Force 3.1 firmware is out: HELLO DISC STREAMING!!!

This is truly awesome - soooo glad to finally see this hit the streets:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA1DfQbiQCI

The Force is becoming a truly excellent piece of kit. If I were a punter in the market for a standalone groovebox I would probably be leaning towards the Force over an MPC. I wonder how many of the unique features are going to remain Force exclusives?

Hopefully recording automation across the master outs is going to make it to the MPC (along with disk streaming and arranger).

Streaming is nice - but external audio interface? Now I'm getting excited, because that lets us bypass the master I/O and also expand the utility as part of a more complex studio.

This is definitely a big release. It feels as big as arranger view, in what a change it makes to the scope of the tool.

I admit it, I'm hyped for this one.

I keep eying those Tascam Model 12's, but the Model 16 is what I really want. I just wish the Zoom L12 had an L16 model, because I do prefer having LED meters on the channels, which the Tascams are sorely lacking. I don't take Force out of my studio, so having an audio interface on my Force take over for all of my gear sounds really appealing. Having disc-streaming on all 8 stereo audio tracks just seals the deal.

I know it's not a full meter, but don't they have at least LED peaking lights? I thought that they did, anyway. (I don't have anything in the Model line - I took a different direction in my studio.)

One of the things that I also have, for working next to a computer, is that I have the KORG nanoKEY2, nanoKONTROL2 and nanoPAD2 and I can use the MIDI learn to use those to get things in quickly, that I then tweak afterwards.

I'm trying to think what else I might want - automating tempo changes might be nice, especially for soundtrack composition (but I'm not wedded to it) and if it doesn't work yet, I'd be delighted to have USB mouse input work on the touchscreen as well.

Beyond that, what else is there? This thing is a great little studio hub.

Still no triple meter (3/4) or at least loop length of 12 (as far as I can tell from the manual). Underwhelming, to say the least. NI's Maschine+ is eating Force's lunch. The guys that design Force are either idiots, or producing for a four-on-the-floor idiot base.

Just my opinion; idiots may differ...

BuleriaChk, you're wrong.

You can set loop lengths down to sub-measure lengths.

Next time, before making a public fool of yourself, how about you go and verify your statements? Just a sort of different take on how you lead your life, y'know?

Or you could keep offering us something to giggle at, that's cool too.

Three quarter notes per bar? I don't think you understand 3/4 (or any other) time signature.
How about 5/4, 7/8, 9/8, many others in world music. But hey, I'm Flamenco, so I'd be happy with just 3/4 - (but once you implement 3/4, the others are no big deal.)

How about 4 measures ("bars") of 3/4 time signature in a loop?
i.e. 3 quarter notes in a bar (so the bpm will be correct)?

( a "beat" in 3/4 is a quarter note, so three beats to the bar)

If you try to set "triplets" the bpm will be off. Mpc-x DOES have time signatures (so does MPC Live and MPC software)

So does Ableton's Push....
So do most other rhythm machines (as pattern length)

But, hey, as a Flamenco I would be happy with just 3/4 time signature with a loop length of 2 or 4 bars. Would someone please teach Force engineers (other idiots should learn basic music theory on their own) what time signatures mean?

For me, without time signatures (other than duple meter), the Force is a non-starter, and aspiring musicians should know about this fundamental lack of really basic music functionality (it is not present in the marketing hype).

I know, because I bought one without knowing this (silly me) and had to return it for a loss...
Ableton and Native Instruments, I love you ....

Wait, let me get this straight.

You're such a genius that you can handle the ultra-sophisticated music theory behind time signatures that defy mere whole numbers, but you have trouble with the mental arithmetic to correct your tempo measurement? Not to mention, if you're counting in terms of quarter notes, the BPM figure would actually be identical because 3/4 at 100BPM is the same BPM as 4/4 at 100BPM.

... and you're so incredibly enraged about all this that you're shouting all about it however long after you bought and returned one?

I don't know about anybody else here, and my Flamenco game is weak (though non-zero), but I've spent a lot of time on classical guitar as well as other, related fields of music. Handling 6/8 on the Force has never, ever been a problem for me. In fact, I've done renditions of sub-saharan cross rhythmic figures on the Force, and the most I've had to do for it was to set a loop to an odd number of bars and a little mental counting, and then I was there.

OK, so I get that you think that what I'm saying is impossible, because you cannot conceive of the temporal gymnastics under discussion - so you may feel free to dismiss me as a liar, and malicious to boot, and I hope that Maschine+ (or whatever) makes you a very happy camper indeed, but perhaps your spleen would be better vented on gearslutz.com, or whatever they're calling themselves this week? I'm sure that someone there cares, but I'll pretty much guarantee you that nobody here is impressed by your howls of frantic sorrow. We're too busy doing stupid untz-untz-untz EDM to hear you, because we're stupid, stupid people who are happy making music with Force 3.1.

(Pst, I hear Native Instruments has a forum too, I'm sure they'd be happy to hear your views on Force!)

On another note, I see from the MPC side that the Tascam US 16x08 interface works well with the MPC 2.10 update. Anyone have one on a Force?

Willful ignorance of time signatures in the world of music is not a virtue....
Time signatures are not rocket science for most serious musicians...

Why should I complain on an NI forum about Force? Everyone there already knows....

For me, this is just tough love to Akai/Force; I'd probably buy it (again) if they implement time signatures.
OTH, maybe not; my Maschine Jam works really well with Maschine and Maschine+ now.

You ... uh, you do realise this isn't actually an Akai Professional forum, right? It's run by a guy who does the MPC Bible and so on. I'm not sure that anyone from Akai Professional even reads this forum on a regular basis.

I guess what I'm saying is that if you want to get other time signatures figured out on this equipment, you should drop their support team a line, and when you're done with that come and let us all know how it worked out for you?

I already have; numerous times (reported the issue to AKAI ).

Not only that , the guy who runs the MPC Bible should include this knowledge to his users IMO.
(I would NEVER have purchased the Force had I known - I do have Live, and MPC software; both of those have time signatures, so I assumed they would be included in any device that claims to be professional (or even advanced amateur).

I shouldn't have to figure out time signatures at all on any rhythm device in the computational sense, it is assumed that any rhythmic device includes them (so all you have to do to change bpm in either duple or triple meter is just tweak the BPM knob, not dive to a calculator....

In summary:

You can't figure out how to deal with alternative time signatures on a system that lets you loop as much or as little as you want.

You're whining about it to a bunch of people who know, and evidently don't care, and who aren't in a position to change it even if they did care.

You went out and bought this product (not cheap!) without figuring this out by pre-purchase research, despite the fact that it's evidently desperately, jaw-clenchingly, bowel-churningly important to you.

Then, compounding the above, you returned it at a loss because you were so disappointed, and refused to (or couldn't) figure out an easy workaround that others do without making a big deal out of it.

... and you want us to care along with you?

... right after Akai Professional just dropped an awesome new build with highly sought-after updates and great advances?

Seriously, let me help you here:

Take a desk. Put your lovely, shiny Maschine+ on it. Get your favourite guitar, a mic, and all the goodies. Also, get a beautifully cut goblet, and fill it with a nicely balanced ruby port, and with the help of these wonderful things, make angry, intense flamenco about how bummed out you are about Akai Professional's design choices, put it on bandcamp, and tell everyone on gearslutz.com and muffwiggler.com all about it so that they can hear the purity of your emotions in musical form.

This will purge you of your rage, and you'll get some quality music out of it.

Because, as they say in the marines: nobody here cares.