DRUM TECHNIQUES 4 DA MPC

Soooo, I realize that I would probably write for pages and pages... so I’ll add this for now. Add more later as I get more time.

First, context - my first instrument in life was a drum set. Learned to play, tune, mic, mix drums before anything else. Some say my productions favor the drums... lol - so don’t hold it against me. LOL. Also, I’m FAR from an expert. These are just things I’ve learned for myself, and from some REALLY experienced professionals. Like, Grammy winning professionals. Lol

Drum sources:

Like most of us, I have thousands of drums samples between hits and breaks. These days I shy away from the breaks as much, mostly because I’m going for a cleaner sound. It’s possible to get “clean” from a break, but usually requires more processing than I have the patience (and time) for.

Several times per year, usually dictated by the project I’m working on, I’ll go through my library and pick 20 kicks, 20 snares, 20 hats and percussion sounds that inspire me. It’s cool because each time I do that, I usually don’t select the dame drum sources - inspiration / intent changes, which IMO it should. When I select which drums from my library, I then pull in a couple drum hits that I use for layering. These are much more standard and are the drum “toolkit” that I use to shape the source drums.

So, I use those drums exclusively on a project. So, if you look at the albums I’ve released, I have drums that I refer to as “The unspoken warrior drums”, or the “Blue Notes drums” or the “Ten Percent” drums. Rarely have I used drums between projects. So if you listen to one album, you’ll probably never hear those same drums on another project. And if you do, one thing is certain... I probably wrote that song / music at the same time as those other sessions - but just released it later. Don’t know if it will always stay that way, but that’s just how things have been for me so far.

I also have a Yamaha drum kit in my studio again after a long break without one, so I’m creating and recording the drum sounds I want from that kit. Love, love, love acoustic drums.

When I’m writing a song, I pull from the current drums that I’ve selected for that project. I don’t end up using them all on a project, but those that I do, I process them to suit the vibe / mood that I’m trying to create. The layering drums that are pretty much standard toolkit, I use for when I want to shape a drum sound to have certain characteristics... more thump, more thud, more round, more tick, if I can’t use dynamics to create it. For example, I have one dry sub kick that I use to add thump and presence - it’s the same one. I’ve been using it for 10 years. I’m SUPER familiar with it and how to shape it to sit under a kick so that the nature of the kick is preserved.

90% of my drums are mono, a few are stereo. But I prefer them to be mono, and add some spreading through dynamics if I want that sound. And I prefer that all of my drum sources are dry. Like DEAD dry. Because I want to control dynamics and effects to match the song. If not, the drum sample tails are one ambience / reverb, and I’m mixing using another. To my ear it clashes and my OCD goes wild... LOL.

On EVERY song my kick chain is the same (with various settings of course)... EQ -> dbx160 -> master out. Side note... I use a spreader on the bass guitar to get it “out of the way” of the kick. So I compare frequencies between those two without any other instruments playing. I tweak the settings of the kick and bass channels until they sit nicely. After that, I mute the bass and bring in the snare.

Likewise I only layer the snare when I can’t create what I want with dynamics. I mix it with the kick to make sure it sits well also. My snare chain is always the same too... EQ -> dbx160 -> master out. I ALWAYS mix the snare with the hi hat. Why??? Because the hi hat hit happens at the same time as a snare hit, and they share some frequencies. So mixing the snare to fit with the kick, then adding the hi hat later, often leads to a snare that “sounds” too bright. It might not be, but the hi hat hitting on top of it creates that perception. So both the snare and hi hat get shaped together. General rule of thumb for some mixing approaches, you should hear the hi hat hit on top of the kick, but not on top of the snare. If you do, chances are your hi hat is too loud, or needs high end rolled off. Once I have all three done, I bring back in the bass to reference them together.

Could get more into my mixing process, but this is only about the drums.

In terms of hi hat, if I’m looking to create a more realistic feel, I pan the hi hat a little right... because if you’re standing in front a drum kit, you’d hear the hi hat more on your right, because it’s on the drummer’s left. If there are toms in a song, I pan them where they would be on a kit if standing in front of it. Common practice - nothing I’ve created with that approach.

Alright, that’s a start. Gotta get back to do a few things. Hope this is helpful. Danoc and LEV, thanks for starting this!

That was tight E. Thank you.

Eyalc wrote:Soooo, I realize that I would probably write for pages and pages... so I’ll add this for now. Add more later as I get more time.

First, context - my first instrument in life was a drum set. Learned to play, tune, mic, mix drums before anything else. Some say my productions favor the drums... lol - so don’t hold it against me. LOL. Also, I’m FAR from an expert. These are just things I’ve learned for myself, and from some REALLY experienced professionals. Like, Grammy winning professionals. Lol

Drum sources:

Like most of us, I have thousands of drums samples between hits and breaks. These days I shy away from the breaks as much, mostly because I’m going for a cleaner sound. It’s possible to get “clean” from a break, but usually requires more processing than I have the patience (and time) for.

Several times per year, usually dictated by the project I’m working on, I’ll go through my library and pick 20 kicks, 20 snares, 20 hats and percussion sounds that inspire me. It’s cool because each time I do that, I usually don’t select the dame drum sources - inspiration / intent changes, which IMO it should. When I select which drums from my library, I then pull in a couple drum hits that I use for layering. These are much more standard and are the drum “toolkit” that I use to shape the source drums.

So, I use those drums exclusively on a project. So, if you look at the albums I’ve released, I have drums that I refer to as “The unspoken warrior drums”, or the “Blue Notes drums” or the “Ten Percent” drums. Rarely have I used drums between projects. So if you listen to one album, you’ll probably never hear those same drums on another project. And if you do, one thing is certain... I probably wrote that song / music at the same time as those other sessions - but just released it later. Don’t know if it will always stay that way, but that’s just how things have been for me so far.

I also have a Yamaha drum kit in my studio again after a long break without one, so I’m creating and recording the drum sounds I want from that kit. Love, love, love acoustic drums.

When I’m writing a song, I pull from the current drums that I’ve selected for that project. I don’t end up using them all on a project, but those that I do, I process them to suit the vibe / mood that I’m trying to create. The layering drums that are pretty much standard toolkit, I use for when I want to shape a drum sound to have certain characteristics... more thump, more thud, more round, more tick, if I can’t use dynamics to create it. For example, I have one dry sub kick that I use to add thump and presence - it’s the same one. I’ve been using it for 10 years. I’m SUPER familiar with it and how to shape it to sit under a kick so that the nature of the kick is preserved.

90% of my drums are mono, a few are stereo. But I prefer them to be mono, and add some spreading through dynamics if I want that sound. And I prefer that all of my drum sources are dry. Like DEAD dry. Because I want to control dynamics and effects to match the song. If not, the drum sample tails are one ambience / reverb, and I’m mixing using another. To my ear it clashes and my OCD goes wild... LOL.

On EVERY song my kick chain is the same (with various settings of course)... EQ -> dbx160 -> master out. Side note... I use a spreader on the bass guitar to get it “out of the way” of the kick. So I compare frequencies between those two without any other instruments playing. I tweak the settings of the kick and bass channels until they sit nicely. After that, I mute the bass and bring in the snare.

Likewise I only layer the snare when I can’t create what I want with dynamics. I mix it with the kick to make sure it sits well also. My snare chain is always the same too... EQ -> dbx160 -> master out. I ALWAYS mix the snare with the hi hat. Why??? Because the hi hat hit happens at the same time as a snare hit, and they share some frequencies. So mixing the snare to fit with the kick, then adding the hi hat later, often leads to a snare that “sounds” too bright. It might not be, but the hi hat hitting on top of it creates that perception. So both the snare and hi hat get shaped together. General rule of thumb for some mixing approaches, you should hear the hi hat hit on top of the kick, but not on top of the snare. If you do, chances are your hi hat is too loud, or needs high end rolled off. Once I have all three done, I bring back in the bass to reference them together.

Could get more into my mixing process, but this is only about the drums.

In terms of hi hat, if I’m looking to create a more realistic feel, I pan the hi hat a little right... because if you’re standing in front a drum kit, you’d hear the hi hat more on your right, because it’s on the drummer’s left. If there are toms in a song, I pan them where they would be on a kit if standing in front of it. Common practice - nothing I’ve created with that approach.

Alright, that’s a start. Gotta get back to do a few things. Hope this is helpful. Danoc and LEV, thanks for starting this!

Here's the track l did for Curtis King remix production challenge. My kick is layered to give it that thump.

I was given just the lyrics. "BABY COME RIDE MY WAVE" and was asked to do music around the lyrics. Which l had fun doing, just had to get those chords and it was go time. Nothing fancy. I had fun doing it

Any questions about the drums go ahead and ask.

yooo! my comment! haha ayy but really though. I was just saying how if you listen to everyone elses beats from the battle, your drums stood out the most. like I cant really put my finger on it whether it was the chop you chose, how you eq'd everything, filters or what but that joint was banging. i peeped your youtube channel and saw a few "beat making" type videos and then i made that comment.

i just picked up a mpc1000 about a month ago and ended up copping the JJOSxl thanks to tao a few days ago so im just learning to use it really. Just trying to gain some knowledge and just happen to see this thread a second ago. i haven't read through it all yet but yeah appreciate you looking out bruh

Eyalc wrote: mix the snare with the hi hat. Why??? Because the hi hat hit happens at the same time as a snare hit, and they share some frequencies. So mixing the snare to fit with the kick, then adding the hi hat later, often leads to a snare that “sounds” too bright. It might not be, but the hi hat hitting on top of it creates that perception. So both the snare and hi hat get shaped together. General rule of thumb for some mixing approaches, you should hear the hi hat hit on top of the kick, but not on top of the snare. If you do, chances are your hi hat is too loud, or needs high end rolled off. Once I have all three done, I bring back in the bass to reference them together.
!

never thought about doing this but it makes so much sense after reading it! definitely going to try this out.

Danoc wrote:Here's the track l did for Curtis King remix production challenge. My kick is layered to give it that thump.

I was given just the lyrics. "BABY COME RIDE MY WAVE" and was asked to do music around the lyrics. Which l had fun doing, just had to get those chords and it was go time. Nothing fancy. I had fun doing it

Any questions about the drums go ahead and ask.

from 45-55 is that the same kick just on some 16 level ish or is it different kicks that you blended?
also from like 30-40 i like how its got that Left > Right > snare bounce to it. idk what sound that is, like a shaker and water drop stacked but that's super dope.

Your comment was profound by means you don't know. You had me make this thread. I see you're like me a thinker and what you saud resonated with me.

It was different combinations of EQing, Chopping techniques , and processing. I also do all that in headphones. There still people that believe you cant and l prived them wrong.
I would to help those who want to know how to get there. People like Charles and Eyalc ,Fanu and a few others have techniques to share. So get your pan and pen ready. People buy a whole lot to do one thing l don't go through all that.

Thank you for the comments.

Levulz2it wrote:yooo! my comment! haha ayy but really though. I was just saying how if you listen to everyone elses beats from the battle, your drums stood out the most. like I cant really put my finger on it whether it was the chop you chose, how you eq'd everything, filters or what but that joint was banging. i peeped your youtube channel and saw a few "beat making" type videos and then i made that comment.

i just picked up a mpc1000 about a month ago and ended up copping the JJOSxl thanks to tao a few days ago so im just learning to use it really. Just trying to gain some knowledge and just happen to see this thread a second ago. i haven't read through it all yet but yeah appreciate you looking out bruh

I can tell you this you have a very good ear.
The kick and snare is the same kick and snare l used fir the battle track. But l used different sonuds in it.
The kick is not blended or set to 16 levels. I didn't use a MPC l sold mines not to long ago. I used Reason 11.
Now what l did di with the kick is copy it then put a filter under it and blended them together. It gives the main kick some thump. Basucally l side chained that kick. There's a new technique l stumbled across while making that battle track 280.

The water shaker combo is one of my techniques that l processed in Reasin. The way you heard it adds bounce and gives the listener an ear experience.

I have new techniques to use in my music.

I know lma have make videos showing what l do. Stay tuned ITS GO TIME!

Levulz2it wrote:

Danoc wrote:Here's the track l did for Curtis King remix production challenge. My kick is layered to give it that thump.

I was given just the lyrics. "BABY COME RIDE MY WAVE" and was asked to do music around the lyrics. Which l had fun doing, just had to get those chords and it was go time. Nothing fancy. I had fun doing it

Any questions about the drums go ahead and ask.

from 45-55 is that the same kick just on some 16 level ish or is it different kicks that you blended?
also from like 30-40 i like how its got that Left > Right > snare bounce to it. idk what sound that is, like a shaker and water drop stacked but that's super dope.

yeah man ill definitely peep that! I use reason too. i was using the MPK mini for a minute but the pads got jacked up, they were double hitting and stuff. i got the MPC because i like chopping on it, its way faster than anything else ive ever used and now i got JJOS so i can mixdown tracks to import into reason for final mixing. i also got it because i dont have a laptop just a gaming PC and i dont like being forced to sit at my desk. if i want to blaze and listen to music to sample i can just take the mpc on my porch and get after it.

Danoc wrote:I can tell you this you have a very good ear.
The kick and snare is the same kick and snare l used fir the battle track. But l used different sonuds in it.
The kick is not blended or set to 16 levels. I didn't use a MPC l sold mines not to long ago. I used Reason 11.
Now what l did di with the kick is copy it then put a filter under it and blended them together. It gives the main kick some thump. Basucally l side chained that kick. There's a new technique l stumbled across while making that battle track 280.

The water shaker combo is one of my techniques that l processed in Reasin. The way you heard it adds bounce and gives the listener an ear experience.

I have new techniques to use in my music.

I know lma have make videos showing what l do. Stay tuned ITS GO TIME!

OK cool, I see your set up now. Whatever works for you and your chops use it. Hold up, JJOS on the MPC Live?

Levulz2it wrote:yeah man ill definitely peep that! I use reason too. i was using the MPK mini for a minute but the pads got jacked up, they were double hitting and stuff. i got the MPC because i like chopping on it, its way faster than anything else ive ever used and now i got JJOS so i can mixdown tracks to import into reason for final mixing. i also got it because i dont have a laptop just a gaming PC and i dont like being forced to sit at my desk. if i want to blaze and listen to music to sample i can just take the mpc on my porch and get after it.

Danoc wrote:I can tell you this you have a very good ear.
The kick and snare is the same kick and snare l used fir the battle track. But l used different sonuds in it.
The kick is not blended or set to 16 levels. I didn't use a MPC l sold mines not to long ago. I used Reason 11.
Now what l did di with the kick is copy it then put a filter under it and blended them together. It gives the main kick some thump. Basucally l side chained that kick. There's a new technique l stumbled across while making that battle track 280.

The water shaker combo is one of my techniques that l processed in Reasin. The way you heard it adds bounce and gives the listener an ear experience.

I have new techniques to use in my music.

I know lma have make videos showing what l do. Stay tuned ITS GO TIME!

Danoc wrote:OK cool, I see your set up now. Whatever works for you and your chops use it. Hold up, JJOS on the MPC Live?

Nah I got a mpc1000. Live is out of my budget lol

Lmao ok my bad bro. I do all my chopping and layering in a FREE program called Audacity. Its a beast!

Levulz2it wrote:

Danoc wrote:OK cool, I see your set up now. Whatever works for you and your chops use it. Hold up, JJOS on the MPC Live?

Nah I got a mpc1000. Live is out of my budget lol

In those beat battles, I did every single thing on the MPC One and the one thing it taught me was. Go back to chopping everything on computer with mouse and keyboard and go back to mixing in a DAW. It's makes the job so much easier.

You dam skippy man. You know how long l been waiting for you to say that?

If you did that all in the MPC One that is the reason your sonics sounded totally different from mines and could tell. It was night and day.
What l learned from those beat battles was to stay on my DAW to do it and not use the MPC. They never implemented the mouse function and that stylus on the screen crap don't work so well with me. And lm abke to work quick. I spent uears without the MPC abd l see l don't need it at all. When l hear a track and the hihat is off that to me makes no sense do to its sequencer. Reason's sequencer can hold uts own against any MPC.

CharlesRandolph wrote:In those beat battles, I did every single thing on the MPC One and the one thing it taught me was. Go back to chopping everything on computer with mouse and keyboard and go back to mixing in a DAW. It's makes the job so much easier.

For me Software DAW with mouse and keyboard, will always be faster than touch screen and knobs. The difference in drums, comes from bumping the low end frequency kick at 180 hz, leaving in the transitents of the snare and kick, then eqing out of the high end out of the drum loop, and layering it over the chopped drums.

I also used that MPC time stretch on that loop. You know the one that everyone hates... But I used it as an effect to give artifacts. That's why you thought they were 12 bit drums, without that ring. If I removed the eq'ed layered drum loop, everything would open up. But I wasn't looking for that open sound.

I wanted something, if I removed all other instruments, the drums would stand on their own. Now if I take those same drums, blend them with a nice warm bass, a Fender Rhodes, and some strings, that joint would be hard and smooth at the same time.

But my intentions was for turntablist like myself, who could use it for scratch practice at slower and faster pitches. Also the way I eq'ed the drums, they wouldn't disappear at a faster pitch (+1 to +10). It's always funny when I hear people talk boom bap, raw hip-hop, low fi. But their drums don't knock.

They have that long ass low pass filter piano loop, over some thin ass drums, with a high passed filtered horn with a delay effect. Don't forget that same, pitched down bass sound with rolled off highs.

Danoc wrote::worthy:

You dam skippy man. You know how long l been waiting for you to say that?

If you did that all in the MPC One that is the reason your sonics sounded totally different from mines and could tell. It was night and day.
What l learned from those beat battles was to stay on my DAW to do it and not use the MPC. They never implemented the mouse function and that stylus on the screen **** don't work so well with me. And lm abke to work quick. I spent uears without the MPC abd l see l don't need it at all. When l hear a track and the hihat is off that to me makes no sense do to its sequencer. Reason's sequencer can hold uts own against any MPC.