Akai is back at NAMM this year

EnochLight wrote:

Straker wrote:NI stuff really doesn't add anything to MPC.
Their products are old, digital clean shit of the first 2000s, they don't have anything exciting.

I mean... that's certainly an opinion.

Straker wrote:At this point, I much prefer Air, opx4 is a great synth, I wonder why Akai has to look for NI when they have Air crew with them.
Not to mention Moog and Alesis, which are miles and miles and miles ahead of NI.

Because neither Air, nor Moog or Alesis are seasoned sound designers that release tons of curated content. Don't get me wrong - I love OPx-4 - it's a fantastic 4 operator synth for the MPC/Force, but exactly how many Expansions have we seen since it came out over 2 years ago?

One (Pro Motion).

You can hate on NI all you want, but the fact is - they've been seasoned sound designers and curators of content for 2+ decades, and have a massive back catalog of still relevant stuff.

Seasoned sound designers?
Ahahahah. Are you serious?
And why on earth would you need an expansion for Opx4? Or for any synth?
What's the sense of synth expansions?
You have all you need at hand, make your sounds, that's what synths are made for.
And what's the sense of expansions in general?
You have a sampler, you have synths, line in, is it not better to make your own sounds and samples?

Straker wrote:And why on earth would you need an expansion for Opx4? Or for any synth?
What's the sense of synth expansions?

If you have to ask that question, then you've lost the plot. My answer to you above was in response to you asking why Air didn't do Expansions instead of the NI partnership.

Straker wrote:You have all you need at hand, make your sounds, that's what synths are made for.
And what's the sense of expansions in general?

I mean, debating the value of Expansions (whether they are for synths, samplers, plugins, or otherwise) with someone who doesn't use them is futile, isn't it? You do realize that there are a lot - A LOT - of users out there that aren't sound designers and prefer to browse presets, and tweak away. Many professionals actually rely on that, because when you have a dozen clients requiring that you deliver content to them ASAP with a deadline, you don't have time to design your own sounds from the ground up or go into the field and sample. Time is money.

Straker wrote:You have a sampler, you have synths, line in, is it not better to make your own sounds and samples?

See above.

EnochLight wrote:

Straker wrote:And why on earth would you need an expansion for Opx4? Or for any synth?
What's the sense of synth expansions?

If you have to ask that question, then you've lost the plot. My answer to you above was in response to you asking why Air didn't do Expansions instead of the NI partnership.

Straker wrote:You have all you need at hand, make your sounds, that's what synths are made for.
And what's the sense of expansions in general?

I mean, debating the value of Expansions (whether they are for synths, samplers, plugins, or otherwise) with someone who doesn't use them is futile, isn't it? You do realize that there are a lot - A LOT - of users out there that aren't sound designers and prefer to browse presets, and tweak away. Many professionals actually rely on that, because when you have a dozen clients requiring that you deliver content to them ASAP with a deadline, you don't have time to design your own sounds from the ground up or go into the field and sample. Time is money.

Straker wrote:You have a sampler, you have synths, line in, is it not better to make your own sounds and samples?

See above.

Make yourself a library of your sounds and samples, and you use that for your clients.
Get some good hardware, autosample it, sell it back.
Get a digital recorder, save sounds, edit them with Audition, port them on Mpc.
That what makes a difference between your sound and a ready made sound that everyone can have buying expansions.
Regarding the seasoned sound designers, Roger Linn is a seasoned sound designer, the people behind Moog are seasoned sound designer. The new frontier is modelling and giving back the strength of electric signals to the digital domain.
NI hasn't got any knowledge about that, they have the same sounds and engines since more then 20 years and they are dated, flat and boring.

Straker wrote:Make yourself a library of your sounds and samples, and you use that for your clients.
Get some good hardware, autosample it, sell it back.
Get a digital recorder, save sounds, edit them with Audition, port them on Mpc.
That what makes a difference between your sound and a ready made sound that everyone can have buying expansions.
Regarding the seasoned sound designers, Roger Linn is a seasoned sound designer, the people behind Moog are seasoned sound designer. The new frontier is modelling and giving back the strength of electric signals to the digital domain.

I don't really see your argument as being a valid one to NOT use other companies for Expansions or sound content. Cleary Akai agrees. They see a market, and they did it. It's not like this affects you - Straker - at all. You don't need them or want them, then don't buy them. No worries. But trying to argue that it's not a worthy endeavor for Akai, NI, or the potential users that will buy them, is... well - that's just silly. And futile.

Straker wrote:NI hasn't got any knowledge about that, they have the same sounds and engines since more then 20 years and they are dated, flat and boring.

Professionals and hobbyists alike have been using Native Instruments for decades. That doesn't magically disappear just because Straker thinks their libraries are shite. But it seems like you're arguing just for the sake of arguing, so please - continue.

Me? I'm excited by the features in MPC 3. I'm cool with Akai partnering with NI for these plugins, even though I doubt I will buy any. Even though they don't appeal to me, they may appeal to plenty of others. That's a win for all of us, IMHO. If it keeps the lights on, that means we may see MPC 4. And don't think for a second that I don't have my own criticisms about what the MPC (and Force) is currently lacking and improvements I want to see - I just got done exchanging words with some cuck troll over at Gearslutz in regards to that. I just happen to be a "glass half full" sort of bloke.

EnochLight wrote:

Straker wrote:Make yourself a library of your sounds and samples, and you use that for your clients.
Get some good hardware, autosample it, sell it back.
Get a digital recorder, save sounds, edit them with Audition, port them on Mpc.
That what makes a difference between your sound and a ready made sound that everyone can have buying expansions.
Regarding the seasoned sound designers, Roger Linn is a seasoned sound designer, the people behind Moog are seasoned sound designer. The new frontier is modelling and giving back the strength of electric signals to the digital domain.

I don't really see your argument as being a valid one to NOT use other companies for Expansions or sound content. Cleary Akai agrees. They see a market, and they did it. It's not like this affects you - Straker - at all. You don't need them or want them, then don't buy them. No worries. But trying to argue that it's not a worthy endeavor for Akai, NI, or the potential users that will buy them, is... well - that's just silly. And futile.

Straker wrote:NI hasn't got any knowledge about that, they have the same sounds and engines since more then 20 years and they are dated, flat and boring.

Professionals and hobbyists alike have been using Native Instruments for decades. That doesn't magically disappear just because Straker thinks their libraries are shite. But it seems like you're arguing just for the sake of arguing, so please - continue.

Me? I'm excited by the features in MPC 3. I'm cool with Akai partnering with NI for these plugins, even though I doubt I will buy any. Even though they don't appeal to me, they may appeal to plenty of others. That's a win for all of us, IMHO. If it keeps the lights on, that means we may see MPC 4. And don't think for a second that I don't have my own criticisms about what the MPC (and Force) is currently lacking and improvements I want to see - I just got done exchanging words with some cuck troll over at Gearslutz in regards to that. I just happen to be a "glass half full" sort of bloke.

What you write makes sense.
But it also makes sense to be kind of disappointed from my point of view because I never liked NI sound and to know that those guys will put hands on MPC is not a nice news for me.
If you realized, it seeems that Inmusic is going to buy NI so that means, if true, that they gonna push for implementing NI stuff into MPC more and more.
I know, some will be happy for that, and I am happy for them.
But still I wonder why Akai people don't turn thier attention to Moog, Alesis, and more serious brands that they have at their hand.
Anyway, good to know that the sampler and keygroups are getting improved.
It seems Akai is moving into two directions, which is good for everyone.

I have seen no evidence or indication that would even suggest that Native Instruments are for sale, let alone InMusic buying them.** People are reading way too much into this partnership, me thinks. But even if you hate NI with a passion and don't use their products, and have no intention of buying these new MPC Play Edition plugins, that doesn't take any value away from MPC 3's improvements, of which - they are legion. Massive improvements to the sampler, in fact.

Is it perfect? Not by a long shot. Could it still use improvements? Absolutely! But MPC 3 is indeed a step in the right direction as far as that's concerned, IMHO. Well, I mean - aside from the loss of the ability to assign a single Program to multiple tracks, the lack of time signatures, and the MIDI note off issue, but at least 2 of those are likely to be addressed...


** Edit: I think they were bought (majority) by a private equity investment group a few years ago, so they may go up for sale at some point actually.

EnochLight wrote:I have seen no evidence or indication that would even suggest that Native Instruments are for sale, let alone InMusic buying them.** People are reading way too much into this partnership, me thinks. But even if you hate NI with a passion and don't use their products, and have no intention of buying these new MPC Play Edition plugins, that doesn't take any value away from MPC 3's improvements, of which - they are legion. Massive improvements to the sampler, in fact.

Is it perfect? Not by a long shot. Could it still use improvements? Absolutely! But MPC 3 is indeed a step in the right direction as far as that's concerned, IMHO. Well, I mean - aside from the loss of the ability to assign a single Program to multiple tracks, the lack of time signatures, and the MIDI note off issue, but at least 2 of those are likely to be addressed...


** Edit: I think they were bought (majority) by a private equity investment group a few years ago, so they may go up for sale at some point actually.

Well, it really seems that NI will jump Inmusic crew, and this collaboration might be a test for that.
Yes, the improvements of keygroups and sample edit (repitch, improved warp) are very very welcomed and yes, that's the right direction for me.
Then of course you have to satisfy the majority of people who buy libraries and love presets, it's where the money comes from.
One thing I will never understand, this expansion/preset fashion, I really don't get it but there are many things I don't understand in the world today so, let's accept it.

Straker wrote:One thing I will never understand, this expansion/preset fashion

One thing I will never understand, this synth/computer fashion.

Kids these days, can't handle a soldering iron anymore !

"If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe" - Carl Sagan

So, each of us uses building blocks made by someone else... Some solder their oscillators from resistors and transistors they didn't manufacture themselves, others mix tracks they found on a CD. Some sample their own bongos (whose skins come from goats they didn't raise themselves), others buy sample packs. Some tweak their synthesizers for hours, others take the category's first preset and start jamming...

Each of us choses where they stand in the world of music, all places are equally valid and that each of us might have different reasons for choosing different places is not hard to understand, is it ?

We have limited resources, time above all, so we have to focus them - and we choose an area of focus... There is no escape from the fact that each of us is but a link in a gigantic value chain.

Some People Will NEVER Be Satisfied

40Beatz wrote:Some People Will NEVER Be Satisfied

Complaining can be a major dopamine hit to some people.

EnochLight wrote:I just got done exchanging words with some cuck troll over at Gearslutz in regards to that. I just happen to be a "glass half full" sort of bloke.

You're full of it allright Sorry, couldnt resist To be fair though, preset machines aren't exactly hard to come by for those who want them. And aren't real professionals mostly ITB anyway? Well maybe not all but I guess my point is it's understandable that some may worry that Akai will turn the MPC's into flashy rompler jukeboxes for limited NI plugins. Until today that is. Seems we'll all be getting our share after all. Got to admit I feel pretty glass half full myself today





Unlike with most other previous updates which went more like

About Akai and NI,

The music market will evolve so much that publishers' soundbanks will be competing with AI tools that will build any soundbank, just for you. Building virtual synthesizers and soundbanks will therefore no longer be profitable. In this sense, NI's future is uncertain, and a takeover by a company like inmusic makes perfect sense, since it will offer a perfect ecosystem and be profitable.

B-Wise wrote:

40Beatz wrote:Some People Will NEVER Be Satisfied

Complaining can be a major dopamine hit to some people.

Complaining about complainers can be too

About the quality of NI soundbanks

The notion of soundbank quality is subjective (even if I too find that all NIs sound the same and break the ears, but that's not the point).
No one is interested anymore, especially as our ears have been sanitized by the times we live in. Few people listen to music for what it sounds like, on a coherent audio system (I'm not even talking about creativity).
On the whole, productions sound the same and are developed to hook the listener for 10 seconds of punchy sound, in a context of loudness war. As a result, sampling one's own acoustic or analog instruments no longer appeals to many people. It's too complicated, too time-consuming, and you still need to own the sources (vinyl records, instruments, etc.).
And we're witnessing the emergence of the magical NI expansion interface, where you can shape your sound with a single finger. One finger compared to all the buttons you have to manipulate to create a sound on a moog. One magic finger compared to the 10 fingers I had to use to learn classical piano for 20 years...
Easy music for everyone. That's the inmusic market.
So, gentlemen, sample, sample and share!

I think Kontakt's factory library is actually pretty good for covering all the basics, also session brass is decent