Why Does the 3000 Bump more than the 2000xl

Nope, not placebo, and tweaking your sample on the way in on both sampler will still sound different. I've tried it with others and we all heard the difference.

You'd have to tweak just the 2000, but it isn't just an eq thing, any tweaks tend to change the sample. but not in the way the sampler does it.

it's fairy dust. Roger Linn had grips of it. You can probably find some of it on ebay.

IMO it comes down to how well the beat is mixed and mastered. Of course you need a good sound to start with, which any MPC can produce for you. Dr. Dre's drums sound so good because he works with a great engineer. In addition, he uses a mixing board that cost well over a $100K to get the sound he wants.

Use any MPC you want. Let's all remeber, a hot track is a hot track.

IMO it comes down to how well the beat is mixed and mastered. Of course you need a good sound to start with, which any MPC can produce for you. Dr. Dre's drums sound so good because he works with a great engineer. In addition, he uses a mixing board that cost well over a $100K to get the sound he wants.

Use any MPC you want. Let's all remeber, a hot track is a hot track.

WorldWarIII wrote:IMO it comes down to how well the beat is mixed and mastered. Of course you need a good sound to start with, which any MPC can produce for you. Dr. Dre's drums sound so good because he works with a great engineer. In addition, he uses a mixing board that cost well over a $100K to get the sound he wants.

Use any MPC you want. Let's all remeber, a hot track is a hot track.

But that in itself is where the problem starts and ends.

It all depends on the individuals:
a) knowledge and understanding of said MPC
b) the end road for said MPC, ie a DJ playing live, a band playing live, bedroom studio, project studio, or SSL room
c) the sound foundation of the user of said MPC, such as vinyl based samples, purchased sample libraries, MPC plus modules, MPC plus samplers, or any combination there of
d) type of music the user makes

The biggest thing still comes down to the Human User making a dramatic difference.
Pete Rock went from using the SP/S-950 combo to using MPC's and the S1000 or 3000 sampler. ( He still uses the SP but it not the foundation like it use to be).
People say he sounds different because he changed gear, but I say he sounds different because he evolved. That evolution is what made him make new gear choices.
It's about trying to stay on your game.

If the _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ (fill in the blanks) makes you productive and creative then keep using it. It doesn't mean it's better than the _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _, it just means it's better for you, and thatt's what really matters.

So in closing I say;

can't we all just ..................

But that in itself is where the problem starts and ends.

It all depends on the individuals:
a) knowledge and understanding of said MPC
b) the end road for said MPC, ie a DJ playing live, a band playing live, bedroom studio, project studio, or SSL room
c) the sound foundation of the user of said MPC, such as vinyl based samples, purchased sample libraries, MPC plus modules, MPC plus samplers, or any combination there of
d) type of music the user makes

The biggest thing still comes down to the Human User making a dramatic difference.
Pete Rock went from using the SP/S-950 combo to using MPC's and the S1000 or 3000 sampler. ( He still uses the SP but it not the foundation like it use to be).
People say he sounds different because he changed gear, but I say he sounds different because he evolved. That evolution is what made him make new gear choices.
It's about trying to stay on your game.

If the _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ (fill in the blanks) makes you productive and creative then keep using it. It doesn't mean it's better than the _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _, it just means it's better for you, and thatt's what really matters.

So in closing I say;

can't we all just ..................[/quote]

I agree. Put a good producer in a room with some random gear, and something hot is going to come out. Put a garbage producer in a room with every piece of of gear ever made and you will still get garbage. Don't worry about the name on the machine....make hot beats with what you got.

yeah but yall are fudging the argument, try a 3000 and a 2000/XL with the same sample, sampled at the same level, and you can hear a difference. that's all I'm saying, it's not a deal breaker, but there is something inherently different in the samplers. all the other stuff can make an SK-1 bump, but it doesn't mean that it doesn't sound different to begin with.

Stop it with the straw man arguments.

elmacaco wrote:yeah but yall are fudging the argument, try a 3000 and a 2000/XL with the same sample, sampled at the same level, and you can hear a difference. that's all I'm saying, it's not a deal breaker, but there is something inherently different in the samplers. all the other stuff can make an SK-1 bump, but it doesn't mean that it doesn't sound different to begin with.

Stop it with the straw man arguments.

El, I understand what you are saying.
When you put mastering and things like that into the equation it just voids the argument since it's no longer about the machine.
I can work and make something sound like the 60, 3000, SP or whatever, but the time I waste on that stalls the creative nature of what I am doing.
I will use the drum machine that will give me that sound and keep the creativity going.
The real reason why the the MPC-3000 bangs beats the way that it does is because it's a lot closer to the MPC-60 than people might realize.
The 60 while being 12-bit used 16-bit processing, thus the reason why we can use a 60 for sounds as effectively as we do.
Listen to the 3000, the drums hit like a 60 but just appear to have more sheen to them.
Listen to the xl and the drums have a brighter sound and are capable of a higher output level. They can sound louder but won't hit as hard.
They just don't have that lowend impact.
I would never say the drums in the MPC bang the same, but I can also understand how a person's preference would make them choose one MPC over the other.

This is the 3000/60 forum so most of us have made one of them our choice and we stand by it.

By the way El, the SK-1 and the SK-5 were just plain fun back in the day

I really think its all in the mixing and mastering. If you want more bump just turn up the bass on ya mixer. One thing I have notice from reading scratch is that the only people who really still use a 3k is producers who have been putting in work since the early or mid 90's. I think its more of a personal choice then anything. Just think about it folks. Em uses a 2000 xl and the same for scott storch an kon artist. Why don't these 3 names who are close to dr dre in some way use the mpc he do. Dre is just use to the 3k from options and features to the sound it produces. How many people here think they can buy a cd and other than knowing the producers signature style, can you just pick out what was created on what mpc or non mpc. Spend more time learning to use the machine you choose and tweaking the samples you put in it and you'll be alright.

We are not talking about mixing and mastering!! Who can afford to use Dre's Engineer and equipment? Scott Storch and M&M, that's about it. We are not talking about pro beats on cd's or the radio, we are talking about the experience of using these machines and what we hear coming from them. Why does everybody always have to diffuse good discussions just to make everyone feelgood? I can handle that the 60 has half the features if not less than any of the other MPC's, but 2kXL owners can't handle that the 3k might be better in some ways and gotta be all defensive?
[Ntalec, yeah man you get it ]

but I don't think spending time to tweak your sound is a waste, it is part of the creative process, and for many people the sound of the 2k is what they want, so no machine really exempts you from the tweaking, and it's not like the sound of the 2k is bad that you have to tweak it to make it sound right, the 3k just bumps different, and it is much more than just boosting the bass, there is complex digital processing going on that better men than we fail to grasp, so we try and get at it. But there is a difference, and we want to talk about it, we are not talking about mastering or SSL's and Pultecs, we're talking about you, in your basement, using your mpc and really hearing the details of how it works. After all knowing your equipment can only make you better.

some one needs to break out bumpometer. to settle this once and for all.

yo ever since the war them shyts are so expensive, I think Bush bombed the factory yo.

nah, I got a bumpometer

Well if that's ya case elm then the converts in the 3k are the same as the 2kxl from what I was told. If they don't sound the same. Who cares. I don't slave over the music to stress why one apple is more reder than the next. By the way. As far as you thinking the 2kxl owners think the 3k is better so we get defensive is funny. The machines pretty much do or can do the same thing. there a few features that one machine may have that the other don't but better machine can only be judge by better person using it. But you go ahead open the mpc up and try to find the secret to the universe for us all.

young_keyz wrote:Well if that's ya case elm then the converts in the 3k are the same as the 2kxl from what I was told.

Same converters, different circuit design, different circuit components.
You every read the disclaimer that says subject to change without notice?
It's there because they change components and circuit designs all the time based on availabilty and cost.
Here's some examples
-Rackmount effects same unit one has 15v power supply the other has 12v power supply because the IC's voltage specs changed. They later find out that the change increased or decreased reliability.
Open a SP-12, SP-1200G and SP-1200B. Follow the schematic and start to notice they have different power supplies, regulators and line filtering based on problems they saw or what was available.
_Roger Linn gets all the credit for the original MPC's but the truth of the matter is that Akai desreves a lot more credit than they get.
The Linn 9000 was Roger's MPC, the technology and designs of Akai allowed them to make it a better more functional device.
If Akai had use the 3000 engine for the 2000's they would be a different unit than what they are now.
The problem with R&D and design is it's constantly moving and evolving.
On paper the 60 was better than the 9000, the 3000 was better than the 60, and the 2000 was better than the 3000.
Why? Because they are looking at specs and feature set.
Do the users feel the same way? Probably not but they continue to make money because they grow new users.
Owning a xl, plus a 3000 and maybe a SP is one thing, but it's still not the same as using all of them.
If you are actually using all of them you get to know their nature and character, see their advantages and disadvantages.
You will notice things like how that same old tired Rakim snare sample sounds right coming out of a 60 but not the xl.
How beats chopped on the 3000 fit together and feel better on the 3000 than on the xl.
How the xl's display makes looping a faster function.
How the OG2000's data wheel smokes all the other data wheels.

We all have ideas and opinions but we have to also accept that differences really do exist.
Akai should open up a MPC Store, with knowledgable people and all the MPC's (60-4000) for you to compare so you can purchase the one that's right for you.