MPC 4000 vs. Roland MV 8000

ok so i just tried the MV, and i have to say, man its sampler is a bit of a toy, the realtime strech is just unsusable it generates so much artefacts ! no modulation matrix !!!!!! just 1 Multi FX !!! the other two are reverb and delay i think...
overall i found it not very convivial to use as i have been able to make some beat after 10mn on the MPC without reading the manual...too many button too many windows it's a mess.
i though i would be very impressed by the GUI but i found it to be very very sluggish.
well i'm so happy i didn't switch, i'm defenetly confident that the MPC4000 smokes the MV on many many aspects, i'll wait for the MV9000

The realtime timestretch is not totally unusable, you just don't know how to use it...It took me a while to figure it out myself but you have to adjust the settings correctly (and they gave you more in V3) but once you do you can get someimtes up to 20 BPM differences in either direction with almost zero degradation. You just arent's setting it up right....Once you know, its a piece of cake.


As for the 1 MFX, that is a gripe..I don't know why they would include the very capable and superb COSM effects for and only provide one bus for them but what can you do, nothing is perfect....The work around has become easy enough (although it was annoying at first)...That is just resampling the effected track but other than that, I just use outboard effects anyway but I feel you on the 1 MFX, that was weak of them.

But the timestretch nope, it's dope.

PEACE


P.S. - The sampler is not a toy...You're just talking smack there...You guys just hear things that you think you hear...I have a MPC 2000xl still sitting here and I do A/B tests just for the fun of it and there is ZERO difference, in fact the 8000 kills the 2000xl which a lot of people say is more "puchy" or whatever adjective they heard someone else use...People need to just get with what they like but stop spewing out the same stuff over and over..


I'm not trying to convert anyone, just giving a true opinion..Yes, I know the 4000 has the Z8 sampler that is better than the 2000xl but you'll still here cats say there is a magical sound out of the 3000...It makes me laugh really.

^^^^^^^^^^i was always thinking it was a toy too. I mean.........Like its a "workstation" but its sampler wasnt really where it shined....But of course like you said, ive got alot of spew in my head from preconcieved opinions, but In comparision to the mpc4000, and even my mpc2xl.......all other samplers ive judged; i base my opinoion off the fact that i consider the mpc to be the ideal of a sampler.

So even my triton, i think it lacks in ease of use compared to the mpc. Something about the User inteface makes the mpc serises so simple too use, even with lots of features.

But i guess my point is.........can you give US some more insight on the actual features of the MV sampler? as in, how easy is it to loop, and adjust a phrase, or slice a sample? The reason i like the mpc sampler is because of the feel i can get with a phrase sample. EG. on the mpc2xl you can use "mono" where you can play sample, like a one shot, but then hit the sample again, and it cuts off the original sample. with the "zone" or "region" funciton on both the mpc4k, and 2xl.....you can very easily slice a phrase into usable parts.

Thanks! much appreciated.

yeah I agree i probaly didn't use it to it's best but still it's sampler is much less sofisticated that the 4000's, man when you want to put life into your samples you need at least a proper modulation matrix !!!
sample edition is also very limited ( emphasis, normalise, crop that's about it ! )
Now the thing i liked about the MV are it'd pads and sensitivity ! but jusdafied you're right about convincing yourself that you bought the right machine, i'm shure you did, i was pretty close to switch myself at one point, i think it's a really cool machine if i was rich enough i'd probably have one already but i wouldn't trade my mpc for it...
As i said i'll wait and see what the next version will be

Well, maybe a little off topic. But I decided not to get me the MV and to keep the MPC..
I now use Logic on a laptop to sequence midi and audio. I use the MPC4000 as a mega sampler to load and sample every sound.
Its great. I hear no difference in time. Its all very thight.
I think now I have the best of both worlds I use the ultimate sequencer from Logic 5 and use the good sampler from the 4k.

I suddenly have no more limitations Everything is possible! Except for the "Note repeat" function.. You can only play this when the sequencer is running and when the pads trigger sounds inside the MP, it doesnt work if you trigger with incomming midi.. Does someone know how to fix this?

I figured, if I had the MV, I would use a computer screen and mouse anyway.. so... mpc baby

...Now lets hope Akai/Numark does something about the quantizing feature. We need "Humanization", "Shuffle", and "strenght" !! to keep our beats alive

To the person asking about chopping samples into zones in the MV, you can easily do this in the MV...You basicly get 16 zones as it would correlate to the MPC....The Z8 is arguably better than the MV sampler but I wouldn't call it a knock out and definately not definate but to anyone that says that the 2000xl has a better sampler is just being silly. The 2000 has been and always will be C R A P (SAMPLE WISE, OOPS) (That word is censored??? Wayy to P.C.)cc...If you think the 2000 sampler is good, we've got nothing more to talk about JK, but not really..

Not to mention "auto chop" which I don't know how I lived with out.


Anyway, I still keep the 2000xl around for when I'm feeling like hittin some MPC pads but I just can't use the MPC anymore after having the MV interface with VGA...It makes making music so much fun and easier..

I wish I never had to touch my computer anymore but I sure do less than before.

I will always have respect for the MPC and the SP, it's a big part of the evolution of the culture and music that I love, Hip Hop...But I will never let that be the end all of my choice. I also love all the attention that Roland pays to the MV, it's a nice change.

Yup when I when from the 2xl to the 4k it was a huge leap and functions, clarity, and advanced features of synthesis and sampling. I had to spend alot of downtime learning alot of the new features and the different process of multisampling and using the modulation matrix. I still haven`t tap the full potential of my 4k. Along the lines of using my DAW Pro Tools 6.7 with my 4k midi sequencing and the high sampling rate is working hand and hand. I also control Live 4 via control changes and the pads and vice versa. Since I already had audio editors, third party software effects and I mix via software the update of the 1.70 0.S. help me to utilize the tools I already had in my computer. The big difference between the 2xl and the 4 was a bit of a learning curve and add on the fact of learning the techinques of beatmapping using the sample edit with quantized and unquantized time. Before I used to ask about the onboard effects from akai but now I mainly edit, slice, modulate, effect my samples first and then import onto the 4k just to sequence everything in the right time tip I pick up from that Hi-Tek and DJ Spinna article from Remix mag. Sometimes I play around with live sequencing blending, muting and modulating sequences and tracks with the qlink functions which is cool.

My biggest interest is how close my musical development is growing to the level of all my favorite jams like the Grind Date by Dave West, Back in the Days by Frequency, Congo by Amel Larrieux and 99 Problems by Rick Rubin aka in the words of Roger Linn mpcist music. Man how I wish I could be in the studio when they were recording those jams and I could watch the masters at work. I dig that Red Syders work on I want to get to know you for G-Unit too.

Classic piece for classic sounds with a little help from a great DAW of couple or ADAT for the old school.


There is nothing like good music

well i reccon any tool that "does it all" is a toy.

thats not completely true I have Nuendo and it does it all and is far from a toy. I would only that if the mpc just didnt make for a better creative flow

I think both are good machine and have their goods and bads it all in what you want out of you gear my choice is the 4k. even if the came out with a 4kxl version I would keep this one simply because it does everything I need and more. the only thing I would realy like is that sound stream thing thought but thats about it really

I bought a mv8000 and i can tell many poeple told things here that is wrong.

Renegade bliss told we couldnt switch song, thats not true you can switch song in less than 5 seconds.

You choose select song, then you got your list of songs, you choose and it loads in less than 5 seconds.


Also you have pattern mode and drum grid mode + linear sequencer mode.

You can have up to 500 pattern by project, 128 midi tracks by songs and 8 audio tracks by songs and 16 patches (96 notes per patches and 4 samples per notes triggered by velocity change) by songs.

You can have 128 patches per projects in the project library and 9999 samples per projects and 512 audio phrase assigned to the pads and you can assign pattern to pads too, so you can do remixes lives and stuff.

You can chop up and assign to patche like with Dr.Rex in reason. Pretty cool. Chopping is easy!!! you can zoom and chop so much precise you dont need that much precision but in case!! You can choose how many beats and stuff...Really like Dr.Rex.

You can change your HD for a 120 gig one and upgrade memory to 512 MB so you can have 512 MB of sounds per project total.

That's a lot of samples!!!!!

You got a function called backup to CD, then it backup the whole project on it, with every sample and patches inside.

You got a mixer for the 16 patches and 8 audio track with aux outs and insert and stuff, complete like a big mixer.

Overall this thing is so easy i read the manual on the fly and i worked with it like 10 hours. I never tried mpc or machines except MC505 and 303
and i bought it from the store without playin with it once. only seeing videos from roland. And i get my way around almost everything.

I only mention a few things, but for real this thing is dope.

Phono inputs directly on the back, vga and mouse output and drum grid edition...WOW!!

I dont know why poeple dont like it, i think mpc is good too.

I think mv is great but mpc user want to stick to it and say its the best cuz it was here since start.

That's true. But that will only make akai evoluate to new stuff then roland come back with nicer things and so on.

At the end we will all benefit of this!!

his thread was a load of old drivel
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Mon Feb 14, 2005 3:51 am 


 
   





Blue Haze
Expert Member


Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 724
Location: Koshigoe, Kamakura Japan




You are right and insightful however thru some form, shape, or coincidence the same discussion always comes back when a new gear is released, new user enters the board, a frustrated vet gets a wet dream to ease his production. It may have a different title, a different author, or a different question but it always boils down to the user mastering the basics not so much the gear processing everything. It was a learning experience that vets, pros, newbies, and just about everyone can see the other side which is effort, persistance, openmindness, and imagination.
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It all up to you, the choice is yours.


Mon Feb 14, 2005 7:06 am 


  Please check the MPC5K thread and welcome to the board.

Hi Ace,


A couple of comments:

Acebeatz wrote:
Renegade bliss told we couldnt switch song, thats not true you can switch song in less than 5 seconds.

Incorrect. I said that you can't switch Songs on the fly. I've have had several MVNation
people confirm this for me. Actually your statement above confirms this for me. My
live set is a NON STOP dj like set. With 0 seconds inbetween songs. Once you've
got the dancers up and grooving, why make them stop.

So, if one is to approach a NON STOP dj like set on the MV 8000, one has to do it all
within 1 song. Or now with OS 3 within Pattern Mode. Now you can Switch
Patterns on the Fly in Pattern Mode, but Pattern Mode has some limitations in regards
to how it handles sending External Program changes that makes it unusable for somebody
who uses External Synths and uses Program Changes to switch the patches. Until then
I would have to change the way that I make music to use it , or use it alone. I don't want
to change the way that I feel comfortable making music.

Acebeatz wrote:
You can change your HD for a 120 gig one and upgrade memory to 512 MB so you can have 512 MB of sounds per project total.

You can do the same thing on the MPC 4000. Actually Akai encourages it (they put out the
LE model) where as Roland's support as SPECIFICALLY stated that the MV 8000 is
only supported with a 40G drive. Now will a bigger one work , yes , but Roland says no.

Acebeatz wrote:You got a function called backup to CD, then it backup the whole project on it, with every sample and patches inside.

Yep, same as MPC 4000 (SAVE ALL MEMORY TO CD-R)

Acebeatz wrote:You can have 128 patches per projects

But you only have 16 patches/instruments per SONG. On the MPC we have 128 parts/instruments per Sequence. We can even use Multi program changes, so I can
have 512 different instruments available for my song if I need it (though I don't)

Acebeatz wrote:I think mv is great but mpc user want to stick to it and say its the best cuz it was here since start.

How about this. Maybe some MPC users want to stick to the MPC because it's best for
them. If i wanted to stick with it , because it was here since the start, then I'd be on an MPC 60 not an MPC 4000.

There are MANY things that I like about the MV. Would I like to see them on the MPC. Yes.
Do I expect them to be on the MPC. NO.


There are MANY things that I like about the MPC. Would I like to see them on the MV. Yes.
Do I expect them to be on the MV. NO.


I agree with you that hopefully Akai will learn some new things from the MV. I also hope
that Roland learns some things from the MPC(I mean if they were going to copy the
MPC, they could have copied all of it!) The MPC could use the VGA option
or if they were to re-write the OS, then Sequencing via the Ak.Sys would be nice.
The MV could use a full fledged sampler in it. It's only got a fairly basic Sampler other then
the Real Timestretching.



An instrument is just a machine. The musician is the real magic. Some people don't need
an MPC, some people don't need an MV. Some people need both. Some people need a computer.

No offense to anyone but we really need to close this Mpc\Mv8000 debate down, because it boils down to whatever you're comfortable with, and for myself the setup that I have (Sonar, mpc4000, triton, proteus 2000, ect.) it more than encompasses all the features of any 1 machine, so personally I'm satisfied. Maybe in 4-5 years then I'll take a look at how other machines stack up against the mpc. Peace.

me too.^^

stop beating the dead horse. WHO CARES?!?!?!??!!?