Discuss the various methods you use in music production, from compressor settings to equipment type.
By mwalker Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:48 am
music. if you make a beat are you a musician? no flames just want your opinions. is a dj a musician? can you make music if you are not musician? where is the line? no flames, just curious. i am not shooting down beat makers or djs because as we all know it is a skill, but are they musicians? do they make music?
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By DjChronoBeats Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:51 am
turntables are insturments so I guess
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By ieism Thu Dec 02, 2004 3:49 pm
Is an orchestra conductor a musician? He just swings a stick, how is different from banging on the mpc?

Is playing a conga that different from an mpc? You hit it and a sound comes out. :roll:

Some famous jazz musician said: If it has a melody and a rythm, it's music.

By nanoloop Fri Dec 03, 2004 12:08 am
conducter is more like a metronome there are tools and then there are instruments. its a deffenent grey area more and more with the advent of technology.

By mwalker Fri Dec 03, 2004 12:20 am
well a conductor could possible play every instrument in the orchestra. 9 times out of 10 the conductor is the nicest musician in the house. i am not starting a flame because without technology i do not think i could write a "whole" song. yes, i do play the drums but i do not play the guitar or keys well enough to be in a band. if i did not play the drum i would not consider myself a musician.
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By dubmunkey Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:21 am
nah i wouldn't call a dj a musician unless they are doing mashups with other tunes and stuff that say kid koala may pull off- and then its pretty tenuous.....

being able to play records takes no musical abaility and requires no understanding of musical concepts...its simply a case of placing a needle on a record....plus you cant actually play a record player...it emits no notes of its own and you cant therefore make music from it...can play music with it but not make music from it....

mpc is different cos that does allow you to play notes and make music even though it doesnt emit notes of its own....

greg

By deaf-mute Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:17 am
Can any old fool just pick up a sampler, a keyboard or rock a sequencer without going through a learning curve. like any instrument, would you cop
a machine and start banging beats on stage on the first day. would you play a guitar on stage after your first lesson. Beat making is like learning a new instrument. at first you'll do some real basic shit and as you progress
your beats get tighter, if you play guitar your solo's will get faster as you progress. sure anyone can do a boom chak in minutes, even a newbie, but he's still in the musical process, thinking like a musician, and not like a technician or engineer. It's a thin line but for me anyone who's trying or succeeding, learning or an expert, if your in the musical process, your a musician.
3
peace

By deaf-mute Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:26 am
[quote="dubmunkey"]nah i wouldn't call a dj a musician unless they are doing mashups with other tunes and stuff that say kid koala may pull off- and then its pretty tenuous.....

when I dj with 3 decks and there's 3 records running and I'm cutting and mixing that isht together, it don't sound like the original record. A lot of the time people ask me, what's that tune on your mix tape.. It aint one tune, it's a combination of all the records together. If you try to sync the record and throw it off beat, it won't mix... you got to at least know a bit about beat structure and understand your records build ups.... I sometimes have three records will all the faders up spinning together for long periods....
It's and instument, a form of expression, and makes people move.
think of vocals, it's not a physical instrument but imo is like an instrument.

takes a lot of learning to spin correctly....

Peace
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By dubmunkey Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:13 pm
i still dont agree....mixing tunes together ala mashup style is more musically creative then just playing a record but your not creating any music your just mixing records together....its not allowing you to play the record deck as an intrument otherwise you would be able to do more than just play back a record...ok so it takes technical skill like a real instrument does but doesnt allow you to anything more then playback a record...a real instrument gives you a range of notes you can play which are not confined by anything but your hands

oh and the voice is an instrument as it can produce notes and therefore original music on its own- a record deck cant do that.

greg

By deaf-mute Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:52 pm
dubmunkey wrote:i still dont agree....mixing tunes together ala mashup style is more musically creative then just playing a record but your not creating any music your just mixing records together....its not allowing you to play the record deck as an intrument otherwise you would be able to do more than just play back a record...ok so it takes technical skill like a real instrument does but doesnt allow you to anything more then playback a record...a real instrument gives you a range of notes you can play which are not confined by anything but your hands

oh and the voice is an instrument as it can produce notes and therefore original music on its own- a record deck cant do that.

greg


your entirely entitled to your own oppinion and I respect that no doubt. ever heard about playing basselines with a turntable, a scratch is not the sound on a record, it's your two hands and skill that that make it high pitched, low pitched, short, long you name it, like a note you play on a keyboard, play it long, short, fast, slow. you play a sample, it's a recording just like the vynil is... then it's your skills that make it a tune... difference between a floppy dj/producer and a scratchmaster/keyboard wizzard. ..you're right about the vocal. That's what I was trying to say about the voice....it doesn't look like an instrument but creates sound and it's practice that makes you hot or not. When I scratch or or do beat juggling, i am creating something new on the fly... of course turntables don't create sounds, that I think is a different point. If you wanna create music your gonna buy synths and hardware for sure, but to say to all the dj's that practice hours on end to get their technique and say 'your no musician, your just a freakin dj' is a bit patronising.... I do both music creation and dj'ing
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By bricks Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:14 pm
yes,and get ready cause there already writing scales for dj,so guess whats instore for beatmakers
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By dubmunkey Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:52 pm
until i can actually hear proper notes being emitted out of a record player i cant see the deck as a musically instruement...sure you can manipulate them to get different pitches but until one can actually be played- ie is emitting chromatic notes which can be properly controlled into a musical phrase...

ok so scratching is a sound and there is an argument (usually from pretentious classical composers) that any sound can be used in music but mashing some records together and playing a musical instrument is not the same thing and does not produces the same results...

probably best see the record player as it is, a playback device that can be manipulated but not played......im not sure many dj's would actually agree that the deck is a musical instrument....all the good ones i know do not see it that way...

greg
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By dubmunkey Fri Dec 03, 2004 2:53 pm
yes,and get ready cause there already writing scales for dj,so guess whats instore for beatmakers
_________________


lol

greg

By deaf-mute Fri Dec 03, 2004 3:36 pm
dubmunkey wrote:until i can actually hear proper notes being emitted out of a record player i cant see the deck as a musically instruement...sure you can manipulate them to get different pitches but until one can actually be played- ie is emitting chromatic notes which can be properly controlled into a musical phrase...

ok so scratching is a sound and there is an argument (usually from pretentious classical composers) that any sound can be used in music but mashing some records together and playing a musical instrument is not the same thing and does not produces the same results...

probably best see the record player as it is, a playback device that can be manipulated but not played......im not sure many dj's would actually agree that the deck is a musical instrument....all the good ones i know do not see it that way...

greg


it's too much of a debate. I agree some of your points of view... but at the end of the day, it's making people move and I think whether you produce with instruments or dj, the intention is the same.... make people have a good time and enjoy the music.....

peace to producers, beat makers dj's and conductors.. they all contibute
to my happyiness. god that's the cheese master speaking..
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By dubmunkey Fri Dec 03, 2004 4:32 pm
i agree with you completely on that deaf....always said something similar to peeps who slag off prodcuers for using certain bits o kit...as long as the listener likes it but who cares...

that though wasn't the real subject of the debate but think we can both safely agree to disagree on that one...
:wink:
greg