loop length preferences?

Reading through the "beginner mistakes" thread, I was interested in the loop length discussion.

It's something I've been experimenting with as I dive into this beat making world and was curious what you all find to be the most appealing to your own styles.

I've been finding that even 4 bar loops feel a bit stale to me. But the dumb thing is...when I try and push it to 8, I end up thinking it sounds convoluted. It could be that I am not making my 4 bar loops dynamic enough.

***understanding of course that something like beat length is totally a style preference and there is no "right" way.

I was just curious what people typically find themselves gravitating to.

It all depends on the song.

For example, no sense having two 4-bar loops if it's going to be alternating between the two.

I ALWAYS use 2 bars to create 1.
Or 1 per kick, 1 per snare, more room for add-on, I always worked like that, or take 1,5 bar to create 1 for creating 3rds, but I don know if thats correct lol.. i just don care as long as it suits and profits my workflow I just do...
I like to have more working space

Sorry, have to mention my comment is regarding to drumloops.... but I adapt it to the samples to so it wont really change.. for me personally

Addition..

I always do like this.. and sure it depends on track, but its mostly ends working this way:

3 loops, + 1 different is 4, then addition of sample of sumting..
3 loops, + 1 different is 8.

Then copy past with changes in drum or samples n shit.. sum breaks..

16 bars now..

Then play with the sequences and shit.. dunno if you mean this like.

oh man, it can be very varied.. and using odd numbers like 9 or whatever..

but here's how it usually goes when using the mpc. i like to have some short 4 bar sequences that i can just loop if i want them to be longer, and to have something shorter to jump between then recording myself mixing them live if i want quicker swaps.. then i like to make longer versions that might have some drum variations, and then maybe i'll start by making it 8 bars and see if that sounds ok.. maybe i'll change the time signature on some bars to create variation that way too

also if you are using polyrhythms with the 2nd sequence feature and use different bar lengths that uses variations, then you cant simply call it 8 bars if the 2nd sequence is 8 bars with the last bar set to 5/4.. because then, if i am thinking right, then your overall bar lenght is 5 times the 1st sequence, as because ot changing the last bar to 5/4, when played together they have to loop 5 times before getting back to its original state.. where each time it start over, it creates a new rhythmic variation because of the 2nd sequence starting one 4th bar length later than the first sequence when it startes over

might be counting wrong though.. you dont exactly have to do much counting since the mpc is doing it for you

well, the way i look at it...if your using loops, your song will have to be sort of focused around it, because it will not change. even if you have a good loop, it will get monotonous after awhile, so this is where change ups, mutes and extra instruments come into play, and also more interesting drum patterns.

if something becomes "stale", then add some spice to it, like cooking. thats pretty much what beat making is...like cooking.

Great insight! Thanks.

I need to get into playing with muting. Right now I kind of just create a 4 bar loop, sit back and think 'that sounds alright'....then after about a minute of it looping I get bored and delete it. haha

I haven't yet transitioned from learning phase to actually using the MPC in our songwriting either. So that is probably where I will find the most ability to change it up. Right now I am just playing around with the static loop build.

I've been out of town so I haven't been able to play with the MPC for over a week. Time to get back to it!

Thanks again all...I would love to hear more insight from others too.

a lot of times i'll use the four bar loop to establish my groove and get the basic stuff down.

i'll use 8 bar and even 16bars if i want to switch the drums up slightly throughout or something like that

or even if i want to vary how i play something i'll go for a longer loop

but yea whatever works for the song

check the song in my sig, when it drops the chord progression mandates it be 16bars

experiment with sh!t til it works

and I'm done

DPM wrote: if something becomes "stale", then add some spice to it, like cooking. thats pretty much what beat making is...like cooking.

sigging

scobbs wrote:Right now I kind of just create a 4 bar loop, sit back and think 'that sounds alright'....then after about a minute of it looping I get bored and delete it. haha

Well, my insight is probably far away from "natural" or "organic" music, you know it's art.. but more like art of building a house, art of cooking. Not like "art" of painting images rolling all over on the floor in paint while being naked..

So talking about released records.. while mixing two songs, djs choose at least 16 bar coresponding periods on both tracks and I consider this as a fast mix.

Usually the goal is to mix at 32bar points on both tracks, and this is where mix will sound smooth like one song. So, you push the second record on when first is at 33,65,97,129,161 bar and so on.. ( I don't count that, I just hear "markers" in a song) Some tracks need 64bar periods to mix properly. In most cases the tension will grow in few steps of 8 or 16 bar phrases giving 32. I mean the core of the song here. Mixing at 16 is also ok and it's mostly depend on genre/song. Mixing at 32 is safe way, coz you always know what will happen and you got 32 bars to blend and cut track off.

Having that said just copy your 4bars to 32 and work from there.

damien907 wrote:

DPM wrote: if something becomes "stale", then add some spice to it, like cooking. thats pretty much what beat making is...like cooking.

sigging

ahh snap

I just take what I like....no rules man. If I like a four bar loop, I'll chop it up. If I just like hits/single notes, drum fills, I will take those and smash them all together. Also you need to keep in mind the tone you want in your loop....for example, the first two beats might be what you want, but it may resolve a different way than you want. In this case I will scour the song for the notes that I am looking for.