Samples vs. Composition

im way more comfortable sampling than composing on the keys... sampling just come naturally to me while composing makes me think too much and my melodies start sounding alike so i just get frustated and go in the crates... once in a while i hit it in the head though and make a hot track on the keys but not as often as if flipped a sample..

Well again we will have to agree to disagree on this one

Like i said i have seen it first hand, guys that have praticed hard, know all the theory in the world ,work night and day etc...

but they just dont have it in them, u can have will power to pratice till ur blue in the face. but somethings cant be learned........


class...

Sampling is the work, composing the samples is the fun part. but thats just opinion, try to find both fun and your off.

stryke wrote:I know some cats on here are talented when it comes to composing but what do you guys and gals think is easier.To chop a sample or compose your own joint?Like today i'm sittin down tryin' to chop and i just can't get nothin' to sound right.I got so frustrated i just turned my joint off.

HEY, Blocks HAPPEN 2 COMPOSERS AS WELL........................

i luv samplin" composin" or a combo of both!!!!!!!!!!!

classic wrote:Well again we will have to agree to disagree on this one

Like i said i have seen it first hand, guys that have praticed hard, know all the theory in the world ,work night and day etc...

but they just dont have it in them, u can have will power to pratice till ur blue in the face. but somethings cant be learned........


class...

Well, you're probably just talking about people who learn something and don't apply it then.

Mavurik wrote:
Well, you're probably just talking about people who learn something and don't apply it then.

No ur missing my point im sayin that some people are born with the natural abiltity to do things and others arent. No amount of pratice can change that.

Its like perfect pitch, some people can hear perfectly tuned instraments in their head, most people cant. NO amount of pratice will give u perfect pitch

U cant take someone with no musical abiltity and teach them all the music theory,chourd progessions in the world, they still wont be able to compose if thier life dependend on it

class

Ok. Well, just because you say musical ability is something you are born with doesn't make it true. You are right about one thing though. Learning music theory and chord progressions won't teach you how to play a piano nor will it guarantee you any musical ability, but it will definitely help you if you apply it to what you know.

However, I think musical ability is something that can be achieved. The people who are good at music are good because of the work they put into it. They make music a part of their lives, or they grew up with it. To some people musical ability in certain areas comes easier, but that doesn't mean others can't work to that level. That's just a misconception. The only reason I won't become as good of a pianist as someone like Beethoven is because I won't put in the work, but it's possible despite whatever genes I was born with. As long as I have 5 fingers and toes and no REAL physical limitations that prevent me from playing music (and in some cases that doesn't matter), the only thing holding me back will be myself.

After all of the knowledge, music is about creativity. Therefore, the only thing separating you from somebody else musically is how you tap your creativity. I'm not a doctor but I don't think there is a gene that says you're only limited to a certain amount of creativity or inspiration. You just have to find what brings out the creativity in you. I think as far as music, some people go on as if they love music and become frustrated working hard when really their interests are not in the composition of what they're doing, but the reward. Some people at the root of their "love for music," just want to be famous. That can limit your creativity. You can tell the difference between somebody who really loves music and somebody who just wants to make music because of all of the things that come with it when you're successful.

People hold only themselves back as far as creativity goes, so if you want to believe that you have some sort of limit to your musical ability then that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But I, on the other hand, don't limit myself and if I really wanted to I know I could become as good as any producer. It won't happen overnight but it would happen eventually.

Edit: I just wanted to add that I think the creativity will give you the feeling most people who have an easier time with music have. I learn what I need to know and then I forget it and just apply it while I make my music. There is a certain point where you have to get technical because you don't want what you don't know to control your ability, but after that it's up to your creativity and that's when you have to let your feelings produce.

Mavurik wrote:The only reason I won't become as good of a pianist as someone like Beethoven is because I won't put in the work, but it's possible despite whatever genes I was born with. As long as I have 5 fingers and toes and no REAL physical limitations that prevent me from playing music (and in some cases that doesn't matter), the only thing holding me back will be myself.

.

Like i said we will have to disagree on this,(its a good convo though)

THere are plenty of people who have played the piano just as long is mozart, there are plenty of people who praticed composititon just as much as chopin or, schurburt. There are plenty of people who have played the gutiar just as long as muddy waters, or BB king

But they NEVER reach that level becasue they dont have that talent in them. If u have the talent and pratice u can reach that level, but if u dont have the talent it wont happen.


U can take 99% of people and start them on music when they are 2 years old, and they will NEVER reach the level of mozart, beetoven ,or have the composition of duke ellltinton, creativity is not something that can be learned, it is only something that can be developed.

It has to be in you in the first place in order for u to develope it, Ur right on a lot of things but i think ur failing to see that inorder to develope your musical abiltity u have to be born with that natural talent it the first place. People who pratice and get better ALWAYS had that abilitity in them in the firstplace, they are just developing it..

Art is another example
No matter how hard i try, i will never be able to draw well, its just not in me, i can take all the art classes in the world(i have). I can learn all the tequniques etc.. But when it comes down to it i will be only drawing stick figures. I have imporved a little but i have homeboys who were drawing crazy ish when we were kids. Its just in them, and if they nuture that abilitity they will become better then i could ever be. My mind just dosent have the abiltity to create like that.
Music is the same way, most peoples minds just dont have the abilitity to create composititons no matter how hard they pratice.

THis is what i mean when i say that keyboard, theory lessions etc.. really wont matter if u dont have the abilitity in the first place

NOTE:
Im sorry man i dont care how long u pratice(or how early u started) u will never reach the level or mozart or beetoven, those dudes were amazing,that is genious, not just pratice.

take it from someone who has been doin this msuic thing for awhile......

class....

classic wrote:
NOTE:
Im sorry man i dont care how long u pratice(or how early u started) u will never reach the level or mozart or beetoven, those dudes were amazing,that is genious, not just pratice.

So you're sayin mozart and Beethoven were born with this natural ability and couldn't have been taught to play that great?

It has to be in you in the first place in order for u to develope it, Ur right on a lot of things but i think ur failing to see that inorder to develope your musical abiltity u have to be born with that natural talent it the first place. People who pratice and get better ALWAYS had that abilitity in them in the firstplace, they are just developing it..

What you're failing to realize is that it is in you in the first place. Different people just have different access to it. The first way to block access to your musical ability is to deny yourself of it. If you believe you can only go so far then you probably will only go so far.

It all comes down to creativity. You may not ever draw as good as your friends, but if you tapped your creativity you could create art better than anyone could ever imagine. I think all people are creative. Some people just block theirs by placing limits on themselves and others don't know how to access it.

As for skill, that's just a matter of things clicking in your mind. It's not like playing piano like Beethoven or Mozart is some impossible skill that nobody can master. Millions of people have. The creativity that went along with it is what's important. That creativity everybody possesses.

I guess we're talking about two different things now.

well i dont agree or disagree with any side but must say the mozart example is a bad one to question- the guy was writing scores at the age of 5- that is natural ability no question!!

greg

You know what, actually I'm wrong. I just think there's more factors to it than natural talent, that's all.

Mavurik wrote:

Beethoven or Mozart is some impossible skill that nobody can master. Millions of people have. The creativity that went along with it is what's important. That creativity everybody possesses.
I guess we're talking about two different things now.

As a pianst i can tell u that there are some msuican pieces that people just cant play(no matter how hard they try). COmposers like rachminoff have extemrely diffcult musical compsotitons and most pianits dont have the talent to pull something like off on a professinal level ,with that being said u have to realise that.



there is a differnce between learing how to play somebody elses music, and creating you own music,Thats another reason why i said pianolessions dont really help somebody become a better prodcuer. Producing is creating music. Most piano lessions simply teach u how to play somebody elses music
to totally differnt skills man, you gotta realise that. U can pretty music teach anybody with basic musical abilitity how to play fur elise(basic beetoven ) by beetoven. Thats easy. But again VERY few people actually have the natural talent to CREATE music from scratch.

Mavurik wrote:You know what, actually I'm wrong. I just think there's more factors to it than natural talent, that's all.

I do tooo, Im not sayin its all just about natural talent. The talent has to be developed and nutured. You can have all the talent in the world but if u dont pratice and work hard it wont do u any good.

BUt u see the talent has to be in you in the first place in order for u to develope it

BASICALLY the whole point is this

YOU CANNOT LEARN MUSICAL ABILITITY, u cand only develope the musical abilitity that u already have within you.

class...

stryke wrote:

classic wrote:
NOTE:
Im sorry man i dont care how long u pratice(or how early u started) u will never reach the level or mozart or beetoven, those dudes were amazing,that is genious, not just pratice.

So you're sayin mozart and Beethoven were born with this natural ability and couldn't have been taught to play that great?

Pretty much, im saying that they were born with a predispotition to play music. Just like some people are born with certain talents to do things well(mathmatics, athetics etc...)

Now keep in mind that they also were lucky enough to be in the right situation where that talent could be nutured. But you cant just take any 2 year old and teach them how to play the piano or compoase like mozart of beetoven. THey had that natural abiltitity already with in them to create music.

I have friends who are smart as hell but they never had that talent nutured so they dident reach their full potiential. SO pratice is just as important.

I want u guys to see that just becasue u take gutiar lessions for 50 years doesent mean u will get anywhere near as good as eric claption. IT dosent work like that.

U can start a kid playing basketball at 2, so u think thats going to make him as good as micheal jorden, jordan had that natural abilitity and drive(as well as a combitnaion of other talents,leadership) within him. U cant teach that stuff, only develope it

Like i said i dont pretend to know everything but i have ALOT of experince with this, to many people think that taking piano lessions etc.. is going to make them a better producer. YOu have to have the ear in the first place

class..

when it comes down to it......i consider myself more of a drum sampler, and a bass player.......then a sampler vs keys.

i mean, i do both.......and im way more sample based...but no matter how i do it, im always makin drums, and basslines.

i personally think those are what make or break a good beat. You can be minimalist with both, but aslong as the drums bang and the bass grooves, youve got yourself a beat.

When i get stuck with samples, its best to just start over, or save those samples for a rainy day. Ive got like 2 hot beats out of 10......sample based. Not cuase im bad at sampling. But because ive got a bad habit of sampling everything and saving it....then i get off on a tangent, even though theres nothing there.

the best thing to do is just serioulsy be patient and wait for that sample you just immediately fall in love with.....all the other ones, just sample them and set them aside. REMEMBER if it evokes emotion for you, then youll get a beat out of it......if its just a "technically good sample" but doesnt inspire you, **** it.