An Article I think everyone Should read......

Penfold wrote:

Boogie Man wrote:....he'd be doing the schit for free.....that is true artistic expression....

nah man the guy has got to EAT! why not be paid for your skills providing you deserve it...

!

no, no , no......aritistic expression is void of any outside influences....

when you start getting paid for it, it becomes a job.....

jorge guzman wrote:
most of that stuff i consider real hip hop but not no flowers jkwon, chingy, nelly, guerilla black ish.. .

so you're saying MCs who talk about parties and love aren't Hiphop??

Cmon now Boogie. Nelly talking about love is like paris hilton talking about safe sex its fake and a lie, its corny, its done to make money. Youve been a edgy borther recently on this board, whats poppin, you ok?

DOVESKI wrote:Cmon now Boogie. Nelly talking about love is like paris hilton talking about safe sex its fake and a lie, its corny, its done to make money. Youve been a edgy borther recently on this board, whats poppin, you ok?

I'm fine, but it's getting lame hearing the same thing I've been hearing for the past ten years..."this is real Hiphop, thats not real Hiphop"....Nelly, whether you or anyone wants to believe it or not is just as much Hiphop as MF Doom....Now I will say, some songs that a particular artist does isn't in the realm of Hiphop, but rather "RnB", and you can also make the case that "RnB", isn't RnB anymore either.....where is the Rythm and Blues in todays RnB??? But Nelly is Hiphop....He may not breakdance, or dj or graff write, but Hiphop doesn't begin and end with "the 4 elements" which is bullschit anyways...wheres beatboxing in that equation??? Beatboxing belongs waayyyy before graffwriting........., Nelly MCs......maybe perhaps not the way some people like or care for, but he's doing his own style the same as MF Doom...


I remember having this tape with two black guys on it with big fat gold rope chains and VERY large gold medallions.....(actually there was alot of Black guys with those same chains)they were standing in front of what appears to be a large poster of dollars....... one of these guys is considered a Hiphop "God", a legend even who changed the game so to speak......They had a classic album called Paid In Full.....was all that gold real?? were they really Paid In Full?? Did they really have all that money?? Or was all of that just a hoax too?? I don't recall Rakim owning any businesses?? Or Eric B for that matter............Look at the medallions on Eric B and Rakim and tell me they don't rival in size what todays rappers are wearing....

Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....




bumps 2 Live Crew 'we want some puzzy'........Hiphop at its rawest most basic instinct known to man type form......

Boogie Man wrote:

DOVESKI wrote:Cmon now Boogie. Nelly talking about love is like paris hilton talking about safe sex its fake and a lie, its corny, its done to make money. Youve been a edgy borther recently on this board, whats poppin, you ok?

I'm fine, but it's getting lame hearing the same thing I've been hearing for the past ten years..."this is real Hiphop, thats not real Hiphop"....Nelly, whether you or anyone wants to believe it or not is just as much Hiphop as MF Doom....Now I will say, some songs that a particular artist does isn't in the realm of Hiphop, but rather "RnB", and you can also make the case that "RnB", isn't RnB anymore either.....where is the Rythm and Blues in todays RnB??? But Nelly is Hiphop....He may not breakdance, or dj or graff write, but Hiphop doesn't begin and end with "the 4 elements" which is bullschit anyways...wheres beatboxing in that equation??? Beatboxing belongs waayyyy before graffwriting........., Nelly MCs......maybe perhaps not the way some people like or care for, but he's doing his own style the same as MF Doom...


I remember having this tape with two black guys on it with big fat gold rope chains and VERY large gold medallions.....(actually there was alot of Black guys with those same chains)they were standing in front of what appears to be a large poster of dollars....... one of these guys is considered a Hiphop "God", a legend even who changed the game so to speak......They had a classic album called Paid In Full.....was all that gold real?? were they really Paid In Full?? Did they really have all that money?? Or was all of that just a hoax too?? I don't recall Rakim owning any businesses?? Or Eric B for that matter............Look at the medallions on Eric B and Rakim and tell me they don't rival in size what todays rappers are wearing....

Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....




bumps 2 Live Crew 'we want some puzzy'........Hiphop at its rawest most basic instinct known to man type form......

So much for constant Elevation....

Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....
[/quote]

I don't totally disagree with the above post so I can kinda see where boogie is coming from.I think just some Dj/Producers,Groups,MC's etc.,have a better understanding of the history of this culture and how it started ,e.g maybe Pete Rock instead of totally cutting out the sampling & Djing maybe he'll sample different sources and Scratch different sources,where Mannie Fresh might forget sampling and cutting altogether. Keep in Mind that alot people have come into contact with hip hop in different ways at different stages in their life . Another e.g.is MF Doom, an NY MC in his mid 30's so he probably came in contact with hip hop in it's early Stages in streets (thru parties.Djing and graffiti,Etc.) Where Nelly a guy in his mid 20's from St Louis,Probably didn't have as much of a intimate exposure to hip hop and might see Hip Hop in very different light than a MF Doom type?? Something to think about!![/u]

denzekiel wrote:

Penfold wrote:
to the point ... what was it that caused the music to change the way it did in the first place? the need for moving on? the need to express more than just Daisys and Love? To Guns and Bling? or because some white guy with a pony tail saw a niche way to make dough...what ever do what makes you happy, cause that SOUND that ESSENCE what makes your head nod to a dope beat is what hip hop is. it has not gone no where it was not kid knapped or changed... but mis-represented, a counterfiet, duped, false idol, what ever ......argh! i give up!

I agree with you except for the white guy comment.. It seems to me that people of all races are weak and succumb to the mighty dollar. we need to keep moving forward with hip hop and all music in general and not resort to stereotyping . I agree with the other things you said tho.
Peace

no disrespect bruv, i was just going over all the things that have been used a reasons for why hip hop and use the term loosely for I should say rap music is why may be it is today. ..but its kool

Philly Stress wrote:Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....

I don't totally disagree with the above post so I can kinda see where boogie is coming from.I think just some Dj/Producers,Groups,MC's etc.,have a better understanding of the history of this culture and how it started ,e.g maybe Pete Rock instead of totally cutting out the sampling & Djing maybe he'll sample different sources and Scratch different sources,where Mannie Fresh might forget sampling and cutting altogether. Keep in Mind that alot people have come into contact with hip hop in different ways at different stages in their life . Another e.g.is MF Doom, an NY MC in his mid 30's so he probably came in contact with hip hop in it's early Stages in streets (thru parties.Djing and graffiti,Etc.) Where Nelly a guy in his mid 20's from St Louis,Probably didn't have as much of a intimate exposure to hip hop and might see Hip Hop in very different light than a MF Doom type?? Something to think about!![/u][/quote]

why constant reference to MF DOOM?

Boogie Man wrote:

DOVESKI wrote:Cmon now Boogie. Nelly talking about love is like paris hilton talking about safe sex its fake and a lie, its corny, its done to make money. Youve been a edgy borther recently on this board, whats poppin, you ok?

I'm fine, but it's getting lame hearing the same thing I've been hearing for the past ten years..."this is real Hiphop, thats not real Hiphop"....Nelly, whether you or anyone wants to believe it or not is just as much Hiphop as MF Doom....Now I will say, some songs that a particular artist does isn't in the realm of Hiphop, but rather "RnB", and you can also make the case that "RnB", isn't RnB anymore either.....where is the Rythm and Blues in todays RnB??? But Nelly is Hiphop....He may not breakdance, or dj or graff write, but Hiphop doesn't begin and end with "the 4 elements" which is bullschit anyways...wheres beatboxing in that equation??? Beatboxing belongs waayyyy before graffwriting........., Nelly MCs......maybe perhaps not the way some people like or care for, but he's doing his own style the same as MF Doom...


I remember having this tape with two black guys on it with big fat gold rope chains and VERY large gold medallions.....(actually there was alot of Black guys with those same chains)they were standing in front of what appears to be a large poster of dollars....... one of these guys is considered a Hiphop "God", a legend even who changed the game so to speak......They had a classic album called Paid In Full.....was all that gold real?? were they really Paid In Full?? Did they really have all that money?? Or was all of that just a hoax too?? I don't recall Rakim owning any businesses?? Or Eric B for that matter............Look at the medallions on Eric B and Rakim and tell me they don't rival in size what todays rappers are wearing....

Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....




bumps 2 Live Crew 'we want some puzzy'........Hiphop at its rawest most basic instinct known to man type form......

Basically, Philly's topics are fucin of your high.

Boogie Man wrote:

DOVESKI wrote:Cmon now Boogie. Nelly talking about love is like paris hilton talking about safe sex its fake and a lie, its corny, its done to make money. Youve been a edgy borther recently on this board, whats poppin, you ok?

I'm fine, but it's getting lame hearing the same thing I've been hearing for the past ten years..."this is real Hiphop, thats not real Hiphop"....Nelly, whether you or anyone wants to believe it or not is just as much Hiphop as MF Doom....Now I will say, some songs that a particular artist does isn't in the realm of Hiphop, but rather "RnB", and you can also make the case that "RnB", isn't RnB anymore either.....where is the Rythm and Blues in todays RnB??? But Nelly is Hiphop....He may not breakdance, or dj or graff write, but Hiphop doesn't begin and end with "the 4 elements" which is bullschit anyways...wheres beatboxing in that equation??? Beatboxing belongs waayyyy before graffwriting........., Nelly MCs......maybe perhaps not the way some people like or care for, but he's doing his own style the same as MF Doom...


I remember having this tape with two black guys on it with big fat gold rope chains and VERY large gold medallions.....(actually there was alot of Black guys with those same chains)they were standing in front of what appears to be a large poster of dollars....... one of these guys is considered a Hiphop "God", a legend even who changed the game so to speak......They had a classic album called Paid In Full.....was all that gold real?? were they really Paid In Full?? Did they really have all that money?? Or was all of that just a hoax too?? I don't recall Rakim owning any businesses?? Or Eric B for that matter............Look at the medallions on Eric B and Rakim and tell me they don't rival in size what todays rappers are wearing....

Hiphop doesn't always have to be about consciousness and superdope mcing, or complex rhyme schemes or breakbeats....Music evolves.....sometimes it gets simpler, sometimes more complex, but there is a choice for many different flavors....I just get tired of people talking about whats real and what isn't.....Now I don't consider people like RKelly as Hiphop, or B2K or Mary J Blige, or Ashanti, or whoever who is just using Hiphop as a part of thier act....




bumps 2 Live Crew 'we want some puzzy'........Hiphop at its rawest most basic instinct known to man type form......

real shiz

Graffwriting Is way more IMPORTANT to hiphop CULTURE than beatboxing if you ask me... hiphop CULTURE is much more than beats and rhymes and what you see and hear via any conventional media outlet... hiphop CULTURE is a lot more than music for me, its a way of thinking, a way of seeing things and expressing your views, whether it be sonically or visually presented, or any other creative means of expression of INDIVIDUALITY... dont get me wrong, nuff respect to all the beatboxing heads, keep doing your thing... but to discredit any form of hiphop expression more than another is just a lil ignorant...

theres another article with in one of the remix issues from years back,which has more insight with his produciton method and less indusrty bull,gossip and rumors.

fobedafied wrote::shock:

Graffwriting Is way more IMPORTANT to hiphop CULTURE than beatboxing if you ask me... hiphop CULTURE is much more than beats and rhymes and what you see and hear via any conventional media outlet... dont get me wrong, nuff respect to all the beatboxing heads, keep doing your thing... but to discredit any form of hiphop expression more than another is just a lil ignorant...

graffiti has been around longer than Hiphop...its not exclusively a Hiphop thing...Graffiti is something that was latched onto Hiphop because of the environment around the inception of Hiphop....graffiti has been around forever....to link it solely to Hiphop is ignorant...

Beatboxing on the other hand is a replacement of actual music for an MC to get busy...

hiphop CULTURE is a lot more than music for me, its a way of thinking, a way of seeing things and expressing your views, whether it be sonically or visually presented, or any other creative means of expression of INDIVIDUALITY...

you're just in a phase right now...you most likely don't have children, and very little responsilities...Hiphop in the grand scheme of things, is secondary to actual life and the responsibilites that come with being an adult....[/quote]

Boogie Man wrote:graffiti has been around longer than Hiphop...its not exclusively a Hiphop thing...Graffiti is something that was latched onto Hiphop because of the environment around the inception of Hiphop....graffiti has been around forever....to link it solely to Hiphop is ignorant...

[/quote]

Yup, all the early graff writers were metal heads, zeppelin, sabbath, sh!t like that.

graff before hiphop was primarily territorial markings and so an so was here type of chit, also the occasional band name hit up as Dove mentioned... hiphop came and created a new meaning for graff... styles, skills, ups, etc... hiphop graff is very much more intricate and complex in its purpose, not to mention style... hiphop made graff significant, graff helped hiphop grow to be more universal... graff is universally accessible now, yet few truely understand graff to the fullest...

of course hiphop is secondary to many of lifes responsibilities, most everything is ... that doesnt mean that once you are an adult you quit enjoying the things that make you happy... the only responsibility i have is of myself, and enjoying my life to the fullest extent possible...