL is because the buttons are laid out in a more vertical fashion, which is how your hand spreads out in relation to the buttons when sitting in front of an MPC. Our hands don't spread sideways, which is what they would have to do if the shift button is to close. I'd have to turn the MPC sideways like the picture below to use it without spraining my wrist.



Image










One more time for reference:
Image
Last edited by DJ Hellfire on Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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By JAH Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:15 pm
Duhhhhh....lol

The second song button is a filter for the file browser.

Also, I wish we had a pic of the MPC Ren next to the MPC 5000 and 3000 to give us a better idea what it looks like. Saint Joe and Flux did say it looks much better in person.
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By Blue Haze Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:26 pm
I can see the song button on top for mode to order the sequences. But project button would take the place of song files just like any other sequencer like maschine, logic, ableton you name it. To have two buttons for Song sequence and song files isn't practical if you have what 4 to 5 project folders?

Andy or Dan need to explain the logic behind it, or while it is still early change the function and the label since this is only a prototype plus it would be confusing for any user who haven't read a PDF manual on it. We have agreed on most things but TWO SONGS buttons should be reduced to one button and the user like any only mpc can page through it. Project mode should contain the saved song files or compacted sequences.

Plus I got to go with Dan's plan to switch the places of the main and shift buttons.
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By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:41 pm
JAH wrote:Duhhhhh....lol

The second song button is a filter for the file browser.

Also, I wish we had a pic of the MPC Ren next to the MPC 5000 and 3000 to give us a better idea what it looks like. Saint Joe and Flux did say it looks much better in person.



Yeah, but we've never had a dedicated Song format, at least not on any MPC's I've owned. So we don't actually know what the button fully does. Or do you?
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By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:48 pm
Blue Haze wrote:1. I can see the song button on top for mode to order the sequences. But project button would take the place of song files just like any other sequencer like maschine, logic, ableton you name it. To have two buttons for Song sequence and song files isn't practical if you have what 4 to 5 project folders?

Andy or Dan need to explain the logic behind it, or while it is still early change the function and the label since this is only a prototype plus it would be confusing for any user who haven't read a PDF manual on it. We have agreed on most things but TWO SONGS buttons should be reduced to one button and the user like any only mpc can page through it. Project mode should contain the saved song files or compacted sequences.

2. Plus I got to go with Dan's plan to switch the places of the main and shift buttons.


1. Maybe it's for people sequencing strictly VST's or external synths. There's no need for a project file/folder if it's just midi data being stored. Of course it could have been paired with the sequence button, but that would be too simple. My guess is that it does something we aren't familiar with. We have to know what exactly that is before deciding if it's needed or not. I haven't seen Andy or Dan talk about this button yet.

2. Have you tried mimicking the motion with your hand? Pressing shift and SONG/SAMPLE seems like it would feel awkward to me, especially after several presses. Seems like you'd have to twist your wrist a bit far, plus dodge the data wheel at the same time.
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By Coz Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:55 pm
A shift or mode button that latches would solve a lot of problems, but I'm glad people are taking a closer look at the layout. I won't even mention the fact there's 3 program buttons... :P
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By Blue Haze Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:04 pm
DJ Hellfire wrote:
Blue Haze wrote:1. I can see the song button on top for mode to order the sequences. But project button would take the place of song files just like any other sequencer like maschine, logic, ableton you name it. To have two buttons for Song sequence and song files isn't practical if you have what 4 to 5 project folders?

Andy or Dan need to explain the logic behind it, or while it is still early change the function and the label since this is only a prototype plus it would be confusing for any user who haven't read a PDF manual on it. We have agreed on most things but TWO SONGS buttons should be reduced to one button and the user like any only mpc can page through it. Project mode should contain the saved song files or compacted sequences.

2. Plus I got to go with Dan's plan to switch the places of the main and shift buttons.


1. Maybe it's for people sequencing strictly VST's or external synths. There's no need for a project file/folder if it's just midi data being stored. Of course it could have been paired with the sequence button, but that would be too simple. My guess is that it does something we aren't familiar with. We have to know what exactly that is before deciding if it's needed or not. I haven't seen Andy or Dan talk about this button yet.


If it operates like a daw then all sequences, automation, effects, plugins, and data would be saved within the project like maschine and logic in a project folder. Most software operates the save be it ableton, spark or a daw from my experience. This seems to be the way.

2. Have you tried mimicking the motion with your hand? Pressing shift and SONG/SAMPLE seems like it would feel awkward to me, especially after several presses. Seems like you'd have to twist your wrist a bit far, plus dodge the data wheel at the same time.



From using the 4k I'm used to the main button being by the data wheel. The shift button seems more akin to the window button (which is gone go figure) but sometimes I used a two hand operation with the other mpcs especially the 1k when I had it to press down on it. From looking at the Ren face we are going to need two hands for that pad mute and note repeat way over there. :?

But no biggy for me.


Dan where are you?
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By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:10 pm
Blue Haze wrote:From using the 4k I'm used to the main button being by the data wheel. The shift button seems more akin to the window button (which is gone go figure) but sometimes I used a two hand operation with the other mpcs especially the 1k when I had it to press down on it. From looking at the Ren face we are going to need two hands for that erase, and qlink trigger way over there. :?




Yeah, but the data wheel on the 4K is like 1/4" high. Doesn't really get in the way. The one on the Ren looks like it's about 3/4"-1" in height, which the right side of your hand has to navigate around.
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By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:15 pm
Coz wrote:A shift or mode button that latches would solve a lot of problems, but I'm glad people are taking a closer look at the layout. I won't even mention the fact there's 3 program buttons... :P



Honestly, the only thing about this layout that bothers me is the Shifted pad banks. E-H are gonna be virtually useless in a live situation for switching quickly between them. I guess one could argue that people have made due with 4 banks all these years, but... And I'm not fond of the plastic shit the knobs are mounted in.
Last edited by DJ Hellfire on Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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By Blue Haze Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:15 pm
Coz wrote:A shift or mode button that latches would solve a lot of problems, but I'm glad people are taking a closer look at the layout. I won't even mention the fact there's 3 program buttons... :P


That is a great idea as the 4k already has a function in misc to set note repeat to latch at least.

3 programs hmmmmmmmm. I'm guessing program mix is just the mix page, program is of course the edit, zones, and program matrix, the other I don't know. Better labeling is needed by something.
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By Coz Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:41 pm
DJ Hellfire wrote:Honestly, the only thing about this layout that bothers me is the Shifted pad banks. E-H are gonna be virtually useless in a live situation for switching quickly between them. I guess one could argue that people have made due with 4 banks all these years, but... And I'm not fond of the plastic shit the knobs are mounted in.




Back in my XL days 8 pad banks would have been a godsend, but I'm much more in tune with using programs with JJ on the 2500. I just find it easier to switch an entire program to poly or mono, or edit an entire program in one go rather than digging around and editing each sample separately. I get your point though.
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By Coz Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:47 pm
Blue Haze wrote:3 programs hmmmmmmmm. I'm guessing program mix is just the mix page, program is of course the edit, zones, and program matrix, the other I don't know. Better labeling is needed by something.



They seem to have devoted a lot of buttons to navigating the file system.

It might just be me, but I find navigating a bunch of sounds, plugins, projects much easier on the computer screen with a trackpad/mouse with Maschine rather than relying on the dedicated knobs and LCD.

If I'm going through a bunch a sounds I just use the down arrow on my keyboard with it set to auto play. It's faster IMO.
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By DJ Hellfire Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:21 pm
Coz wrote:
DJ Hellfire wrote:Honestly, the only thing about this layout that bothers me is the Shifted pad banks. E-H are gonna be virtually useless in a live situation for switching quickly between them. I guess one could argue that people have made due with 4 banks all these years, but... And I'm not fond of the plastic shit the knobs are mounted in.




Back in my XL days 8 pad banks would have been a godsend, but I'm much more in tune with using programs with JJ on the 2500. I just find it easier to switch an entire program to poly or mono, or edit an entire program in one go rather than digging around and editing each sample separately. I get your point though.



Me too! I'm just saying from the standpoint of having more active chops in a program than just 64. Like there were times on my 2500 where I would chop a sample into 90+ pieces and I had to make multiple programs. Those extra pad banks combined with JJ's global program edit would have been amazing!