Another 1000, 2000, ASR, DAW comparison thread...

Ok, its been done a million times, but since there is a specific thread for this we might as well do it again..

I own Logic Pro, ASR 10, MPC 1000, had a Renaissance for a while but downgraded to the Studio

Anyway, the other day I couldn't resist my gear lust and grabbed a 2000xl off ebay. For several years when Me and my partner insisted to only use logic (EXS 24) and I was never happy with the sound, and I always felt that other producers who worked with MPCs always sounded louder and more "in your face" than our stuff.

There were a few issues with the 2000xl that i bought so I am going to send it back, but I have been comparing it with my MPC 1000 and the ASR the past few days (sampling the same thing in all of them) and on my home setup the difference is minimal on some beats and more obvious on others. I didn't realize this until i listened to it in head phones. (The ASR is the most obvious difference. Sounds a little bigger and rounder, but slightly less punchy).

Ive been reading some threads about the comparison between 1000 and 2000 and some people say its a big difference and some people say its NO difference. I am assuming that the people who say there is NO difference has not have big or good enough monitors to hear the difference in the low end and/or have not compared different songs/beats/samples because it became obvious to me I listened with my DT 770 PRO head phones.

I created the same beat in the 1000 and 2000 and my girl friend and I could both tell which one was which without looking. She doesn't know anything music but she kept saying she liked the sound of the 2000 better when switching back and forth.

Would be interesting hear your comments on this. For example what kind of samples do you feel excels on the 2000? Heavy low end drums? String/horn samples? Bass etc…?

Im trying to decide if I should buy another 2000 or keep my $600 and just stick with the 1000.

Btw if someone can tell me how to attach the different sound files I can put them up for you to judge.

C.

Not the 2000, but a similar comparison to this would be good to hear, needs to be more scientifical though, audio into a good audio interface, rather than a shitty camera mic, and playing back exactly the same beat on each, rather than playing pads...

I realized that I made a mistake on one of my tests and Im also ready to say that the 1000 and 2000 sound very similar with ZERO processing. Slightly brighter on the 1000. If this is god or bad I can't really answer...

Would be interesting to hear from somebody who works in a well designed room with big monitors, sub and bass trap etc, to hear if there is a big difference on the low end or not..

The way Im hearing it now, Im not convinced that it makes sense to have both (unless I fall in love with the filters or workflow on the 2000)… I think its a major flaw that the 2000 doesn't have a hipass filter.

The 1000 looks like a little toy in comparison though. lol..

I own both an MPC 2500 and an MPC 3000 and both sound punchy and decent.

Sampling hot and mix summing are two things to try out and listen for when comparing samplers.
I can't get along with DAW drums at all. It's a whole different workflow as you have to really work to get those samples sounding as good as hardware... plus I prefer the quick hands-on immediacy of hardware.
If I had no hardware I guess I'd spend a lot more time figuring out a good DAW sampler method though... so I aint saying it's not possible.

The 2500 seems to start sounding a bit muddy when lots of sounds are playing at once, whereas the 3000 holds frequencies together a bit better.
Also, the 3000's filter and delay adds a lot to the sound of it, the timing is tighter, the OS is good with a fast workflow and sampling hot can sound good.

I like the 2500 but my main gripe is the OS. I've used all the JJOS's since 2007 and they have steadily taxed the machine more and more. Timing has suffered greatly and available Polyphony is at times bewildering... it just eats it up.

The OS starts to get sluggish depending on what you're trying to do. I get screens jumping.. e.g. after spending minutes in the TRIM screen, the OS suddenly, unexpectedly jumps back to the Main page... so you have to start trimming all over again.

JJOS is great for features, but for OS stability, bugs and loss of tight timing I can't be doing with it anymore.

I could go back to Akai OS but...meh.. I'll have the MPC 3000

I started on computers and moved to hardware.
Fiddling with a computer just doesn't appeal to me at this point in time, unless it's editing waveforms of mixdowns.

I feel the same way about DAW drums, and beats in general, and it just doesn't inspire me as much as hardware. I returned the 2000xl today but I was really starting to like it.
Still not sure if it's worth getting another one since I have the 1000 with JJos 2xl.

Would still be interesting to hear from somebody who has compared the sound of 2000xl and 1000 in a good sounding room.

What do you mean with that the timing is bad on JJOS? I haven't noticed anything like that. I usually don't have to many things going on at the same time though.

cafnyc wrote:What do you mean with that the timing is bad on JJOS? I haven't noticed anything like that. I usually don't have to many things going on at the same time though.

I found timing to get sloppy as I built my sequences up more and more. Lot's of people are very happy with an mpc 1000/2500 with JJOS though, so maybe it's just me.

I have read that the timing of the MIDI output is not very good with the various JJ OSes, apparently it is quite jittery, but have never tested it myself.

don't spread rumours unless you know first hand yo ........

i don't get any timing issues with the 1000. I do notice as you layer more and more it loses its clarity, but i think that's to do with the compressing going on out of the outputs or somethign odd happening on the back end.

they are very transparent (the nukais) i have discovered after using an older rack sampler.

i have to really work in the 1000 to get the same sounding drums that i get out of my s900.

Daw's are more like the 1000 - clean. still adds a bit of punch (the 1000) but i feel its due to the output converter rather than the sampler engine. In a DAW i still have to work like i do in the 1000 to get my drums to thump.

s900 - sample in hot and that bad boy has showered that break with gold dust and a punch in the face.

cafnyc wrote:
Btw if someone can tell me how to attach the different sound files I can put them up for you to judge.

You can't 'attach' sound files, most people use soundcloud to post samples/tracks in their posts here. Upload samples/tracks to Soundcloud, and then post the individual track links inbetween the [soundcloud][/soundcloud] thingies when composing your message here.

YouTube can also be used in the same way, but the audio quality is probably a lot worse.

peeping tom wrote:I do notice as you layer more and more it loses its clarity..

Yes. That's what I call it's mix summing capability. It comes from the quality of the components used and the summing tech in the machine.
It's not terrible, but after a while you start to wonder where your sounds are getting hidden.
You just have to take more care with your frequencies and volume.

SimonInAustralia wrote:I have read that the timing of the MIDI output is not very good with the various JJ OSes, apparently it is quite jittery, but have never tested it myself.

Yes, I've tested the jitter with all the JJOS's and the Akai OS.
The newer JJOS's are more jittery than JJOS1 and the Akai OS.

I contacted JJ about it and he's not interested in fixing it. Apparently he's had the same complaint about timing from many people.
He doesn't seem to want to focus on this issue, which to me is number one priority.
It was after telling him and him saying that he's not going to do anything about it, that I went and bought an MPC 3000.

One other thing that drove me absolutely nuts:
A couple of years ago JJ changed it so that in TRIM you have to audition with two different pads whether you want to change either the start or end point values!!
I'm really fast around the mpc and having to hit one pad to audition whilst changing the left value, then switch to another pad to audition the same sample in order to change the right value is absolutely craaaaaaaazy!!!!
And he's left it like that for the past year or so.
Pure bad user interface design.