layering samples

REally enjoying going through 'beatmaking on the mpc2000xl' to get a better understanding of why the mpc4000 has the functions it has.

Just have one or two questions Ive got.
When I load in the files provided as examples IVe noticed some things.

1. MPC 2000xl I think has attack and decay.
MPC4000 has attack decay sustain release.
Does the decay on the mpc2000xl correspond to the release on the mpc 4000 This would make the most sense to me. When I load in the files my mpc4000 changes decay and release when the tutorial talks about decay.

2. When the tutorial talks about layering samples by changing the attack and decay by using SIMULT and so moulding the samples on each pad I wonder if this is possible on the mpc 4000. I can change the ADSR settings for each pad on mpc4000 but this affects all Zones. I think the only way to do what is talked about in the tutorial would be to physically play 2 pads at once and change the ADSR settings on each pad separately. I could be wrong. Hope so!

Hope Ive made it clear what Im talking about

Honestly using a 2k tutorial for the 4k is a major stretch, the 4k is just way to advanced in what it does or how it does it.

Have you downloaded and printed all manuals and addendum for the 4k?
It's a must.

and get ready for a mind fuck

Ok ive got all the manuals. Not printed off but have them. Just find them very dry. Am using the forum as well obviously.

martyfulu wrote:Ok ive got all the manuals. Not printed off but have them. Just find them very dry. Am using the forum as well obviously.

What I am getting at, the 4k is not similar to the 2k so if that is the tutorial you are looking at you are way off the mark on what the 4k does or how it does it.

Unfortunately Tutor never made a 4k tutorial so you have to just sit down with the manuals and dig in to the unit.
The funny part is the 4k actually makes a lot more sense than it would seem even though it's a deep machine.

Ok fair enough. I do reference the manul though.Im half ways through so think ill soldier on and ive picked up some stuff already. Maybe the questions are reduntant. Appreciate the input. Would be nice to get a direct answer to my initial post. I mean they do things differently i get that and the 4000 is capable of more. I just thought the tutorial had a logical sequence which i could follow then see how the 4000 does it by checking the manual and some posts. Bad idea?

Sounds for Samplers has an excellent MPC 4000 Instructional DVD, highly recommended.

martyfulu wrote:Maybe the questions are redundant.

Basically they are redundant. The envelopes are completely different and the 4K doesn't have Simult as an option.

You just have to play around with it and see how it fits with your workflow.

Ok was thinking of checking out one of the instructional dvds.

Still think its been a useful exercise at least in terms of getting organised.

martyfulu wrote:Ok was thinking of checking out one of the instructional dvds.

Still think its been a useful exercise at least in terms of getting organised.

It mostly because you don't yet realize what you are missing by going that route.

The 4k is a whole nother bag of tricks when it comes to the 2k so for example if you look at a function from the 2k perspective it gives you like a 15% understanding of that same function in the 4k.

But hey if you feel it's working for you then keep right on trudging along.

THE ADVERSARY wrote:

martyfulu wrote:Ok was thinking of checking out one of the instructional dvds.

Still think its been a useful exercise at least in terms of getting organised.

It mostly because you don't yet realize what you are missing by going that route.

The 4k is a whole nother bag of tricks when it comes to the 2k so for example if you look at a function from the 2k perspective it gives you like a 15% understanding of that same function in the 4k.

But hey if you feel it's working for you then keep right on trudging along.

Ok I hear ya , cheers

Use Keygroup instead of Drum mode in the program menu.

martyfulu wrote:Ok fair enough. I do reference the manul though.Im half ways through so think ill soldier on and ive picked up some stuff already. Maybe the questions are reduntant. Appreciate the input. Would be nice to get a direct answer to my initial post. I mean they do things differently i get that and the 4000 is capable of more. I just thought the tutorial had a logical sequence which i could follow then see how the 4000 does it by checking the manual and some posts. Bad idea?

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=170187&hilit=layering

Hope that link works. This guy describes much better what I was trying to do. Having read the topic I think you cannot layer sounds assigned to different zones on the same pad by editing the envelopes of each zone separately.
Once you go to EDit 1 page and change stuff it changes it for the whole pad (for all zones assigned to the pad) so as far as I can see the most viable workaround is to assign samples to different pads and layer from there. (if you want to have different settings for the envelopes and/or use different types of filters)
THanks for the keygroup suggestion but I couldnt see that that made a difference. Would love to be wrong
Edit: Actually theres a few alternatives set out in that earlier topic which I havent tried so I cant say which one works best.

kronitron wrote:Use Keygroup instead of Drum mode in the program menu.

martyfulu wrote:Ok fair enough. I do reference the manul though.Im half ways through so think ill soldier on and ive picked up some stuff already. Maybe the questions are reduntant. Appreciate the input. Would be nice to get a direct answer to my initial post. I mean they do things differently i get that and the 4000 is capable of more. I just thought the tutorial had a logical sequence which i could follow then see how the 4000 does it by checking the manual and some posts. Bad idea?

What you wanna do is use key group mode. If you want two samples on the same pad, assign them to the same key range. Look into it, I use it all the time. I know exactly what you wanna do, control the envelopes separately for each layer. The only way to do this is with keygroups. If you need more explanation beyond what can be found online, let me know & I'll try to make a video explaining.

martyfulu wrote:http://www.mpc-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=170187&hilit=layering

Hope that link works. This guy describes much better what I was trying to do. Having read the topic I think you cannot layer sounds assigned to different zones on the same pad by editing the envelopes of each zone separately.
Once you go to EDit 1 page and change stuff it changes it for the whole pad (for all zones assigned to the pad) so as far as I can see the most viable workaround is to assign samples to different pads and layer from there. (if you want to have different settings for the envelopes and/or use different types of filters)
THanks for the keygroup suggestion but I couldnt see that that made a difference. Would love to be wrong
Edit: Actually theres a few alternatives set out in that earlier topic which I havent tried so I cant say which one works best.

kronitron wrote:Use Keygroup instead of Drum mode in the program menu.

martyfulu wrote:Ok fair enough. I do reference the manul though.Im half ways through so think ill soldier on and ive picked up some stuff already. Maybe the questions are reduntant. Appreciate the input. Would be nice to get a direct answer to my initial post. I mean they do things differently i get that and the 4000 is capable of more. I just thought the tutorial had a logical sequence which i could follow then see how the 4000 does it by checking the manual and some posts. Bad idea?

Yea that works. So simple in the end. Thanks