Compression with KEY INPUTS?

Wdup. My hommie was putting me on to a compression technique using key inputs. For example, set up a compressor on a sustained instrument, like strings, or maybe a looped sample. The Key Input trigger on that channel's compressor would be a single bus carrying in the kick and snare. He told me this would give me that full, breathy, premier-esque sound. It does work a bit, but seems less effective than just using a limiter or vintage compressor on the entire mix. Am I doing something wrong? Anybody got tips on attack/release times, or adjustments to this key input technique?
Much oblidged,

tru peezy

There are tricks you can do like that using gates.
Set up a track on your recorder (PT, etc.) with a "tone generator" plug-in making a low tone (around 45-55 hz) and set up your kick drum track to trigger the gate opening on your tone track. The result will be an extra low sub-tone added to your kick drum.

Yeah, man, that's something I'm into doing, but I haven't tried it with the oscillator yet, only a synth loop. I'll give it a whirl. I am really trying to get some info on this compression technique, tho'...

I use this technique a lot, it's called ducking, it will really help open up a bass heavy mix by letting the kick come through without being drowned out by the bassline. It's also a cool trick for that stutter effect you hear a lot in techno/d&b music.

I've never used it on loops or strings(unless it's a deep string acting as a bass and only if it's fighting with the kick for space in the mix). As I said before, I mainly use it on basslines. The kick triggers the compressor on the bassline in effect making the bassline "duck" under the kick, it's a sublte effect but it can really open up a muddy low end. As for the stutter effect, it can really make a synth pad stutter effect sound smooth and clean. This works by recording a click(or any fast attack sound, hi hat, percussion) for whatever timing effect you want(16th notes for example) and having the click trigger a gate on the synth pad. It takes the the sustained synth track and gates the sound whenever the click hits creating a smooth or course stutter depending on how you have the gate setup.

As for settings for the ducking effect it realy depends on how the track was recorded and how hard or soft you want the duck to be. Just experiment and use your ears, that's the one thing about software(especially Pro Tools), it looks so damn pretty that you tend to start mixing with your eyes instead of your ears.

where do you boys learn how to do all this fancy stuff.
i mean im just starting to get to grips with mixing and mastering in pro tools but I have no mentor as such i just experiment.
the ducking technique is innovative im gonna use it tonight....

Coocoo, so, you make the Key Input on the bass compressor or ducker read the kick, is that right? Then fiddle around til it breathes the way you want it? Sounds official. I'ma experiment.

just laid a beat, used pretty standard settings for compression for kick drums on my compressor. however i ran all the sounds through the same compression settings and just letall the sounds fly through the compression settings for the kick as i was making my beat, finally i finished my loop, pressed they key and key input buttons on my compressor and the bass and kick interacted perfectly with each other, i lost some of the clarity on the melody, but i knew that would happen, i was just experimenting, but it gave the beat a really mid 90s pete rock feel, sample was clean, just a little muffled, low end and bass were nice, the hats were a bit muddy, but it worked. just to hear the translation in my car, i recorded straight through the mpc, through the compressor, to cool edit, so it recorded sort of low because i didnt really amplify anything, but i noticed that the levels of the kick drums stood out when you look at the sound file on cool edit, even moreso than the kicks, and it was really punchy. honestly, if i just recorded track by track, adjusted each tracks volumes to make sure they had the highest possible output, i wouldve had a pretty damn smooth mix on my hands, and that would be with zero eq or anything, just all the sounds going through the same compressor settings at once with they key input triggered.

Mad Tips...

PROPS:::

trupro wrote:Coocoo, so, you make the Key Input on the bass compressor or ducker read the kick, is that right? Then fiddle around til it breathes the way you want it? Sounds official. I'ma experiment.

Here's the way I set it up in Pro Tools:

Insert a mono aux track> insert the compressor on the aux track(bring the fader to unity gain)> change the input on the aux track to a free bus channel(bus 2 for example)> change the output on the kick track to a free bus channel(bus 1 for example)> in the track send menu on the bass track send the signal to bus 2(aux track)bring the fader to unity gain> change the key input to the output bus you selected for the kick track(bus 1)> click on the external key on the compressor to activate the the sidechain> click on key listen so you can hear the kick> adjust to taste, I would suggest fast attack and release settings and play with the threshold until it sounds cool to you. Remember it's supposed to be subtle but there are no rules, do whatever sounds good to your ears. The main idea here is to create a tight feel between the bass and the kick.

I'm wondering, real quick, why wouldn't I just put a compressor directly on the track rather than running it through the separate aux. If the output is set to go thru an aux, isn't that the same?

I retract my previous question..I understand the nature of the operation, to be able to
key listen, without having 2 kick channels going...F*#%ing awesome...Thanx

you can also just put the compressor on the string or bass track, then send the kik to the key input of the compressor. no key listen but less bussing.

6 in one hand, a half dozen in the other...

With the aux track you can also add the same effect to multiple tracks if neccessary without using up cpu power. This doesn't apply as much to this particular technique but really comes in handy for reverbs and delays which are very cpu intensive. For example if you have a vocal with four overdubs(I like thick vocals) and want to apply a nice reverb or delay to all five tracks you can just send all of em' to an aux track with a reverb plug in instead of running five reverbs which would really tax your system performance.

would you put a reverb directly on the track? i have never done that, i always send it to a reverb bus. but i know what you are saying. i do that with vocals by putting a eq and compressor on the aux then route all the vox thru that vox bus. nice cpu saver.

this is a refreshing thread. its nice to talk about other things than zip drives and whats a good compressor for under $100, etc...

mesh wrote:this is a refreshing thread. its nice to talk about other things than zip drives and whats a good compressor for under $100, etc...

I agree totally..