Pete Rock a 16-bit sell out.....

^You'll never see an SP-1200 re-release like you did in 97' because market statistics show people aren't willing to pay more then $2,000 for a drum machine sampler any more. And what people are, don't make up enough of the buying demographics to make it worth while finacially for a company like E-mu to do.

People like software cause it's 95% of the time pirated. Not because it's superior. If thier was a spot everyone could get a free MPC or SP, everyone and thier **** mom would have one. And NO ONE would use software. I gurantee it.

People don't buy 2"s because they don't have the tecnical now-how to maintain one, and they can't afford one. Not because they think Pro Tools is better. Same principle with samplers. It's a cost issue from the sellers side, and the consumers side.

The inbetween the line observation on this is that, beat makers and mc's today don't have enough confidence in themselves and they're crafts to invest in something so expensive, and then not have it work out. Thats why more people were FANS and not artist in the 70's. Because everything cost over 5G's. Who is going to put up that kinda cash? Only investors.. Who do the investors back? Major label.. Who are the Majors gonna sign? The cream of the crop.. Why? Because they got all the equipment and they can afford to be choosey.. Why? Because only people who had mad skills were actually getting out and doing anything..

It didn't hurt that the general population was blessed with good music all around them. From Gospel to Rock. So they new dope sh*t when they heard it. Now...

drumatic your crazy homie. all im saying is i can make a beat on playstation music generator and the way i compress shit makes it sound more raw then anything you can make on a 60 or a sp12 alone. and thats fact, i brickwall all my recordings so the compressor is pumping violently. now thats grimey

i just love the way my asr dirtys up my sound...
its my secret weapon.. i can make it sound clean or grimy...

Compression does not grimey make....

But we've moved on.

Yes, the commitment to software is less, it takes up no space, no more electricity that your computer already does, but then you gotta worry about your computer, ram, soundcard, midi interfaces, etc. And in 5 to 10 years whatever software you have will be obsolete because your computer will be unable to do all the other things a computer does like surf the net and stream movies and teleport stuff (in the future I'm saying ) so you'll need another computer anyway, and your old one because it was made with cheap parts and not built to last will be slower that it used to be, problematic, etc. Then there wil be new software for you to learn, But it's like empty calories, you do not learn a tool, you just become a tool to the market that is trying to create perfect consumers.

yeah, they say hardware will die, just like they said accoustic instruments would die, just like they said analog would die, just like they said sampling would die after them 90's lawsuits, and they have always been wrong. There's more analog modulars out now than back in the day when they were the only electronic game in town, small manufacturers put out specialty products in small numbers with low overhead for the people who want that kind of thing. That is if the major companies dont realize that software will be the end of them too, and midi controllers are also a product that can be consciously obsoleted (notice how many now only have a USB port and no midi ports? makes it useless without a computer that has USB, how much longer will USB last?)

The deal is that musicians are not terribly smart, not very educated, and generally fall for things that other musicians fall for, and if they realize that they've been had, well, then they tend not to admit it because in addition to being stupid they are also proud, so they won't speak up and warn others.

Electron added a 12 bit sampler to the MD, and that spectralis is a boutique product pushing some boundries.

there is one thing where software sampling will grow is for those sample preset jockies, where people will use them like Motif's to have realistic sounds or just a butt load of sounds. but soon resynth technology will take over on that end and using soft samplers like I use a sampler is just not that appetizing.

www.soundclick.com/bands/3/fluentmusic.htm

peep the fela kuti remix, overcompressed, GRIMEY. made on the 16 bit sp505. do not tell me compression doesnt make grimey if you've never used brickwall compression settings, 20:1 ratios, and 30 db gains. madlib is infamous for making the 303 sound raw by compressing his beats at 20:1 ratios and squashing the signal

edit- and the over-compression on that remix is tame compared to some of my other beats

and like i said, 'grimey' sound to me is not hard hitting drums like 99% of hip hop producers are trying to accomplish. i prefer the muffled type sound

Aw, the SP-303 and 505 are capable of great grime, the proprietry audio format that roland uses to get the realtime timestretch and pitchshift is pretty grimey to begin with, or definitly unclean, and the lo fi effect and the other effects on their bug out all sorts of grimey. I think those pieces are better designed than the fantom n shyt.

The remix is pretty dope. Defintely Lo Fi. The overcompression just adds distortion. not quite what everybody means when they talk grime.

Lo Pass Filter wrote:
First, I will start this reply by saying, Drumat!c makes better beats then all of ya'll on this forum.

That is a VERY bold statement considering that you cannot prove it to be FACT.....Musical tastes are subjective....

this thread actually got good. As el stated before pete isnt a sellout and sucking akais dick if he has been using an mpc right? The man has had one for a minute, and he actually uses it in tandem with the sp1200. All im saying is that if you are hot and u know how to use your gear, it doesnt matter what u use to achieve quality. I just think its a joke when people get into all this eltiist crap, like OHH TO MAKE HIP HOP BEATS U NEED 12 BIT SAMPLING WITH 3 SECONDS OF TIME!!!!!!! thats just bull****. I think in all honesty if u gave someone with mad skills an sp1200 and an mpc4000 the same product would be achieved. Not because of the gear but because of the methods. Shit i thought pete rocks ini and petestrumental albums were just as good as his old shit and that was done with an mpc and sp1200. So lets stop with all the crutches bullshit and so and so is a 12bit casue he rocking a new machine. I like the sp1200 and have only messed with one once, but im into the mpc sequing reason casue i work faster. The sound is a little thin, but in mixdown who the **** cares? I still run my shit through avalon preamps and a nice mackie board. Pete rocks beats would sound like ass if they werent ran through nice baords and tweeked by his engineer of many years. U cats should focus more on method and technique instead of devoting yourselves to one train of thought being 12 bit is superior and i will not use this and that because thats not "keeping it real". A producer can make heat on whatever u provide them with, if they are worth there weight. I just think pete rock is older and a little out of touch with the music right now. I dont think he has that spark like he did. Not casue of his gear.

^Where do you get all this bullsh*t people?

Emma, your my boy but, Pete didn't use an MPC on SS1. Trust me on that.

Binger: No MPC in tandem wtih SP on Petestrumentals or INI. Your confusing the reverse function and clearity as an MPC, when in fact it is the S950 at 13,000+ bandwidth (once again, people talking about sh*t they don't know about. S950 is 12-bit, however, at high sample rates it is so crystal clear it's glassy).

Fluent: Your mistaken "grimey" (which isn't the word I used anyhow) for something else. You've got a truely grimey sound because your mixes are piss poor, and because your compressor is adding way to much gain to the signal causing distortion. You are rocking the true sense of grimeyness in the same way Rza did with early WU. Rza's mixes were straight ass, which is where the term grimey started. I'd say WU are they pioneers of grimey Hip-Hop.

It cracks me up when cats with MPC2k+'s and software sample at low bit depths, or use programs that "crush" the sound and think that shit makes thier beats sound like a 12-bit sampler. Not sure if any of you geniuses have heard an MPC 60, or an EPS classic, they're far from grimey. They are thick, and actually makes drums punch through the mix!! But they are accurately displayed samples. No difference then the over the top bright sheen sound 16 bit samplers have. Like I said in a post before this, 16-bit is not any more or less accurate. It colors sound too. It's a preference thing. But I want to make clear 12-bit samplers are not grainy sounding, or lo-fi. Lo-fi is what happens with poor eq'ing and too many fx. You know that half of the pop star Pink's LP was done on an SP-1200 right? You know almost every early 90's R&b group was produced on a 60 or SP. Black street anyone!? How do you think Teddy got those banging on drums on, "You like the way I work it (No diggity)".

Thiers just a lota misconceptions going on in music today. I think im'a write a book. Spend a solid year or two and just clear the air of all they hype. Get a grip of verifyable information to put an end to the non-sense. Would anyone be interested in purchasing a book like that? I might even include audio commentary from some legendary producers talking about they're TRUE feelings on Hip-Hop etc. And tech Guru's like Bruce and Rodger..

I use the SP-1200, (2) of them sync'd up. But I've got an outstanding mixing console and outboard gear to go along with it. My shit is definately early 90's sounding, in that, the snares are on tin can status, and my hats sound metalic and shit, but the overrall presentation is far from grimey. I spent thousands of dollars to make sure I got a full, massive, dynamic sound.

If anyone wants to hear an SP-1200 + S950 LP that is super open and clear, but possess the associated vibe and sound associated with those particular samplers.. check out Lord Finesses Awakening.. I'm finished.

Your mistaken "grimey" (which isn't the word I used anyhow) for something else. You've got a truely grimey sound because your mixes are piss poor, and because your compressor is adding way to much gain to the signal causing distortion. You are rocking the true sense of grimeyness in the same way Rza did with early WU. Rza's mixes were straight ass, which is where the term grimey started. I'd say WU are they pioneers of grimey Hip-Hop.

i guess ill take that as a compliment. each beat is mixed exactly how i want it to sound, and every compressor setting is tweaked to achieve that 'piss poor' sound . i can and have made cleaner mixes but i choose not to do that now. preference thing

Boogie: You shoulda quoted the other half of what I said.

Fluent: Word. I wasn't dissing you.. I'm sure it is intentional. In fact, I support cats coming with the gutter sound. I'd much rather hear your over compressed material then some ultra clean sh*t. It sounds more "Hip-Hop" to me.

Lo Pass Filter wrote:Boogie: You shoulda quoted the other half of what I said.

It doesn't matter what you said in the other half...What you said regarding drumatics beats is not a fact...It is an opinion...

binger0 wrote:word. See the real heads know the deal. we dont need no crutches like OHHHH I NEED 12 BIT OR I NEED TO GET A SANSAMP TO GET DOPE DRUMS!!!! If u know how to make beats and sample, u can make ANYTHING grimy. It just comes down to the processing after u sample. Im sick of cats being like OOOOO PETE ROCK IS A SELL OUT CASUE THIS AND THAT. Pete rock is just falling off. It dont matter what he uses his beats will not be mecca and the soul brother no more. Elitist dorks blame this on the equipment instead of pete just not putting out the heat like he used to. I sample with wavelab and use my mpc to control reason and my beats sound nice and "grimy" to me. if u dont believe me check some out
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/2/djhazemusic.htm
Ill take a dump on your 12 bit toys son! BITCHMADE FA**OTS!!!!!!!!!
BIT WARS BIT*H

hahaha!!! true words in there my *****.


with that out the way, seems like matic was fucing around, besides grimey is a feeling, not a sound.

cats in the bay make some of the cleanest sounded shit, but its str8 raw anyhow.

Yo the proof is in the pudding: http://www.soundclick.com/bands/3/drumatic_music.htm