old vs new

_Stilo_ wrote:Peezie's right....threshold is only used as a trigger to start recording. After that, it has no influence anymore. If you set it to 0 of course, you will start sampling immediately cause even the noise floor will trigger the sampling.

Gain is another thing, if that is adjustable, it might affect sound to noise ratio.

Peezie is right in the fact that threshold is used as a trigger to begin recording. But if you have it set at 0%, like you said, even the noise floor will trigger sampling, picking up any quiet hiss or static sounds. So that DOES affect the quality of sound in that sense.

Threshold is the volume setting you're using to tell the MPC that anything above that level is when it should start sampling.

Setting your gain on low will help record less hiss if used with the correct threshold setting. Because if it's on low and your threshold is still at 0, I'm sure it'll sample more sound than what you're trying to get.

So to get back to the actual subject of the post, boomspot, I hope this helps in your experiment. Post up the results soon!

Teletran1 wrote:Peezie is right in the fact that threshold is used as a trigger to begin recording. But if you have it set at 0%, like you said, even the noise floor will trigger sampling, picking up any quiet hiss or static sounds. So that DOES affect the quality of sound in that sense.

Just to make sure we're on the same level here:

Threshold does NOT mean that the sampler only records when the signal is above the threshold, so that it would start and stop recording depending on the level of the signal.

Threshold is like a barrier the signal has to exceed. After that the sampler starts recording everything and does so until you tell it to stop.

Of course you will have more noise before the actual sound if you sample for example a kick drum. But usually you would trim it to just before the kick starts anyway, right? And the noise underneath the kick sound will be the same regardless of threshold setting.



Peace,
Stilo.

_Stilo_ wrote:Just to make sure we're on the same level here:

Threshold does NOT mean that the sampler only records when the signal is above the threshold, so that it would start and stop recording depending on the level of the signal.

Threshold is like a barrier the signal has to exceed. After that the sampler starts recording everything and does so until you tell it to stop.

Of course you will have more noise before the actual sound if you sample for example a kick drum. But usually you would trim it to just before the kick starts anyway, right? And the noise underneath the kick sound will be the same regardless of threshold setting.



Peace,
Stilo.

You're saying what I said in different words.

thanks for the tips fellas. I tried sampling with the gain set to low and i'm getting good results. I'll redo the comparison with the exact swing settings later tonight now that i'm getting clean samples.

D

Teletran1 wrote:You're saying what I said in different words.

Alright then

boomspot, thanks for taking the time to do this swing comparison. once you post the final results, this long-debated issue can finally be put to rest.

do people really need to have such a simple thing pointed out 3+ times?

_Stilo_ wrote:

Teletran1 wrote:Peezie is right in the fact that threshold is used as a trigger to begin recording. But if you have it set at 0%, like you said, even the noise floor will trigger sampling, picking up any quiet hiss or static sounds. So that DOES affect the quality of sound in that sense.

Just to make sure we're on the same level here:

Threshold does NOT mean that the sampler only records when the signal is above the threshold, so that it would start and stop recording depending on the level of the signal.

Threshold is like a barrier the signal has to exceed. After that the sampler starts recording everything and does so until you tell it to stop.

Of course you will have more noise before the actual sound if you sample for example a kick drum. But usually you would trim it to just before the kick starts anyway, right? And the noise underneath the kick sound will be the same regardless of threshold setting.



Peace,
Stilo.

nope. you are so wrong.

Teletran1 wrote:
You're saying what I said in different words.

You must've failed reading comprehension.

how you figga? youre confused. still does not affect the sound quality.

Teletran1 wrote:But if you have it set at 0%, like you said, even the noise floor will trigger sampling, picking up any quiet hiss or static sounds. So that DOES affect the quality of sound in that sense.

Threshold is the volume setting you're using to tell the MPC that anything above that level is when it should start sampling.

Ok, so here are the new .wav files for you to check out & guess which is the 60 and which is the 2500. I recorded 3 tracks of drum sounds set at full level , 16th notes with 62% swing in a basic pattern. I also put each file through a waves SSL masterbus comp to get the levels matched up.

http://www.boomspot.com/mpc60vs2500/Drums_1_Test_2.wav
http://www.boomspot.com/mpc60vs2500/Drums_2_Test_2.wav

Which one has the legendary swing and feel?

D

I like 1 better. But not sure if its the timing or the sound that makes it nicer to me. Its crunchier and I am guessing its the MPC60.

i like 1 better.

not so stiff.

This is very cool !!!, thanx a lot for taking the time...

Sample #2 seems way brighter, ie more highs and high mids.. And a little peakier amplitude wise (from my ears) but that could just be cause of the high freqs.

also i notice the bass drum thump more on number 1. The 'note' of the kick almost sounds a semitone lower, and sounds better.

Overall #1 soundz better cause i don't like the frequency balance of #2. Assuming #2 is the newer machine though.. its pretty easy to trim off some of that high end with a nice eq, a lot easier than it is to add high end back on if is has been lost.

To be picky, i don't know if using a compressor to match levels was fair... cause they would receive different amounts of compression that way and sound different. maybe just a normalize next time?


I haven't managed to convince myself if i hear a timing difference or not yet.

I never looked into the mpc60, what is the sample rate/bit depth? (I know that's a lazy question ).

[quote="sleepersriddle"]This is very cool !!!, thanx a lot for taking the time...

Sample #2 seems way brighter, ie more highs and high mids.. And a little peakier amplitude wise (from my ears) but that could just be cause of the high freqs.

also i notice the bass drum thump more on number 1. The 'note' of the kick almost sounds a semitone lower, and sounds better.

Overall #1 soundz better cause i don't like the frequency balance of #2. Assuming #2 is the newer machine though.. its pretty easy to trim off some of that high end with a nice eq, a lot easier than it is to add high end back on if is has been lost.

To be picky, i don't know if using a compressor to match levels was fair... cause they would receive different amounts of compression that way and sound different. maybe just a normalize next time?


I haven't managed to convince myself if i hear a timing difference or not yet.

I never looked into the mpc60, what is the sample rate/bit depth? (I know that's a lazy question ).[/quote

yeah not sure i hear a timing difference. I should also point out that the samples were loaded into the 2500 via usb. I then took the output from the 2500 and fed it into the 60 with the levels just a touch below clipping. The a/d conversion is going to add it's own sonic signature to the drum sounds on the 60 whereas the 2500 playing back exactly what I put into it.

D