Force's new Arranger is here - MPC user thoughts?

EnochLight wrote:

Acidizer wrote:Then I guess you aren't making songs with your MPC, as song mode is slower AND less capable.

To play devil's advocate, Arranger Mode on Force works by making you record your performance in real-time, just like a linear tape from 1949. So if I have a 6 minute song I'd like to build from a selection of sequences, it currently takes me less than 2 minutes using MPC's current Song Mode. On Force, it would take me 6 minutes to record the performance in Arranger.

Maybe this is something that can be addressed if Arranger does make an appearance on MPC, as I do agree the Arranger Mode - at the end of the day - is more flexible.

Yes true, surely they will fix that once things are stable though. I would still take this over song mode any day though. Listening to music is better than what feels like playing with spreadsheets.

Should be easy like pressing 2x double length option, or dragging the clip out.

MPC-Tutor wrote:Song mode is fine IMO, needs some tweaks, as do most things on the MPC, but maybe it's because I'm originally a legacy MPC user, I find chaining together sequences quite a natural way of working, but it would be good if you could then jump into an arrangement style mode from song mode. So, 'convert song to arrangement', similar in a sense to 'convert to seq'.

^^ THIS X1000% ^^

I know I'm probably asking for too much, but this is really how I hope Arranger Mode appears on the MPC's - the best of both worlds, exactly as you describe. If I can continue to chain my sequences together in the "legacy" Song Mode, only to open Arranger and have them all populated there in blocks, that would be 100% knocking it out of the park.

If we should be so lucky...

MPC-Tutor wrote:Song mode is fine IMO, needs some tweaks, as do most things on the MPC, but maybe it's because I'm originally a legacy MPC user, I find chaining together sequences quite a natural way of working, but it would be good if you could then jump into an arrangement style mode from song mode. So, 'convert song to arrangement', similar in a sense to 'convert to seq'.

And either the ability to convert back to sequences, or adjustments to sequences updated in the arrangement. Preferably the latter if not both.

It was only the Lite version, so maybe there's more to it, but I hate how disconnected sequences and arrangements are in Abeleton. This alone stopped me from upgrading to the full version. I don't want anything like that.

EnochLight wrote:

MPC-Tutor wrote:Song mode is fine IMO, needs some tweaks, as do most things on the MPC, but maybe it's because I'm originally a legacy MPC user, I find chaining together sequences quite a natural way of working, but it would be good if you could then jump into an arrangement style mode from song mode. So, 'convert song to arrangement', similar in a sense to 'convert to seq'.

^^ THIS X1000% ^^

I know I'm probably asking for too much, but this is really how I hope Arranger Mode appears on the MPC's - the best of both worlds, exactly as you describe. If I can continue to chain my sequences together in the "legacy" Song Mode, only to open Arranger and have them all populated there in blocks, that would be 100% knocking it out of the park.

If we should be so lucky...

IF it ever shows up that's exactly how I plan on using it. Ill still be sequencing away, because I actually work faster and more efficiently when I break something down that way it turns out, but once the 'big picture' starts to come into play, it would be nice to have a big linear view to work from. Song mode is great but there's only so much you can do listening over and over and then you need to jump back to the one sequence you need to edit, etc.. Having the whole thing in a line helps A LOT during the writing process.

If Logic had a way it could break itself down into sections like that, Id probably jump right back to it full time, but it turns out I love the way the MPC works in sequences so until they do, Im staying here.

Bezo wrote:

MPC-Tutor wrote:It was only the Lite version, so maybe there's more to it, but I hate how disconnected sequences and arrangements are in Abeleton. This alone stopped me from upgrading to the full version. I don't want anything like that.

They are treated independently for a reason of course, you need that disconnect. For instance you want to be able to put automation on your song arrangement but not on the sequences themselves, have the automation span across multiple sequences, you might want to put a global effect on your whole song, and so on.

Acidizer wrote:They are treated independently for a reason of course, you need that disconnect. For instance you want to be able to put automation on your song arrangement but not on the sequences themselves, have the automation span across multiple sequences, you might want to put a global effect on your whole song, and so on.

Why would someone want the automation on one and not the other?

If that's a thing, add an option to exclude automation when converting.

He’s talking like a filter sweep or something like that over multiple sequences. Or volume changes for the song as a whole not something that repeats.

Cockdiesel wrote:He’s talking like a filter sweep or something like that over multiple sequences. Or volume changes for the song as a whole not something that repeats.

Ah, OK. Yeah, an option to exclude automation when converting.

I know it's a DAW, but Studio One has a similar option to have automation move (or not) with regions when relocating/duplicating them.

Akai should just bring the MPC into the 21st century, I hope that is what is planned. Instead of users having to fiddle in the background with song mode, let us visualize what it actually happening in linear fashion so we apply automation in context, on top of the song itself.

Song mode is a relic from ancient grooveboxes. There's no need to be stacking patterns together when you have a modern touchscreen.

Acidizer wrote:Akai should just bring the MPC into the 21st century...

...with everything; sequence editing, importing tracks, track order, program creation/editing, mixer, etc. There are much more efficient ways to do things than the legacy MPC way.

I mean, to be fair - the current generation MPC's are absolutely the most modern MPC's they've ever made. A touchscreen, hosting (admittedly limited) plugins, the amount of effects that come with it, the portability with a built-in battery... let's give credit where credit is due.

But I am 100% on board with getting the Arranger Mode to the MPC, assuming it is handled in a way that Tutor described above.

I ordered the very sexy retro Live II today, not based on the hope of an arranger but what it can already do. I need a creative and inspiration tool and a bit of a hub to control and record a few things. I will definitely be taking advantage of the portability, too.

I did notice right now that Loopop mentioned in one of his videos that Akai has hinted arranger to come to the MPC line..... is that true? What was said?

The main evidence of that is that Akai has stated in the past that they wanted to bring the MPC and Force line more into alignment. What that means exactly is hard to say... but there is some expectation of things like chopping to improve on the Force... and that the arranger, macros and stuff ought to make it to the MPC line.

Evidence for this has been some of the sampling/chopping improvements brought over to the force, and the new FX and instruments being released on both platforms. I'm aware of some other sites having discussions about what *could* happen, but nothing that committed to it.

The product manager himself (everybody remembers good old Akai Dan right?) said they were merging the two but because they completely **** the MPC's code up, it was going to take a major rewrite to bring it in line. The sequencer basically needs to be completely redone because of the way the tracks dont line up from sequence to sequence.

This was also over a year ago he said this, and nobody is even sure Dan is still the PM for the MPC or even with Akai anymore. He dropped off the face of the earth from Gearslutz last year even before Akai killed that horrible support website they had up.

Monotremata wrote:The product manager himself (everybody remembers good old Akai Dan right?) said they were merging the two but because they completely **** the MPC's code up, it was going to take a major rewrite to bring it in line. The sequencer basically needs to be completely redone because of the way the tracks dont line up from sequence to sequence.

This was also over a year ago he said this, and nobody is even sure Dan is still the PM for the MPC or even with Akai anymore. He dropped off the face of the earth from Gearslutz last year even before Akai killed that horrible support website they had up.

And Dan's word was always good. Let's hope the arranger is still on the to-do list after all this time.

I'm jus always nervous that Akai's unwillingness to alienate its legacy users will get in the way of modernizing the MPC.