dr. dre/mel man chronic 2001 beats vs. grimey 12 bit shit

Discuss the various methods you use in music production, from compressor settings to equipment type.
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dr. dre/mel man chronic 2001 beats vs. grimey 12 bit shit

By highlife Sat Jan 15, 2005 8:30 pm
yo, i'm another newbie to these forums but i'm interested in finding out more about
different production techniques with the mpc 60 ii w/ 3.10 upgrade vs. 2000xl production
equipment. i like everything from old school grimey/gritty 12 bit pete rock/diamond
d/molemen/tribe/de la/45 king beats to CLEANER/hi fi 2000xl beats like i hear on that dre
chronic 2001 album and other shit like jay dee/vitamin d/alchemist/exile & aloe blacc/dug
infinite & no id etc.

i want to be able to produce both grimey shit and clean shit. can i use a 2000xl to do both?
i've heard of re-sampling samples to make them 12 bit somehow.

anyways, back to dr. dre/mel man beats on chronic 2001, as i sit here and listen to this
record 4 years later (probably a good 3 years since i last heard ANY of these songs) i can
GREATLY appreciate the basic, yet SLUMPING production on it. the samples and hooks
sound really fresh to me now as i have a better understanding of how beats are created
with production equipment. and you know dre sported a 2000 in that budweiser
commercial he did years back (the one with him in the airplane banging out a sequence, i
think it was bud or some other beer company) so i'm thinking that's what he's been using
for all of his aftermath/post-death row material.

i really like the shady LP beats and the kurupt kuruption LP beats. i know mel man did shit
for xzibit too. i went back and listened a bunch of those records tonight and really liked
what i heard. are those types of beats pretty easy to create with a MPC? i'm sure it's not
easy, but more time consuming than hard and i'm willing to put in the fine tuning work. i'm
just wondering if you guys can provide me with some advice on what model/type of other
production hardware i should look into to be able to produce the grimey stuff as well as
clean, crisp, head nodders like the beats described above.

any and all help is greatly appreciated. thanks in advance!
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By Prah_860_ Sun Jan 16, 2005 1:09 am
well the method on 2001......was grimey and clean shiz....with a perfect mixing technique.......

I don't know if new dre stuff has this same technique going on...but 2001 would be a bad reference only because....dre's mixing game(quik's game is on point too) is almost unmatched in this thing we call hip hop!
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By Blue Haze Sun Jan 16, 2005 4:05 am
Go back to that O.G. Chronic 1 the second is good main difference Chronic two more sonic synth sounds oppose to the Hard ass drums with the funky samples riding over. My two cents. But skip that The Wash LP it wasn`t up to standard. :D
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By Lampdog Sun Jan 16, 2005 6:40 am
No matter which MPC he uses, to make beats like his takes HIS skill.

"so i'm thinking that's what he's been using for all of his aftermath/post-death row material."
Unless he tells you or he says so in an interview why speculate? You've only seen a small piece of his elaborate puzzle I'm sure.

"dre's mixing game(quik's game is on point too) is almost unmatched in this thing we call hip hop!"
Very true, I listen to alot of the same 2 cd's adn afterwards try to get my quality to as close as I can to that engineering level as I possibly can, why, cause it's damn near perfection to my ears. I use that engineering as a reference for my own mastering/mixing techniques. I would advise anyone to do the same with their favorite producers and imitate that sweet quality. After doing that for a while you get the hang of some of it and can floss out on your own mixing and engineering techniques.
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By Prah_860_ Sun Jan 16, 2005 8:41 am
Blue Haze wrote:Go back to that O.G. Chronic 1 the second is good main difference Chronic two more sonic synth sounds oppose to the Hard ass drums with the funky samples riding over. My two cents. But skip that The Wash LP it wasn`t up to standard. :D


The Wash and Dr. Dre Presents The AfterMath....is NOT a DRE Album...just merely compilations.....on which both of them you can can find 2 or 3 beatz which DRE puts his name on....on The Aftermath...tracks Produced By Bud'da shines real big.....he was suppose to be Dre's go to man....but oh well...life goes on.....lol

By oldschooler Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:30 am
eeeh, Dre uses almost everything, mpc3000, mpc2000xl, sp1200, s900 so doesn't really matter what u use, just the thing you gonna do with it.

oyeah, if you wanna sound like em get a ssl mixing table of $500.000 :lol:
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By Blue Haze Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:37 am
Prah_860_ wrote:
Blue Haze wrote:Go back to that O.G. Chronic 1 the second is good main difference Chronic two more sonic synth sounds oppose to the Hard ass drums with the funky samples riding over. My two cents. But skip that The Wash LP it wasn`t up to standard. :D


The Wash and Dr. Dre Presents The AfterMath....is NOT a DRE Album...just merely compilations.....on which both of them you can can find 2 or 3 beatz which DRE puts his name on....on The Aftermath...tracks Produced By Bud'da shines real big.....he was suppose to be Dre's go to man....but oh well...life goes on.....lol


That`s right on point; however, most of the producers on the "The Wash" album were trying to emulate the Dre sound at that time thru the Dre recording school method with Dre either mixing or executive producing and it still didn`t come out right you know. If a cat is trying to be like Dre or get that Dre sound which has more of a personal touch I wanted to stress the Original Chronic showcased drums and programming whereas the second showcased more of the sonics of a well done keyboard based production. Whatever happened to Dre`s partner on drum Sam Sneed I forgot?
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By Lampdog Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:38 am
oldschooler wrote:oyeah, if you wanna sound like em get a ssl mixing table of $500.000 :lol:


I've read about that many times myself. He stated that it's a KEY factor in his warmth of sound quality.
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By skalawa Sun Jan 16, 2005 10:01 am
and it definately is, making beats is one thing, for all i care you can use a bloody casio keyboard.

"professional studios" work like this

theres a tracking engineer, who just lays the beats unto 24 track tape, or into pro tools, or what ever medium your gonna record on.

then theres mixing engineer, who actually mixes the tracks, to get a balance.

thens theres the mastering engineering, looked upon as a vodoo priset.

i dont even think to some extent these guys even pres the play buttons on the remote, they all have assistants, they just track , mix and master, nothing else.

with this method in mind, there is always a fresh pair of ears to the table. so the mix then have a character.

as for equipment, using an stste of the art equipment, from ssl boards, to tube pres, 24 tracks, and tube out board, in the right hands almost everytime produce astounding qulaities.

also tht article to chrono beats question about music being louder, through over cvompression, dre doesnot do use tht technique,

i have analysed dres chronic album vs steely dan night owl is it??? i think :roll: with satana the best of, black magic woman. and they all employ the same tecnques some what, invisble compression and leaving the tracks with dynamics, the instruments have a lot of space and freedom and sit very well together in the mix. dre isnt mixing hip hop style, more traditional "pop" as in popular in music, not back street boys pop.

please bear in mind steely dans album was voted as the best mixed album in the world to date, and most engineers use tht as a reference. this type of mixing tends to be more musically and smooth or smoove :wink:


to get grime, could either be at the source, hence using 12 bit and or classic machines. or coluld be done in the mix. over driving an ssl, prduces soft clipping which is very pleasing to some, saturating 24 track particularly ampex 499 gold, series, is a good way, and tube out board gear.
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By Prah_860_ Sun Jan 16, 2005 6:28 pm
skalawa wrote:also tht article to chrono beats question about music being louder, through over cvompression, dre doesnot do use tht technique,

i have analysed dres chronic album vs steely dan night owl is it??? i think :roll: with satana the best of, black magic woman. and they all employ the same tecnques some what, invisble compression and leaving the tracks with dynamics, the instruments have a lot of space and freedom and sit very well together in the mix. dre isnt mixing hip hop style, more traditional "pop" as in popular in music, not back street boys pop.

please bear in mind steely dans album was voted as the best mixed album in the world to date, and most engineers use tht as a reference. this type of mixing tends to be more musically and smooth or smoove :wink:


to get grime, could either be at the source, hence using 12 bit and or classic machines. or coluld be done in the mix. over driving an ssl, prduces soft clipping which is very pleasing to some, saturating 24 track particularly ampex 499 gold, series, is a good way, and tube out board gear.


yea dre doesn't mix hip hop style...thaz why he has the ill sound
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By highlife Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:11 pm
^thank you all for the feedback! much appreciated! i was surprised to hear from a vet! keep puttin' out heat, PR!

you guys brought up a good point about dre having TOP NOTCH equipment to do the mixing/engineering and get that super warm/thorough feel to his beats.

i guess i will just freak what i can freak and see what i can pull ala devin the dude. BTW, you guys into his shit? just tryin' to live and to tha xtreme are BANGING! def. steps up from his 'the dude' album production-wise. i'm fiending for some devin/dre collabs. nate dogg could get in there too, but right now i'm feeling devin's flow better. they could kill shit together.

anyways, i fully understand the notion of not worrying about what tools producers are using, but focusing on the end product. BUT that's how you LEARN about new techniques. that's why we're all here on these boards isn't it? to learn from each other and hopefully fill the airwaves with QUALITY hiphop in the future? to bring it back to the golden era? i'm glad we have a solid foundation of producers from that era still puttin' in work to this day and inspiring people like us on these message boards to keep this shit alive!

thanks again for you responses and i look forward to speaking with you guys more about this production passion we all share. peace!
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By Prah_860_ Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:17 pm
highlife wrote:^thank you all for the feedback! much appreciated! i was surprised to hear from a vet! keep puttin' out heat, PR!
lol, If I ever met PR I will let him know you like his shiz

you guys brought up a good point about dre having TOP NOTCH equipment to do the mixing/engineering and get that super warm/thorough feel to his beats.
real talk

i guess i will just freak what i can freak and see what i can pull ala devin the dude. BTW, you guys into his ****? just tryin' to live and to tha xtreme are BANGING! def. steps up from his 'the dude' album production-wise. i'm fiending for some devin/dre collabs. nate dogg could get in there too, but right now i'm feeling devin's flow better. they could kill **** together.
devin is the truth......been listening to him since the FACEMOB days...I wasn't on Odd Squad

anyways, i fully understand the notion of not worrying about what tools producers are using, but focusing on the end product. BUT that's how you LEARN about new techniques. that's why we're all here on these boards isn't it? to learn from each other and hopefully fill the airwaves with QUALITY hiphop in the future? to bring it back to the golden era? i'm glad we have a solid foundation of producers from that era still puttin' in work to this day and inspiring people like us on these message boards to keep this **** alive!

thanks again for you responses and i look forward to speaking with you guys more about this production passion we all share. peace!

Welcome To The Board
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By vakseen Mon Jan 17, 2005 2:21 am
ahhh nig that odd squad was ridin. devin is the truth tho
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By cyrus Mon Jan 17, 2005 5:13 am
i always thought dre and mel man used the mpc3000.

Check the cover of chronic 2001. mpc3000 and shit loads of records. And check mel mans pic on forat.com

Granted there was alot of interpolation too. But im not sure where it all went into first. I noticed on a few tracks, that the synth sounds (comming from the moog or whatever) are "chopped off" as if they where originally played by whatever keyboardist, but played into the sampler. It sounds like a one shot when it cuts off....even though it doestn cut off the instrument it cuts of the "air".

I always got the impression, that even though he interpolated alot of his shit, it was still arranged inside the mpc, whether they where just already planned loops or whatever.

Who knows, maybe he even ran all those instruments or keyboards into the mixer, then into the mpc3000, then back out.

scenario....he and mel man dig out some nice records, they chop, and make some dope beats....then, he hires someone to interpolate what they made......next, hes probably got 2 mpc3000s hooked up with the same beat.....then he plays one, and the artist plays into the ssl whilst listening to it and samples it into the other mpc...dre, then trims up the loop, then arranges it with all those other loops. Sends it back to the mixer, tracks it, then does his mixing thang. This is why his beats arent "chopped' as if he used samples, but they still employ the same concepts as samples because they are sampled "live" so they get that human groove. Its got the nice quality because of where its going into: the ssl and mpc. Since hes got 2 mpc, he doesnt have to worry about sample and playing back the sequence at the same time.

I personally over drive my mixer for my bass sounds. Its a cheap yamaha...but i still like the way that sounds.
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By dubmunkey Mon Jan 17, 2005 12:52 pm
you need a big feck off mastering unit with a limiter that can squeeze the hell outta your drums..look at dre's stuff in wav format and you'll see the drums are like square waves- ie they are limmited to buggery

thats what gives it that huge sound...remember to eq first

greg
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