boomspot wrote:update: the mpc 60 was set to a default shuffle/swing of 62%. The 2500 was set to 2500 which would explain the better feel of the 1st file.someone should try the same test and then we can compare at the same level of swing feel,
D
boomspot wrote:update: the mpc 60 was set to a default shuffle/swing of 62%. The 2500 was set to 2500 which would explain the better feel of the 1st file.
D
Teletran1 wrote:I'm a 60 user...Did you check the gain button on the back panel? It sounds like it might be on High. Or it could be your threshold...I had a similar problem when I first bought my 60 but as soon as I figured it out every hihat, kick and snare has been lovely.
Weasel wrote:As for making incremental values and storing them to emulate the MPCs feel...
I'd guess that it would not be exactly the same, due to different ways of programming what a "swing" is.
Can anyone import a swinging hat (for example) from an older MPC and compare against what SX would say is a swing.
This notion piqued my curiosity. So this afternoon, I dragged the MPC-60 out of the garage and sync'd it into my system and made some measurements.
First, the methodology:
I made one continuous 16th note Snare (note 38 ) hit into a 2 bar sequence and copied the sequence 25 times. The first sequence was labeled: 50.
The second sequence was swing shuffled by 51 and labeled 51. The third was shuffled by 52 and labeled 52. This process was continued until the last possible swing shuffling value was entered into the last sequence: 75.
A blank sequence and the 26 timing sequences were made into a Song, so they'd play in order, starting with the blank two bar sequence followed by 50, 51, 52, 53...etc. (The blank sequence was put in the first position to overcome the long standing "first Song note hiccup" bug that was never corrected in the MPC-60.)
Since SX3 no longer has the option to receive MIDI clock as a sync source and the MPC-60 can't send MTC, only receive it, sync was established by sending MTC from SX-3 to the MPC-60. Once sync was established, SX recorded the MIDI output of the MPC-60. Prior to recording, SX-3 was set to 480ppq and AutoQuant OFF.
Starting with the first 2 bars with MIDI data (MPC-60's swing value of 50) every two bars were scissored and labeled accordingly: 50, 51, 52, 53...etc.
So now we have 26 two bar parts, each with a recording of the MPC-60's swing timing. These were now set to play a drum on an Alesis D4...known for its MIDI firing accuracy. A copy of the entire track was made so tracks both played all 26 parts into the same D4 drum note.
Each Part on the second track was requantized using SX's Quantize editor. Using a 16th grid, Type=Straight, the Swing % slider and Auto checked....I adjusted the swing of the second parts til they "phased" with the original "control" track. I did this for the first 17 parts. Why only 17? The results below.
MPC-60 50 = SX 0%
MPC-60 51 = SX 0%
MPC-60 52 = SX 12%
MPC-60 53 = SX 12%
MPC-60 54 = SX 24%
MPC-60 55 = SX 24%
MPC-60 56 = SX 37%
MPC-60 57 = SX 37%
MPC-60 58 = SX 50%
MPC-60 59 = SX 50%
MPC-60 60 = SX 62%
MPC-60 61 = SX 62%
MPC-60 62 = SX 76%
MPC-60 63 = SX 76%
MPC-60 64 = SX 86%
MPC-60 65 = SX 86%
MPC-60 66 = SX 100%
MPC-60 67 = SX 100%
Since the SX's Swing slider can't increase values beyond 100% I stopped testing...also because the next value (68 ) would actually not be a "swung" note but a 32nd note value.
But have you noticed something in the chart? It would appear that AKAI has been lying to us for years. There is absolutely no detectable difference between odd and even adjacent values, starting with 50.
And just to be certain about this, I took a copy of the original 51 an placed it directly under 50 and let them both play. Phasing. No timing diffrerence whatsoever. This proved true for EVERY odd/even set. This means that swing shuffling an MPC-60 sequence by a value of (for instance) 62 produces no discernable difference in timing than setting it for a value of 63. The short story: All ODD values are duplicates of the preceding EVEN value. So if you'd like a true chart of 16th note translations from MPC-60 to SX...here it is:
MPC-60 50 = SX 0%
MPC-60 52 = SX 12%
MPC-60 54 = SX 24%
MPC-60 56 = SX 37%
MPC-60 58 = SX 50%
MPC-60 60 = SX 62%
MPC-60 62 = SX 76%
MPC-60 64 = SX 86%
MPC-60 66 = SX 100%
Anyone notice a mathematical correlation between MPC values and SX %'s?
So, using Advanced Quantize/Parts To Groove I made 9 MPC-60 Quant Presets labeled 50 thru 66 just to see how well that function worked...and it does. Perfectly. If anyone is curious what the 1/8th note quant % equivalents are...you'll have to find out for yourselves. After looking at the 16th note results, I felt it wasn't worth the bother.
What I did find interesting was the total lack of timing drift being outputted from the MPC-60. They don't make 'em like they used to, do they?
Teletran1 wrote:Try threshold at 10% and the gain on mid.
Mr modnaR wrote:@ subvertbeats just been through the whole phasing thing with Jacpot. if there is phasing between two samples one played at 61 swing and the other at 62, then they are being played at different times. it is such a minuscule difference as to be irrelevant, but i thought i'd just butt into this thread that doesn't concern me and pedantically voice my opinion.
sorry.
Teletran1 wrote:Try threshold at 10% and the gain on mid.
